What!!?

[Nakosis]

Ecclesiastes 3
12 I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live. 13 That each of them may eat and drink, and find satisfaction in all their toil—this is the gift of God. 14 I know that everything God does will endure forever; nothing can be added to it and nothing taken from it. God does it so that people will fear him.

 

[savagewind]

It means don't cuddle up to God.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

@Nakosis , try again and please endeavor to make your new effort at least marginally coherent.

 

[savagewind]

To fear God means do not endeavor to make God your friend. It means it is not an easy thing to make yourself God's friend.

 

[Ultimatum]

It's all one big ego-trip, is it not?
This omniscient God knows exactly what it feels like to be feared--without the need of heaving fearers. Therefore, why would he still put his worshippers through such emotion?

 

[savagewind]

It's all one big ego-trip, is it not?
This omniscient God knows exactly what it feels like to be feared--without the need of heaving fearers. Therefore, why would he still put his worshippers through such emotion?

Emotion is physical. God is a spirit. The fear of God is not physical.

 

[Thana]

Ecclesiastes 3
12 I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live. 13 That each of them may eat and drink, and find satisfaction in all their toil—this is the gift of God. 14 I know that everything God does will endure forever; nothing can be added to it and nothing taken from it. God does it so that people will fear him.

View attachment 10333

Fear means Revere

Case closed.

 

[Unification]

Ecclesiastes 3
12 I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live. 13 That each of them may eat and drink, and find satisfaction in all their toil—this is the gift of God. 14 I know that everything God does will endure forever; nothing can be added to it and nothing taken from it. God does it so that people will fear him.

View attachment 10333

Reverance. Awe-inspiring. Spirit(feeling/aura/sensation) of peace. Reverence to love, equality, humanity and nature.

When our minds are separated, and not whole(holy), we will be in some sort of "conscious state of hell) Being in that conscious state of hell sucks until we change what we eat and drink(consumption into our minds.)

 

[Nakosis]

@Nakosis , try again and please endeavor to make your new effort at least marginally coherent.

You might want to redirect that to King Solomon.

I'm reading along fine thinking I can understand this, until I hit the last line. So God provides this gift of life so we can fear him?

 

[George-ananda]

I take the 'fear of God' to mean the fear of doing wrong because of God's retribution. Being a eastern/new-ager type I think we can look at this in more suitable terms: doing wrong not only harms others but mostly ourselves.

 

[Nakosis]

Fear means Revere

Case closed.

In which case it seems God suffers from low self-esteem.

God's purpose in creating man is so God could feel better about himself?

Too ego trippy for me.

 

[savagewind]

I have discovered that the emotion of fear seems to cause the feared thing to happen. Has anyone else sensed that?

 

[Thana]

In which case it seems God suffers from low self-esteem.

God's purpose in creating man is so God could feel better about himself?

Too ego trippy for me.

Wow. You're reading Ecclesiastes, One of my most favourite books. The chapter you've quoted is filled with such wisdom, about life and death and it's simplicity and beauty and the gifts that God has given us.
But what do you take away from reading it? "God is egotistical"

It's says a lot about you. No, it says everything about you and why you cannot see beyond yourself.

 

[Nakosis]

I take the 'fear of God' to mean the fear of doing wrong because of God's retribution. Being a eastern/new-ager type I think we can look at this in more suitable terms: doing wrong not only harms others but mostly ourselves.

But then are you a better person because you are a better person or are you a better person because you fear punishment.

I actually think I agree with you as to the meaning. Right, this definition of respect I suspect was added to justify the Bible. I see no reason to respect people I fear.

We can understand fear to mean whatever to justify what we like to believe. Certainly there is a chance here for improvement.

If I saw "God does this so man knows God's love for him".

I say, hey that's pretty cool. Using fear is just not the wisest way to go about endearing God to man.

 

[George-ananda]

But then are you a better person because you are a better person or are you a better person because you fear punishment.

I actually think I agree with you as to the meaning. Right, this definition of respect I suspect was added to justify the Bible. I see no reason to respect people I fear.

We can understand fear to mean whatever to justify what we like to believe. Certainly there is a chance here for improvement.

If I saw "God does this so man knows God's love for him".

I say, hey that's pretty cool. Using fear is just not the wisest way to go about endearing God to man.

Spirituality evolves from the stone age to the space age. 'Fear of God' was a more ancient view that most of us have evolved beyond.

 

[Nakosis]

Wow. You're reading Ecclesiastes, One of my most favourite books. The chapter you've quoted is filled with such wisdom, about life and death and it's simplicity and beauty and the gifts that God has given us.

Exactly, this ^^^ was what I was looking for. Got surprised by this last line.

But what do you take away from reading it? "God is egotistical"
It's says a lot about you. No, it says everything about you and why you cannot see beyond yourself.

It's your definition.

What I take away from it is the Bible could have been written better.

 

[lovemuffin]

You might want to redirect that to King Solomon.

I'm reading along fine thinking I can understand this, until I hit the last line. So God provides this gift of life so we can fear him?

This is just my opinion, but I think it might be much easier to appreciate the depth of Ecclesiastes if you read it as a very human reflection, rather than as an absolute and unequivocal pronouncement of the nature of God or the meaning of life.

The entire book, and especially this chapter, reads as though the human author struggles to reconcile a theological perception of God with the mundane reality of the universe as it presents itself. So 3:14-15 describes this perception of a Divine nature that underlies everything, to which nothing can be added or taken away, and which inspires awe and amazement and reverence and yes even a sort of existential fear in the awareness of one's own finite-ness and contingency. But this should be taken in context with the reflections on the inscrutability of justice and the apparent vanity of human effort and meaning, when both humans and animals die and their lives cease to exist in the same way.

It's not God in Ecclesiastes proclaiming that the creation of the world was accomplished so that people might fear Him, it's the author almost lamenting the mystery of finite human life, which yet perceives the possibility of the infinite, the unbounded, the Divine, which yet seems so far removed from ordinary human justice.

 

[Politesse]

Fearing something that can take your life or happiness on a whim seems like generally prudent life advice. Intentionally creating such fear seems a bit rude.

 

[Nakosis]

Spirituality evolves from the stone age to the space age. 'Fear of God' was a more ancient view that most of us have evolved beyond.

I'm glad of this. The Bible is a record of man's beliefs about God. Ok, there are some cool/good things in there. However I think man currently is probably capable of doing better.

 

[Nakosis]

It's not God in Ecclesiastes proclaiming that the creation of the world was accomplished so that people might fear Him, it's the author almost lamenting the mystery of finite human life, which yet perceives the possibility of the infinite, the unbounded, the Divine, which yet seems so far removed from ordinary human justice.

Thanks for this.