Sin is simply doing something that God does not agree with. He doesn't agree with it because it is always harmful to us or others in some way.
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which religions are joyless
- Thread starter Terrywoodenpic
- Start date
Sin is simply doing something that God does not agree with. He doesn't agree with it because it is always harmful to us or others in some way.
I agree and disagree. I agree that most gods are out there, in some form for the various faiths, particularly in the case of Hinduism. I disagree that sin is associated with pleasure. Almost all sins are designed to promote one to NOT have pleasure. I know some Christians who firmly believe that the only position for sex is the missionary and strongly argue against oral sex in any form. Sin is something I strongly believe was conceived by these faiths to keep people in line with whatever rules the faith may have or have had. As for God and creation, I believe in evolution. There is just too much evidence that we evolved. The newest being that cave in South Africa which I find totally fascinating. A third evolutionary link as it were. And why can't God be big enough to have stirred the pot of evolution but still be big enough to have many faces?
MrMrdevincamus
Voice Of The Martyrs Supporter
Yes, I was going to mention the internal nature of Joy but couldn't get my thoughts right this morning! I suppose its time for the 1st cup of coffee, eh?
How do you know for a fact that God doesn't agree with something? And what is wrong with stealing from a garden when one's children are starving? What is harmful about that? Or harmful about white lies that keep a person's confidence up and not delving into depression?
MrMrdevincamus
Voice Of The Martyrs Supporter
EXCERPT>>>>>
Hi Jo. The bible is not easy to read for many reasons. I had forgotten how difficult it was until I began reading in its entirety another difficult document , ie the Koran and related writings. Sin to the christian mind is simply an immoral act or one that goes against the teachings of Jesus or God. Being religious means we try or should try to live by those teachings. Engaging in some sinful acts can be serious or more serious than committing an capital offense of mans law. Also knowing what is sinful and what isn't gives Christians moral guidelines, and an 'reality anchor' (my words for a way to compare or decide what is right and wrong). Most serious sinful behavior has counterparts in the rule of western law. Examples of serious sins; Committing adultery, murder, stealing, and giving false witness, slander and others.
<<<<<<<<<EXCERPT
Hi Jo. The bible is not easy to read for many reasons. I had forgotten how difficult it was until I began reading in its entirety another difficult document , ie the Koran and related writings. Sin to the christian mind is simply an immoral act or one that goes against the teachings of Jesus or God. Being religious means we try or should try to live by those teachings. Engaging in some sinful acts can be serious or more serious than committing an capital offense of mans law. Also knowing what is sinful and what isn't gives Christians moral guidelines, and an 'reality anchor' (my words for a way to compare or decide what is right and wrong). Most serious sinful behavior has counterparts in the rule of western law. Examples of serious sins; Committing adultery, murder, stealing, and giving false witness, slander and others.
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MrMrdevincamus
Voice Of The Martyrs Supporter
We know what Gods will is by his words i.e. the bible. Also, farmers were instructed in scripture to leave 'gleanings', which is leaving crops in the fields for the poor and hungry.....(below) An example of God saying to leave food for the poor and others~
Leviticus 23:22
And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not make clean riddance of the corners of thy field when thou reapest, neither shalt thou gather any gleaning of thy harvest: thou shalt leave them unto the poor, and to the stranger: I am the LORD your God.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Buddhism is terribly joyless! We are obsessed with suffering and we spend all day staring into the void, we have no sense of humour at all.. 
MrMrdevincamus
Voice Of The Martyrs Supporter
Buddhism is terribly joyless! We are obsessed with suffering and we spend all day staring into the void, we have no sense of humour at all..
Life is pain eh? Been there done that...
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
The law found in the Bible for us to follow is there for our own wellbeing... If a person steals due to starvation I don't think God will judge them harshly
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
God might well question the actions of the man that did not give to the starving poor, so that stealing was not necessary.The law found in the Bible for us to follow is there for our own wellbeing... If a person steals due to starvation I don't think God will judge them harshly
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Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
not quite as simple as that. Most sins have been put into God's mouth by men., for their own benefit.
It is perhaps better to think of sins as those actions that harm other people or God's creation.
If they do no harm they are not sins.
Absolutely right. A person could be held responsible for a persons death if they had the opportunity to help. The details of judgement I trust to God though.
True
but how do we know what's best for us? In the short term and the long term, we aren't wise enough to be able to foretell the outcome of allowing one thing or another. Thus, I choose to simply trust God to guide me in what's right.
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
This basket full of bliss feels your pain. It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it, eh?Buddhism is terribly joyless! We are obsessed with suffering and we spend all day staring into the void, we have no sense of humour at all..
I really like this idea, Terry. Why is it that people feel we are just not good enough as we are? The idea being that most people are simply "good" people. I don't understand the need or twisted desire to micromanage the behavior of the ordinary person. Is orthodoxy the bane of joy? @Terrywoodenpic
To drawn an analogy, I appreciate a need for structure or rules and they are necessary to a degree, but one must also appreciate when the rules are no longer necessary. For example, when building a chair or a table, you MUST follow certain basic rules. You need to start off with a simple drawing with the measurements required. Double check to make sure it all works. Then you get your wood or whatever material and measure it 3 times first and then make your cuts once. After mock up, to ensure the pieces all fit together, one makes tiny adjustments and proceeds to the sanding stage. It's at this stage that one can toss aside the construction rules.
From this point you still need to follow surfacing rules, and finishing rules, but that is very much a mood thing or a creative thing. You need to follow the proper procedures for any given finish, but again you have a huge amount of leeway on how you want to finish, how smooth you want the surfaces to be, what stain or no stain, glue or nails, glue and nails, etc...
What I trying to say is that one needs to understand why the rules exist and from there one has considerable leeway on how to apply or ignore given rules. The rules are important, but understanding is the key. Am I babbling or does that make sense? I'm thinking of one carpenter from yesteryear who might like the analogy.
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Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Oh definitely. Some people take themselves FAR too seriously and disappear up their own bottoms.
Terrywoodenpic
Oldest Heretic
This basket full of bliss feels your pain. It's a dirty job, but someone has to do it, eh?
I really like this idea, Terry. Why is it that people feel we are just not good enough as we are? The idea being that most people are simply "good" people. I don't understand the need or twisted desire to micromanage the behavior of the ordinary person. Is orthodoxy the bane of joy? @Terrywoodenpic
To drawn an analogy, I appreciate a need for structure or rules and they are necessary to a degree, but one must also appreciate when the rules are no longer necessary. For example, when building a chair or a table, you MUST follow certain basic rules. You need to start off with a simple drawing with the measurements required. Double check to make sure it all works. Then you get your wood or whatever material and measure it 3 times first and then make your cuts once. After mock up, to ensure the pieces all fit together, one makes tiny adjustments and proceeds to the sanding stage. It's at this stage that one can toss aside the construction rules.
From this point you still need to follow surfacing rules, and finishing rules, but that is very much a mood thing or a creative thing. You need to follow the proper procedures for any given finish, but again you have a huge amount of leeway on how you want to finish, how smooth you want the surfaces to be, what stain or no stain, glue or nails, glue and nails, etc...
What I trying to say is that one needs to understand why the rules exist and from there one has considerable leeway on how to apply or ignore given rules. The rules are important, but understanding is the key. Am I babbling or does that make sense? I'm thinking of one carpenter from yesteryear who might like the analogy.
Rules are for the ignorant And thoughtless. When you truly understand the implications they are no longer necessary. But will probably still be followed.
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
You know that reminds me of something I've said a number of times over the years. Laws aren't made for people like me. Here I mean the "Laws of the land", as it were. The point is that, by my very nature, I don't "break" those laws, as a rule (pun intended). The laws are in place to curb the behaviors of those who cannot exercise good personal judgment for whatever reason. In some ways, if people could embrace their natural joy, their natural grace, they would move more effortlessly through life because they would not need to pay attention to what they are doing that might be wrong. If they are in tune with their natural grace/joy they would not be doing anything wrong to begin with... well, not too much that really matters.
I'm unsure if that's more a matter with the modern Western difficulty with facing the reality of death rather than an issue of Christianity itself. My mom was Catholic and she passed away in a hospice this January, and she signed a DNR order. My sister, who lives on the other side of the country and who didn't have to deal with it in a direct way, was more upset about that than I was. I just wanted her suffering to end. I mentioned to a nurse at the hospice that what my mom was going through makes me wish that euthanasia was legal in those contexts.
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