Does Shari'a really call for executing homosexuals?

[Meow Mix]

Does it? I read about this in a thread from a Muslim friend, but I want to know if that's just one interpretation of Shari'a law or if any Shari'a law successfully implemented would indeed execute homosexuals?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I don't see how it matters. I think that the people who do horrible things in the name of Islam are sincere in their faith. It makes little difference to try and correct them with an alternative interpretation of Islamic law.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Here you go:

LGBT topics and Islam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Meow Mix]

I don't see how it matters. I think that the people who do horrible things in the name of Islam are sincere in their faith. It makes little difference to try and correct them with an alternative interpretation of Islamic law.

Well I just want to know for the sake of knowing, so I never stumble into a country trying to implement Shari'a and get murdered. Also so I can form a decision on what I think of Shari'a law.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Well I just want to know for the sake of knowing, so I never stumble into a country trying to implement Shari'a and get murdered. Also so I can form a decision on what I think of Shari'a law.

haha - Just stay out of Iran and you should be ok.

 

[crimsonlung]

I don't see how it matters. I think that the people who do horrible things in the name of Islam are sincere in their faith. It makes little difference to try and correct them with an alternative interpretation of Islamic law.

What makes you think that people who do Horrible things are sincere in their faith when the Quran is against it?

You do realize the Bible is 100 times more violent then the Quran right? And I am not exaggerating. Want to have a verse war? You will lose, I assure you. Just for starters, here are 1199 verses in the Bible that are violent:

Cruelty and Violence

What does this tell us? Its culture, NOT religion.

Keep your anti-islamic poison spewing to yourself when your clearly clueless on your own faith.

 

[Meow Mix]

What makes you think that people who do Horrible things are sincere in their faith when the Quran is against it?

You do realize the Bible is 100 times more violent then the Quran right? And I am not exaggerating. Want to have a verse war? You will lose, I assure you. Just for starters, here are 1199 verses in the Bible that are violent:

Cruelty and Violence

What does this tell us? Its culture, NOT religion.

Keep your anti-islamic poison spewing to yourself when your clearly clueless on your own faith.

To be fair I've never seen angellous spewing anti-Islamic rhetoric; only making fair statements against those who abuse(d) Islam. But furthermore, I've also seen angellous make fair statements against those who abuse(d) Christianity. So, I don't think he was trying to get a "leg up" on Islam, it seems to me that he just mentioned those who abuse Islam because that was pertinant to this thread. Seems he didn't mention those who abuse Christianity because that is not pertinant to this thread.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

To be fair I've never seen angellous spewing anti-Islamic rhetoric; only making fair statements against those who abuse(d) Islam. But furthermore, I've also seen angellous make fair statements against those who abuse(d) Christianity. So, I don't think he was trying to get a "leg up" on Islam, it seems to me that he just mentioned those who abuse Islam because that was pertinant to this thread. Seems he didn't mention those who abuse Christianity because that is not pertinant to this thread.

:foryou:

 

[Alceste]

haha - Just stay out of Iran and you should be ok.

Yes: Iran: Two More Executions for Homosexual Conduct | Human Rights Watch

And Cameroon
Criminalizing Identities | Human Rights Watch

And Uganda, Burundi, Saudi Arabia...

 

[crimsonlung]

To be fair I've never seen angellous spewing anti-Islamic rhetoric; only making fair statements against those who abuse(d) Islam. But furthermore, I've also seen angellous make fair statements against those who abuse(d) Christianity. So, I don't think he was trying to get a "leg up" on Islam, it seems to me that he just mentioned those who abuse Islam because that was pertinant to this thread and those who abuse Christianity were not pertinant to this thread.

His quote:

people who do horrible things in the name of Islam are sincere in their faith

First of all, we are assuming executing homosexuals is horrible. I personally think its horrible, but, in another country, its normal. Regardless, the word "horrible" is used to negatively project the Islamic faith as a whole when in fact, the reason you read the article, was because its a rarity. This doesn't happen everyday. You wouldn't of read it on the MSN front page if it was an every day occurrence, and not only that, a small percentage of the entire continent would say this isn't horrible. So, what if I were to say all Christians were Jesus freak fanatics that try to convert everyone?

Its this mindeset that keeps this stereotypical fear of Muslims in the world.

Its ignorance.

 

[Meow Mix]

His quote:



First of all, we are assuming executing homosexuals is horrible. I personally think its horrible, but, in another country, its normal. Regardless, the word "horrible" is used to negatively project the Islamic faith as a whole when in fact, the reason you read the article, was because its a rarity. This doesn't happen everyday. You wouldn't of read it on the MSN front page if it was an every day occurrence, and not only that, a small percentage of the entire continent would say this isn't horrible. So, what if I were to say all Christians were Jesus freak fanatics that try to convert everyone?

Its this mindeset that keeps this stereotypical fear of Muslims in the world.

Its ignorance.

When I read angellous's statement I see "people who do X" as only those people who do X, not the whole group that those people identify with. "I believe people who do horrible things for Islam are sincere in their faith" = "It seems to me that those few people who do commit atrocities are really believing that what they're doing is right."

There is NOTHING in angellous's statement that reflects on all Muslims or all of Islam. It's no different than me saying "I believe the Westboro Baptist Church are sincere in their faith when they do horrible things." That's not me saying anything about all Christians or all Christianity but JUST that I believe they THINK they're being sincere when they spew their hate.

I strongly believe that you're misreading angellous, I'm just saying. You're perceiving prejudice in his statement that isn't there, as evidenced by him agreeing with my summarization.

In any case, the reason I asked is because someone was saying that if true Shari'a were implemented anywhere that it would include harsh punishments for homosexuality including "execution": I wanted to find out if that's true or if that's just one interpretation of Shari'a.

 

[Autodidact]

What makes you think that people who do Horrible things are sincere in their faith when the Quran is against it?

You do realize the Bible is 100 times more violent then the Quran right? And I am not exaggerating. Want to have a verse war? You will lose, I assure you. Just for starters, here are 1199 verses in the Bible that are violent:

Cruelty and Violence

What does this tell us? Its culture, NOT religion.

Keep your anti-islamic poison spewing to yourself when your clearly clueless on your own faith.

This thread isn't about the Bible, it's about Sharia law. And Meow Mix is atheist.

So asking about Sharia law is anti-Islamic? Why?

Let me get this. Muslims are killing gay people, but your concern is not for the people being killed, but to protect the people doing the killing? Wow.

 

[Autodidact]

First of all, we are assuming executing homosexuals is horrible.

Yes, at least those of us who are not barbaric monsters are assuming that. WTF? Do we need a thread about whether it's a good or bad thing to kill people because of whom they love? Maybe you're right, considering what's going on in Uganda, maybe we do.

 

[Autodidact]

His quote:



First of all, we are assuming executing homosexuals is horrible. I personally think its horrible, but, in another country, its normal. Regardless, the word "horrible" is used to negatively project the Islamic faith as a whole when in fact, the reason you read the article, was because its a rarity. This doesn't happen everyday. You wouldn't of read it on the MSN front page if it was an every day occurrence, and not only that, a small percentage of the entire continent would say this isn't horrible. So, what if I were to say all Christians were Jesus freak fanatics that try to convert everyone?

Its this mindeset that keeps this stereotypical fear of Muslims in the world.

Its ignorance.

Oh, I see, they only slaughtered a few *******, so it's no big deal. Much more important to protect the good name of Muslims than to worry about a couple of dead queers. After all, they're disgusting perverts anyway, so who cares if some Muslim governments execute them?

 

[Autodidact]

Apparently some people feel that if you say anything that could be construed as critical of Islam or Muslims, even just asking for the truth, that's bigotry and Islamaphobia. At the same time, if Muslims are killing people because they don't like what kind of sex they have, that's really nothing to be concerned about. The important thing, which must be borne in mind at all times, is that Islam and Muslims are absolutely immune from criticism.

 

[crimsonlung]

When I read angellous's statement I see "people who do X" as only those people who do X, not the whole group that those people identify with. "I believe people who do horrible things for Islam are sincere in their faith" = "It seems to me that those few people who do commit atrocities are really believing that what they're doing is right."

There is NOTHING in angellous's statement that reflects on all Muslims or all of Islam. It's no different than me saying "I believe the Westboro Baptist Church are sincere in their faith when they do horrible things." That's not me saying anything about all Christians or all Christianity but JUST that I believe they THINK they're being sincere when they spew their hate.

I strongly believe that you're misreading angellous, I'm just saying. You're perceiving prejudice in his statement that isn't there, as evidenced by him agreeing with my summarization.

In any case, the reason I asked is because someone was saying that if true Shari'a were implemented anywhere that it would include harsh punishments for homosexuality including "execution": I wanted to find out if that's true or if that's just one interpretation of Shari'a.

Your right, I apologize, I misread his statement. And to answer the question:

Nowhere do I see execution of homosexuals. it is most definetly looked down upon and in all excerpts I have read, the punishment is handled by god. Here are a few:

"We also sent Lut: He said to his people: Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds. And his people gave no answer but this: they said, "Drive them out of your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!"" (Qur'an 7:80-82)

"Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males, And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)! They said: "If thou desist not, O Lut! thou wilt assuredly be cast out!" He said: "I do detest your doings:" "O my Lord! deliver me and my family from such things as they do!" So We delivered him and his family,- all Except an old woman who lingered behind. But the rest We destroyed utterly. We rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): and evil was the shower on those who were admonished (but heeded not)! Verily in this is a Sign: but most of them do not believe. And verily thy Lord is He, the Exalted in Might, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 26:165-175)

"Would ye really approach men in your lusts rather than women? Nay, ye are a people (grossly) ignorant! But his people gave no other answer but this: They said, "Drive out the followers of Lut from your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!" But We saved him and his family, except his wife; her We destined to be of those who lagged behind. And We rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): and evil was the shower on those who were admonished (but heeded not)!" (Qur'an 27:55-58)

"And (remember) Lut: behold, he said to his people: "Ye do commit lewdness, such as no people in Creation (ever) committed before you. Do ye indeed approach men, and cut off the highway? - and practise wickedness (even) in your councils?" But his people gave no answer but this: they said: "Bring us the Wrath of Allah if thou tellest the truth." (Qur'an 29:28-29)

"If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way. If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 4:15-16)

 

[crimsonlung]

Oh, I see, they only slaughtered a few *******, so it's no big deal. Much more important to protect the good name of Muslims than to worry about a couple of dead queers. After all, they're disgusting perverts anyway, so who cares if some Muslim governments execute them?

You do realize we kill people for less right? The whole war in Afghanistan and Iraq is fueled by oil. I'd rather homosexuals who are breaking the laws set in their respective countries die then innocent women and children just because you want to drive you gas guzzling SUV 2 blocks down the street to work.

 

[Meow Mix]

In the last one:

"If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way. If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 4:15-16)"

Why do the women get put in a house until they die but the men get a chance to repent? Or does the offer to repent go for either of them?

Also if someone is put in a house until they die, do they get food? Is this basically saying "Leave the homosexuals in a prison cell to die of starvation and thirst?"

 

[Meow Mix]

You do realize we kill people for less right? The whole war in Afghanistan and Iraq is fueled by oil. I'd rather homosexuals who are breaking the laws set in their respective countries die then innocent women and children.

But those homosexuals are innocent men and women, since homosexuality doesn't harm anyone.

 

[crimsonlung]

In the last one:

"If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way. If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 4:15-16)"

Why do the women get put in a house until they die but the men get a chance to repent? Or does the offer to repent go for either of them?

Also if someone is put in a house until they die, do they get food? Is this basically saying "Leave the homosexuals in a prison cell to die of starvation and thirst?"

The offer to repent goes for either, but you will see things like this throughout the Quran which is a major reason I left Islam, women are treated at half the rate as a man. And yes, I do believe they are to be locked up until dead, if they receive food or water, I have no idea.