UK general election May 2015

[Sultan Of Swing]

This May will come one of the most unpredictable elections in modern British history.

Disillusionment with mainstream politics has led to the rise of smaller parties. In all likelihood, it will be another coalition, who knows who may be in power in a few months.

Question is, who will you be voting for and why, or who are you thinking of voting for, at least? Undecided as of yet?

I'll go first and say I'm quite sure I'll be voting for UKIP. I've really had it with the EU, the big undemocratic bureaucratic heap of junk, I'm also a fan of libertarianism and other UKIP ideas. I'm concerned about immigration, but perhaps not to the level where Nigel Farage blamed immigration for his lateness, haha. I still like the guy though, and more importantly I agree with UKIP's policies.

And a bonus question: If the party you vote for doesn't win outright (or you didn't want anyone to win outright to begin with) what would be your ideal coalition, and your worst nightmare coalition?

Personally, a Tory-UKIP coalition would be interesting and be the lefty's worst nightmare, so why not?!

My own worst nightmare would be a Labour-SNP coalition (which is scarily likely to happen) or a Labour-Green coalition (less likely).

Seriously, can you imagine that, SNP in government? Alex Salmond sitting on the front bench, representing a country he was a few months ago trying to tear apart? I think I'd throw up.

 

[illykitty]

I'm one of those "lefties" considering Labour or Green. Honestly no party truly reflects what I'm looking for... But my ideas (ideals?) can't be achieved right now, so I'm looking for stepping stones in politics which could lead to what I'd love to see society evolve into. Labour are more centrists, comparatively, but they're more likely to win than Greens... But Greens are a bit closer to what I'd like to see happen, from what I remember however I'm sceptical about them actually being able to implement policies and they're not likely to win. It's a difficult decision for me. I might spend some time refreshing my mind about their policies and so on.

I agree with what you said about disillusionment, politicians, I feel, are very disconnected to the reality of "normal" people. That reflects in their policies and how they act. And I'm not just talking about the UK, it's the same in Canada, where I'm from.

My main concerns in politics are about issues involving wealth inequality and environmental issues. Immigrants are waaaaaay down on my list... I'm one as said above, native language not English (French Canadian) but as you can see ok at communicating with it... AND I haven't stolen any of your jobs, honest! I'm a stay at home wife and if my British husband was willing, I'd take him to Canada but he's got a pretty good job here and he tends to prioritise security... So we're not budging (plus it's not too bad here, I quite like fish and chips and it never gets as cold as -30).

Oh as for your scenarios with coalitions, ideal, hmm... Labour-Green, I suppose, not that it's going to happen though, eh? Conservative-Labour seem more likely. My nightmare is anything-UKIP, I entirely disagree with them.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

I'm one of those "lefties" considering Labour or Green. Honestly no party truly reflects what I'm looking for... But my ideas (ideals?) can't be achieved right now, so I'm looking for stepping stones in politics which could lead to what I'd love to see society evolve into. Labour are more centrists, comparatively, but they're more likely to win than Greens... But Greens are a bit closer to what I'd like to see happen, from what I remember however I'm sceptical about them actually being able to implement policies and they're not likely to win. It's a difficult decision for me. I might spend some time refreshing my mind about their policies and so on.

I agree with what you said about disillusionment, politicians, I feel, are very disconnected to the reality of "normal" people. That reflects in their policies and how they act. And I'm not just talking about the UK, it's the same in Canada, where I'm from.

My main concerns in politics are about issues involving wealth inequality and environmental issues. Immigrants are waaaaaay down on my list... I'm one as said above, native language not English (French Canadian) but as you can see ok at communicating with it... AND I haven't stolen any of your jobs, honest! I'm a stay at home wife and if my British husband was willing, I'd take him to Canada but he's got a pretty good job here and he tends to prioritise security... So we're not budging (plus it's not too bad here, I quite like fish and chips and it never gets as cold as -30).

Oh as for your scenarios with coalitions, ideal, hmm... Labour-Green, I suppose, not that it's going to happen though, eh? Conservative-Labour seem more likely. My nightmare is anything-UKIP, I entirely disagree with them.

You never know, the Greens already have one MP in Parliament, and with the surge in support they're bound to win a few more.

Just a few seats is enough if Labour itself is just a few seats off a majority.

 

[HonestJoe]

The UK is a representative democracy. We're not actually voting for parties in general elections, we're voting for individual candidates. Clearly the media, the parties themselves and others with vested interests in the shape of national government try to spin it as a vote for a party because that serves their various purposes but that doesn’t make it any less of a lie. Maybe if voters had a better understanding and appreciation of this fact, the political system in the UK wouldn't be as much of a mess.

None of the actual parties entirely appeal to me and I'm not convinced any of the likely outcomes of the election will make a vast difference in national policy. Conservatives or Labour are likely to form the basis of any government and they're pretty much interchangeable. I don't think any of the other parties, either as coalition partners or opposition groups, would be able to push through their true wishes so will all end up playing the same disruptive roles for political rather than practical purposes.

 

[Laika]

I'm in a Tory Safe seat and UKIP and BNP usually get about 5% between them. If I thought either one of them had a chance, I'd vote to keep the Conservative in, but that's about the only reason.

I expected to vote Labour (urgh!) but just checked and there is a Green standing. the Conservative will probably get in no matter what happens. so unless there is a hideous nation-wide UKIP surge, I will be voting Green. I will feel good about myself but it won't change anything.

If anyone wants to go further left than the Greens (), there are about 100 Candidates nationwide for the Trade Union and Socialist Coalition (TUSC) and the Communist Party of Britain has a few standing (maybe 8 or so?).

But not where I live. Dam. it would take a colossal collapse in Labour support for them to get in to be honest.

I would be happy to see 5 or 6 green MPs, but I think our electoral system will do serious damage to the Greens and UKIP and they might be still-born as national third parties. they'd have to sustain the surge in support across several elections to really do some damage. If there was a situation with no overall majority and several third parties doing well, that would be chaos for the UK parliamentary system as we're not used to it.

 

[Mycroft]

I wont vote for any of them, because I don't support an obsolete system.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

I wont vote for any of them, because I don't support an obsolete system.

So what will you do? Nothing?

 

[Mycroft]

So what will you do? Nothing?

I wont do nothing. I'll probably have a nice cup of tea and a biscuit, or something. I just wont vote.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

I wont do nothing. I'll probably have a nice cup of tea and a biscuit, or something. I just wont vote.

So is there no hope for the world, or change? Why not get involved in activism to change the system, or some such? Inaction leads to compliance with the system as it is.

 

[Mycroft]

So is there no hope for the world, or change? Why not get involved in activism to change the system, or some such? Inaction leads to compliance with the system as it is.

Politics is an obsolete system. Why? Because there are no political problems left in the world anymore, there are only technical problems. Even when you're trying to get one country to stop bombing another, then you're dealing with human behaviour, which is a scientific field and technical in nature.

So, when I'm not doing professory stuff, I'm actively engaged in my own projects in regards to solving some of the worlds technical problems (namely developing my own kind of therapy) as well as actively engaged with communities such as the Venus Project (not the Zeitgeist Movement).

 

[GoodbyeDave]

My constituency is a two-horse race, Conservative (favourite) versus Labour. Considering what Brown did to the economy, and Healey before him, I'm not going to trust Labour with it again.

In elections where there was PR (EU and London Assembly) I used to vote Green, but they seem to have gone mad — disband the armed forces, give unemployment benefit without requiring people be willing to work, re-introduce nationalisation. Yikes!

 

[Ultimatum]

In reply to the thread question:
-My ideal government would be a UKIP government.
-My nightmare government would be a Labour(-SNP) government.

I'm one of those "lefties" considering Labour or Green. Honestly no party truly reflects what I'm looking for... But my ideas (ideals?) can't be achieved right now, so I'm looking for stepping stones in politics which could lead to what I'd love to see society evolve into. Labour are more centrists, comparatively, but they're more likely to win than Greens... But Greens are a bit closer to what I'd like to see happen, from what I remember however I'm sceptical about them actually being able to implement policies and they're not likely to win. It's a difficult decision for me. I might spend some time refreshing my mind about their policies and so on.

Why would you think about voting for the Greens? Their fundamental policies are broken and the leader is incapable.
And do you honestly think that an uncontrolled, open-door immigration policy is going to be healthy for this country?

I agree with what you said about disillusionment, politicians, I feel, are very disconnected to the reality of "normal" people. That reflects in their policies and how they act. And I'm not just talking about the UK, it's the same in Canada, where I'm from.

Of course, politicians, generally, tend to come from fortunate backgrounds. Although, one may not be able to relate to a political figure, one can certainly relate to and support policy. I care more about policy that one's character (although this is also important).

My main concerns in politics are about issues involving wealth inequality and environmental issues.

Which, ironically, are inversely linked. As you build up, say, wind turbines and implement carbon taxes, the poor's bill, unsurprisingly, rises.

Immigrants are waaaaaay down on my list... I'm one as said above, native language not English (French Canadian) but as you can see ok at communicating with it... AND I haven't stolen any of your jobs, honest!

What is this referring to? It's a bit of a random sentence, to be honest.

I quite like fish and chips and it never gets as cold as -30).

Hahaha, I'm eating fish and chips whilst typing this content!

Oh as for your scenarios with coalitions, ideal, hmm... Labour-Green, I suppose, not that it's going to happen though, eh? Conservative-Labour seem more likely. My nightmare is anything-UKIP, I entirely disagree with them.

What do you disagree with UKIP about?

You never know, the Greens already have one MP in Parliament, and with the surge in support they're bound to win a few more.

"surge".
The entire membership of LibLabCon, UKIP, and the Greens is less than the population of Glasgow.
Not exactly representative of what is actually going on within the bowels of the civilization infrastructure.

I wont vote for any of them, because I don't support an obsolete system.

Democracy is an obsolete system?

Politics is an obsolete system. Why? Because there are no political problems left in the world anymore, there are only technical problems. Even when you're trying to get one country to stop bombing another, then you're dealing with human behaviour, which is a scientific field and technical in nature.

Implementing sensible immigration controls at borders is a political issue.
Making sure there is no one-party-political state in the UK, lest no one is held accountable, is a political issue.

 

[Mycroft]

Implementing sensible immigration controls at borders is a political issue.
Making sure there is no one-party-political state in the UK, lest no one is held accountable, is a political issue.

No it isn't, it's a technical issue in which more advanced and intelligent systems are required at airports and seaports. It's also a technical issue in the area of euthenics in those countries they're immigrating from.

The question isn't 'how do we stop uncontrolled immigration', the question is 'how we we make it so that immigrants don't feel the need to come here anymore.'

 

[Ultimatum]

No it isn't, it's a technical issue in which more advanced and intelligent systems are required at airports and seaports. It's also a technical issue in the area of euthenics in those countries they're immigrating from.

You're wrong. Placing caps is a metaphysical concept which is applied when the cap is reached. There is no technology involved in this principle--although it will play a part in terms of security at borders.
And it does not matter whether or not we are talking about realpolitik; these major decisions are made by the political establishments.

The question isn't 'how do we stop uncontrolled immigration', the question is 'how we we make it so that immigrants don't feel the need to come here anymore.'

I'm afraid not. Managing the push-pull factor, because negotiation on controlled immigration is in vain when a member of the EU, should be the last resort, after trying the aforementioned, as push-pull factors tend to impact the citizens of the country.
But I do agree that, very slightly tweaking the push-pull factor, after implementing artificial caps can play a part but only when done with extreme caution.

 

[illykitty]

Didn't the Greens speak of Universal Basic Income?

Ten Reasons to Support Basic Income - Basic Income UK

Inequality is quite high in the UK... Why is this important?

Impacts | The Equality Trust
The Spirit Level | The Equality Trust

 

[Ultimatum]

Didn't the Greens speak of Universal Basic Income?

Ten Reasons to Support Basic Income - Basic Income UK
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It's the Citizens' Income, and it would give every adult in the UK, regardless of how much they earn, a pay-out of at least £72 a week. This would cost the government around £280Bn ever year. The Greens have made this uncosted promise which would lead to austerity OR, and most likely because the Greens claim to be anti-austerity, hyperinflation of the pound.
It's a ridiculous, fairy-tale policy.
This Citizens' Income would also lead to a bottom-rate of tax of only £3,500 a year. This means that everyone in the country will be paying tax. Instead of only those earning over £10,500 a year. Implementing this policy would mean that the poorest in society would lose that safety net of £10,500 a year.
It's a deceptive policy.

 

[illykitty]

Politics is an obsolete system. Why? Because there are no political problems left in the world anymore, there are only technical problems. Even when you're trying to get one country to stop bombing another, then you're dealing with human behaviour, which is a scientific field and technical in nature.

So, when I'm not doing professory stuff, I'm actively engaged in my own projects in regards to solving some of the worlds technical problems (namely developing my own kind of therapy) as well as actively engaged with communities such as the Venus Project (not the Zeitgeist Movement).

I'm actually in the same boat, except I do read/listen to Zeitgeist Movement material as well.

I however wanted to vote to push society into that direction. What do you think? I mean, something like society envisaged in the Venus Project can't happen overnight. There are gradual steps that could happen to make it closer, rather than not doing anything.

I suppose that's one thing I like about TZM, is that they are active with Z-day and so on, reaching out to people and similarly minded activism. Even with all of the flaws of the movement, they are trying to do something.

Or do you think society will move that way regardless so that's why you abstain from voting? I'd like to know your thoughts, either here or in a PM, if you don't mind.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

It's the Citizens' Income, and it would give every adult in the UK, regardless of how much they earn, a pay-out of at least £72 a week. This would cost the government around £280Bn ever year. The Greens have made this uncosted promise which would lead to austerity OR, and most likely because the Greens claim to be anti-austerity, hyperinflation of the pound.
It's a ridiculous, fairy-tale policy.
This Citizens' Income would also lead to a bottom-rate of tax of only £3,500 a year. This means that everyone in the country will be paying tax. Instead of only those earning over £10,500 a year. Implementing this policy would mean that the poorest in society would lose that safety net of £10,500 a year.
It's a deceptive policy.

£280 billion a year haha, wow. Small parties are good at making untenable policies. Gotta be honest, this does include UKIP, before their increase in popularity they supported a flat tax, but they must have realised that such a position just couldn't be maintained without cutting far too much of the government.

(I still think they didn't have to maintain the top 40p rate of tax though, they could have brought it down a bit, there's a lot of government bureaucracy that could be cut down.)

 

[Ultimatum]

£280 billion a year haha, wow. Small parties are good at making untenable policies. Gotta be honest, this does include UKIP, before their increase in popularity they supported a flat tax, but they must have realised that such a position just couldn't be maintained without cutting far too much of the government.

(I still think they didn't have to maintain the top 40p rate of tax though, they could have brought it down a bit, there's a lot of government bureaucracy that could be cut down.)

Well this is the difference. The Greens are being voted for, I suspect, because of this Citizens' Income Policy, as their is no other significant reason to the vote for them, really. UKIP were not being voted for, because this was before the increase in popularity, their flat tax policy.

What UKIP have done, however, and they've been advocating this for years, is raising the threshold at which people start to pay tax to £13,500 a year.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

Well this is the difference. The Greens are being voted for, I suspect, because of this Citizens' Income Policy, as their is no other significant reason to the vote for them, really. UKIP were not being voted for, because this was before the increase in popularity, their flat tax policy.

What UKIP have done, however, and they've been advocating this for years, is raising the threshold at which people start to pay tax to £13,500 a year.

I was also pleasantly surprised to read UKIP would scrap tuition fees for all STEM university courses. Question is, where would they get the money for this? (Can't all be out of leaving the EU and reducing foreign aid, surely?)