Which Choice Best Describes Your Faith (or lack thereof)?

[Deidre]

How can you (the subject) know whether it's a placebo effect?

Because I felt it, and this may sound crazy, but...it changed me. The experience, I mean.

With the placebo, there would be no change in the subject, only the idea of change. Like taking a placebo for a headache, and then you 'feel' better, but you are convincing yourself of it. Eventually, your headache will come back, though.

 

[Saint_of_Me]

it isn't a placebo effect. i stopped believing for a time. for me to come back to Christianity, that's not a placebo.

who knows, maybe you will START believing.

(and it's effects, with an e) Sorry, that's a pet peeve of mine.

Wrong.

I am a word nerd too.

When used the second time, as I did, "affect" is the correct derivation of the word effect.

From Webster's.......

f·fect1
əˈfekt/
verb

1. have an effect on; make a difference to.
   ealth"
   synonyms: have an effect on, influence, act on, work on, have an impact "the dampness began to affect my hon, impact.
   
   • touch the feelings of (someone); move emotionally.
     "the atrocities he witnessed have affected him most deeply"
     synonyms: move, touch, make an impression on, hit (hard), tug at someone's heartstrings.

Also...no, don't hold your breath for me to become a Believer. I've been there, when I was a kid and didn't know any better. But now I have grown up and seen the Light.

As your St. Paul said, I "put away childish things."

 

[Deidre]

Wrong.

I am a word nerd too.

When used the second time, as I did, "affect" is the correct derivation of the word effect.

From Webster's.......

f·fect1
əˈfekt/
verb

1. have an effect on; make a difference to.
   ealth"
   synonyms: have an effect on, influence, act on, work on, have an impact "the dampness began to affect my hon, impact.
   • touch the feelings of (someone); move emotionally.
     "the atrocities he witnessed have affected him most deeply"
     synonyms: move, touch, make an impression on, hit (hard), tug at someone's heartstrings.

Also...no, don't hold your breath for me to become a Believer. I've been there, when I was a kid and didn't know any better. But now I have grown up and seen the Light.

As your St. Paul said, I "put away childish things."

And so it begins.

When I left Christianity, there were Christians who scoffed at me, and now, going back to Christianity, there are atheists who scoff. Perhaps both sides have more in common than they realize.

 

[Saint_of_Me]

And so it begins.

When I left Christianity, there were Christians who scoffed at me, and now, going back to Christianity, there are atheists who scoff. Perhaps both sides have more in common than they realize.

Sure, why not? Maybe.

Just think of us atheists as folks who believe in one less god than you do. LOL

 

[Deidre]

Sure, why not? Maybe.

Just think of us atheists as folks who believe in one less god than you do. LOL

Believe or don't believe in whatever you like.
It doesn't affect me. With an *a*.
^_^

 

[Saint_of_Me]

Believe or don't believe in whatever you like.
It doesn't affect me. With an *a*.
^_^

Too bad. I like to help people expand their potential and free themselves form the constrictive bonds of superstition. Or religion.

Which to me are synonymous.

With a "y".

LOL

 

[Deidre]

Too bad. I like to help people expand their potential and free themselves form the constrictive bonds of superstition. Or religion.

Which to me are synonymous.

With a "y".

LOL

haha This game of ping pong is fun.

First, it's not superstitions. It happened (to me). An experience of faith.

I identified as an atheist/agnostic, when I experienced it. That's why I feel it happened.

But, I don't need to convince you. In a way, when we try to convince others of things, any-thing really, it robs us of so much.

Anyyywaaayyyy....

 

[Saint_of_Me]

Believe or don't believe in whatever you like.
It doesn't affect me. With an *a*.
^_^

Deidre...You seem like a reasonably intelligent woman.

I humbly invite you to take a mere five or seven minutes out of your time to read this. Nothing to lose, and it just may change your life. Help you. A friend of mine wrote this article, and it echoes my own feelings on the subject.

Thank you in advance for your time, and interest. I would be very happy to get your take on it when you're done.

Best........SoM

http://www.alternet.org/story/143912/the_top_one_reason_religion_is_harmful

 

[Deidre]

Deidre...You seem like a reasonably intelligent woman.

I humbly invite you to take a mere five or seven minutes out of your time to read this. Nothing to lose, and it just may change your life. Help you. A friend of mine wrote this article, and it echoes my own feelings on the subject.

Thank you in advance for your time, and interest. I would be very happy to get your take on it when you're done.

Best........SoM

http://www.alternet.org/story/143912/the_top_one_reason_religion_is_harmful

I belong to atheist sites, and identified as one, so I know the 'arguments.' But, I will read it.

 

[Saint_of_Me]

haha This game of ping pong is fun.

First, it's not superstitions. It happened (to me). An experience of faith.

I identified as an atheist/agnostic, when I experienced it. That's why I feel it happened.

But, I don't need to convince you. In a way, when we try to convince others of things, any-thing really, it robs us of so much.

Anyyywaaayyyy....

I kinda see where you're going with the "it robs us of too much" when we attempt to convince others of our beliefs. But I am not sure I can totally agree.

I feel if we do it only to "be right" or to win the argument, due primarily to our sense of pride or ego, than yeah, you have a point, Deidre.

But if we calmly and sincerely present our facts, preferable from personal ecxperience, in an honest attempt to help somebody "come around" to a view that you really feel will benefit them, then no, I don't think we are really "robbed" of anything.

Rather, it can be a very fulfilling and enriching experience to help somebody.

This is what I do with religious folks. As a former believer and church-goer, I have seen too many times the harm and the crimp in our personal growth that Organized Religion--or even a belief in a Theist god--can bestow upon somebody. So I try to offer the benefits of my experience and help. Oh, some take this wrong, of that I harbor no delusions. I can come across as just naother arrogant atheist scientist. (Dawkins-esqu! LOL...Hmm..where have I heard that before?)

But rest assured my intentions are sincere.

 

[Saint_of_Me]

I belong to atheist sites, and identified as one, so I know the 'arguments.' But, I will read it.

Oh well, then you may not glean many new insights from the link if you are a veteran of atheist websites and Forums. But still, I appreciate your open mind in reading it. And you still could get something good out of it.

I am warming to you, Deidre! LOL..you seem to be a cut above the usual type of believer I deal with on these sort of Forums.

 

[Deidre]

I kinda see where you're going with the "it robs us of too much" when we attempt to convince others of our beliefs. But I am not sure I can totally agree.

I feel if we do it only to "be right" or to win the argument, due primarily to our sense of pride or ego, than yeah, you have a point, Deidre.

But if we calmly and sincerely present our facts, preferable from personal ecxperience, in an honest attempt to help somebody "come around" to a view that you really feel will benefit them, then no, I don't think we are really "robbed" of anything.

Rather, it can be a very fulfilling and enriching experience to help somebody.

This is what I do with religious folks. As a former believer and church-goer, I have seen too many times the harm and the crimp in our personal growth that Organized Religion--or even a belief in a Theist god--can bestow upon somebody. So I try to offer the benefits of my experience and help. Oh, some take this wrong, of that I harbor no delusions. I can come across as just naother arrogant atheist scientist. (Dawkins-esqu! LOL...Hmm..where have I heard that before?)

But rest assured my intentions are sincere.

Thank you for this, and I agree. I absolutely agree that religion can be harmful, and it can divide. One can form his/her own path with aspects of a faith or religion that resonates with them. The Bible isn't a book that can convince anyone of anything, and I don't believe there is any objective proof of the existence of a deity. But, to experience something is very different, and that is why I've returned to faith. Perhaps you could read about mysticism in Christianity and Islam, and you will see more of what I mean. Many religious people don't have experiences of faith, and it shows in how they treat others, etc. It is the experience of faith, that matters right now to me. I will bbl...and will read what you posted. Then, you should read something that I share with you. If you like.

 

[Deidre]

Oh well, then you may not glean many new insights from the link if you are a veteran of atheist websites and Forums. But still, I appreciate your open mind in reading it. And you still could get something good out of it.

I am warming to you, Deidre! LOL..you seem to be a cut above the usual type of believer I deal with on these sort of Forums.

Aw

 

[Saint_of_Me]

Thank you for this, and I agree. I absolutely agree that religion can be harmful, and it can divide. One can form his/her own path with aspects of a faith or religion that resonates with them. The Bible isn't a book that can convince anyone of anything, and I don't believe there is any objective proof of the existence of a deity. But, to experience something is very different, and that is why I've returned to faith. Perhaps you could read about mysticism in Christianity and Islam, and you will see more of what I mean. Many religious people don't have experiences of faith, and it shows in how they treat others, etc. It is the experience of faith, that matters right now to me. I will bbl...and will read what you posted. Then, you should read something that I share with you. If you like.

I have always felt the Bible to be NOT a book of answers, but rather a book of Questions. forcing us to think and ask ourselves the meaning of the stories. Those who read the Bible as an inerrant history book, as the Biblical Literalness do, are really missing the point. And a great irony is that they get far LESS out of it than those who read it as a Book of Questions, and who also know that much of it is allegory and metaphor and Never meant to be taken as literal truth. Always know that Mythos need not always be the same as fiction.

Besides, the bible was never even meant to be condensed into a single cohesive book. It's very name comes from the Greek, "biblia" meaning "small scrolls." It was written over the period of about 1200 years, by dozens of authors. But you probably know this.

I do enjoy some of the mystics. I have a Sufi friend (they are the mystics of Islam) and have enjoyed some of the books she has given me.

As far as Christian mystics, I am a big William Blake fan--mainly for his art! And I have enjoyed some writings from Meister Eckhart.

 

[Deidre]

Deidre...You seem like a reasonably intelligent woman.

I humbly invite you to take a mere five or seven minutes out of your time to read this. Nothing to lose, and it just may change your life. Help you. A friend of mine wrote this article, and it echoes my own feelings on the subject.

Thank you in advance for your time, and interest. I would be very happy to get your take on it when you're done.

Best........SoM

http://www.alternet.org/story/143912/the_top_one_reason_religion_is_harmful

Okay, I read it.
That's an interesting take, the one reason religion is harmful. I agree but anything is dangerous if left unchecked. Religion can be especially dangerous because it wants to float under the radar of criticism and when we see religious parents not seek medical treatment for their children in some cases, because they believe it goes against their religion, and the children die, etc...that is when legal law needs to step in. Religion should never ever usurp secular laws. My opinion. But, any organized group left unchecked has the potential to do harm. Power in numbers, so to speak.

 

[David1967]

Even the turning away you speak of can be a growing experience. Often times we don't realize just how important to us something is till we get away for a while and come to know what a good thing we are missing.

Thank you for this, and I agree. I absolutely agree that religion can be harmful, and it can divide. One can form his/her own path with aspects of a faith or religion that resonates with them. The Bible isn't a book that can convince anyone of anything, and I don't believe there is any objective proof of the existence of a deity. But, to experience something is very different, and that is why I've returned to faith. Perhaps you could read about mysticism in Christianity and Islam, and you will see more of what I mean. Many religious people don't have experiences of faith, and it shows in how they treat others, etc. It is the experience of faith, that matters right now to me. I will bbl...and will read what you posted. Then, you should read something that I share with you. If you like.

You are right. Religion can bring out the best or worse in a person, Its our choice which one. And I am familiar with Christian mysticism. I think as a whole it is a good thing. Anything that inspires us to a deeper contemplation of God, if entered into with a pure heart will draw us closer. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Deidre]

You are right. Religion can bring out the best or worse in a person, Its our choice which one. And I am familiar with Christian mysticism. I think as a whole it is a good thing. Anything that inspires us to a deeper contemplation of God, if entered into with a pure heart will draw us closer. Hope that makes sense.

Amen

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I haven't been on in awhile, so consider this my update answer.

I'm a strong atheist with an appreciation for philosophy. I consider myself a materialist and a humanist. I'm still favorable to aspects of Buddhism, and I like many of the ideas in Epicurean thought.

 

[David1967]

Amen

Speaking of Christian mysticism, I watched a program on television the other night, an episode of Global Spirit in which they were interviewing a Christian mystic monk, a Jewish Rabbi and a Sufi Muslim woman. All coming from the "mystic" point of view. Each one of their descriptions of coming closer to God were so familiar to all of them, they found nothing to disagree on. They were each nodding their heads and smiling. Such maturity in their faiths. I found that most interesting and inspiring. Three people from different religious backgrounds relating their experiences in an open respectful manner. Much we can learn from that...IMHO

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

And so it begins.

When I left Christianity, there were Christians who scoffed at me, and now, going back to Christianity, there are atheists who scoff. Perhaps both sides have more in common than they realize.

Bingo.

Atheists and theists...the differences are little more than linguistic.