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What morals and ethics do Christians and other religions follow over time?

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member

Th Moral Foundations Theory is interesting as the descriptive evolution of morals and ethics in human history, and to a degree I agree with it. One point I disagree with is the statement that the morals and ethics are ;so different.' The pattern of the evolution of morals and ethics is similar in all cultures since the Neolithic.

One of the points I want to make is the evolution of morals and ethics over the history of humanity is universal with humanity and cannot be attributed to the standard of morals and ethics of any one religion nor culture.

The Bah'i Faith teaches that the morals and ethics of humanity spiritually evolve by progressive Revelation, and spiritual evolution within the minds of humanity, but objectively it could be the natural evolution morals and ethics of humanity. Nonetheless I believe they are becoming more similar in their diversity.
 

halbhh

The wonder and awe of "all things".
Needs further explanation, because this response is too vague.

We see all the time laws are passed to try to change behavior, not to only confirm the universal behavior.

That's only observation: the reality of what we see in the world as new laws are passed.

But, new laws must always be small baby steps upward -- or else they will not be followed.

If they are huge steps, it isn't practical to be able to do them in a given economy/culture at a moment in time.

Therefore to end slavery in ancient world, it was required, unavoidable, that the laws had to be small steps, incremental small changes. First you'd regulate how slaves could be treated, a new law that limited and ended some common practices at the time. That new law would then take time to become widely followed, requiring local cultures to age out. The men that grew up mistreating slaves would be hard to change, but their children would notice the new law, and then decide to adopt the new way....
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Bible believing Christians do, or at least should.



Matthew 22:36-40 New International Version (NIV)
36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’a]">[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’b]">[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” - through Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 22:36-40 - New International Version

There you have it, from the horses mouth.

. . . but there is not a law forbidding slavery.
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
What??? It is considered by Christians to be standard of moral and ethical truth. It is obvious that it is not intended to be the fulfillment of all truth.

If it were the fulfillment of all Truth, for all time, it would, for example, explain the afterlife in detail.

There are a hundred-million other questions humanity could come up with that are not explained in the scriptures.

...The scriptures ar only the beginning.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
If it were the fulfillment of all Truth, for all time, it would, for example, explain the afterlife in detail.

There are a hundred-million other questions humanity could come up with that are not explained in the scriptures.

...The scriptures ar only the beginning.

None of this is remotely addressing the questions at hand.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
There's also not a law regarding the sexuality of hermaphrodites in detail. Plus a hundred-million more.

There are many millions of slaves involved here in history that suffer life times of degrading and humiliating abuse. The above is trivial pursuit, please address the matter of fact issues here.

This not a matter of de-tails. That is the department of my dogs.
 
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shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
We see all the time laws are passed to try to change behavior, not to only confirm the universal behavior.

That's only observation: the reality of what we see in the world as new laws are passed.

But, new laws must always be small baby steps upward -- or else they will not be followed.

If they are huge steps, it isn't practical to be able to do them in a given economy/culture at a moment in time.

Therefore to end slavery in ancient world, it was required, unavoidable, that the laws had to be small steps, incremental small changes. First you'd regulate how slaves could be treated, a new law that limited and ended some common practices at the time. That new law would then take time to become widely followed, requiring local cultures to age out. The men that grew up mistreating slaves would be hard to change, but their children would notice the new law, and then decide to adopt the new way....

This is in a way addresses the topic that morals and ethics and standards of behavior evolved over the whole history of humanity, and not the standard of any one religion or culture.

The question is whether it is a product of the Divine evolution of humanity or is it strictly a natural process of human evolution. or both?
 

halbhh

The wonder and awe of "all things".
This is in a way addresses the topic that morals and ethics and standards of behavior evolved over the whole history of humanity, and not the standard of any one religion or culture.
One thing that would be leading is when a nation had new steps (particular details) that are a progress (small step) in laws other contemporaneous nearby nations do not yet.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
One thing that would be leading is when a nation had new steps (particular details) that are a progress (small step) in laws other contemporaneous nearby nations do not yet.

What you are stating is natural view again. You already stated this view and I responded. This adds nothing new. The subject addresses more the fact that the morals and ethics of humanity evolved over time and are not the standards of any one religion. In fact the morals and ethics of any one ancient religion today do not represent an adequate standard for the contemporary world.
 
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shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
You are begging the question here assuming that morals simply 'evolve' naturally.

Historical evidence also shows very clearly that you cannot isolate 'culture' from religion, and simply say that 'Christianity followed'.



Wrong area of focus.

Looking at what happened to 'most Christians' is far less meaningful than looking at what actually drove the successful abolitionist movements.

Anthony Benezet’s propaganda campaign had its most pronounced impact in Great Britain. Nowhere else among the major slave-trading powers did a popular, public campaign against the traders emerge. That this campaign crystallized in Britain at the close of the eighteenth century might seem odd at first glance. In the second half of the eighteenth century, British merchants were the leading slave traders in the Atlantic world. There were good commercial and political reasons to favour a continuation of the trade.

Antislavery sentiments, moreover, did not always lead to antislavery commitments. That seems to be one lesson that arises from the history of antislavery thought in France, where there was a critique of the trade’s inhumanity but only the most minimal attempt to address it (Seeber, 1937; Miller, 2008).

It would be a mistake also to attribute the new antislavery campaigns to the cultural consequences of merchant capitalism, as the historian Thomas Haskell once proposed, given the complete absence of abolitionist organizing in the Netherlands, where merchant capitalism was strong (Bender, 1992).

A number of historians have detailed how the first British abolition campaign came to fruition in the 1780s – the Quaker petition to the House of Commons calling for abolition, the alliance between Quakers and Evangelicals that culminated in the formation of the London Committee for Effecting the Abolition of the Slave Trade in 1787, and the series of investigations and debates in parliament that raised and then thwarted hopes before the somewhat sudden achievement of abolition in 1807 (Anstey, 1975; Oldfield, 1995; Jennings, 1997).

Only recently, however, has the prior transition from antislavery thought to antislavery action received close scrutiny. The formation of antislavery commitments in the British Isles during the 1780s depended in part upon the changing politics of empire that attended the expansion of British dominions after the Seven Years’ War and the loss of 13 North American colonies in the American Revolution.

A new concern developed in this period that imperial practices needed to be assessed against the standards of virtue and liberty. Among Quakers in England, and among aspiring young reformers within the Church of England, Thomas Clarkson and William Wilberforce most notably, turning the nation against the Atlantic slave trade looked to be one way to improve the moral character of overseas enterprise and to foster a greater commitment to religion at home (Brown, 2006: pt III, IV).”

Heuman, G, Burnard, T. - The Routledge History of Slavery

ever implied 'Christianity followed.' Yes, there were movements in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam against slavery, but it remains a fact of history that Christians widely bought, sold, and owned slaves up until the 19th century, and there was no law against slavery in the Bible. The ancient Jews bought, sold and owned foreign slaves and there is now law in the OT prohibiting slavery. Yes the Koran also did not forbid slavery and they owned, sold, and bought slaves,
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
There are many millions of slaves involved here in history that suffer life times of degrading and humiliating abuse. The above is trivial pursuit, please address the matter of fact issues here.

This not a matter of de-tails. That is the department of my dogs.

The bible, alone, is insufficient in it's guidance abilities, which can be proved time and time again and across various cultures. If you cannot accept that there is more to spirituality than what many claim this book seems to possess, then that shows your problem.
 
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Cooky

Veteran Member
ever implied 'Christianity followed.' Yes, there were movements in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam against slavery, but it remains a fact of history that Christians widely bought, sold, and owned slaves up until the 19th century, and there was no law against slavery in the Bible. The ancient Jews bought, sold and owned foreign slaves and there is now law in the OT prohibiting slavery. Yes the Koran also did not forbid slavery and they owned, sold, and bought slaves,

Muslims took hundreds of thousands of slaves out of Europe and into Muslim countries... And the practice of slavery in Islam continues today..! And they too, are textual literalists. Hence the problem.

...Text-only religionism constrains the conscience and prevents spiritual development. The end result is typically widespread cultural and social turmoil.
 
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shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Muslims took hundreds of thousands of slaves out of Europe and into Muslim countries... And the practice of slavery in Islam continues today..! And they too, are textual literalists. Hence the problem.

Yes the problem of clinging to ancient religions.

...Text-only religionism constrains the conscience and prevents spiritual development.

Christians took thousands of slaves out of Africa
 

Cooky

Veteran Member
Yes the problem of clinging to ancient religions.

Christians took thousands of slaves out of Africa

Exactly. Both Islam and Christianity are largely text-only religions, whose adherants are discouraged from exercising the use of their own moral conscience...In exchange for textual religionism as the unconditional replacement. With a lack use, their moral conscience weakens and an array of negative effects result from that.
 
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shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
The bible, alone, is insufficient in it's guidance abilities, which can be proved time and time again and across various cultures. If you cannot accept that there is more to spirituality than what many claim this book seems to possess, then that shows your problem.

No it is the problem of millions that looked to Bible for moral and ethical guidance and owned slaves.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Exactly. Both Islam and Christianity are largely text-only religions, who are discouraged from exercising the use of their own moral conscience... In exchange for textual religionism as the unconditional replacement. With a lack use, their moral conscience weakens and an array of negative effects result from that.

This the problem with clinging to ancient religions that lack the guidance for the contemporary world like the Roman Church.
 
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