Revelation 20 - Earthly Reign?

[katiemygirl]

="james2ko, post: 4385828, member: 25331"]
1. There is no one verse that states the kingdom would come in phases or parts.

If that doesn't raise red flags for you, nothing will.

This future phase will take place at Christ's return, when the kingdom's territory will be taken over by Christ and inherited by His saints.

Is this the same future "phase" that there is no Scripture that states the kingdom would come in phases?

He has been given all authority over heaven and earth but has chosen not to exercise His full authority just yet

.
Please quote the specific Scripture that says Jesus has chosen not to exercise His full authority.

Yes. He demands allegiance from His followers thus He is the king of the "kings" and Lord of the lords of those who will rule under Him in the literal coming kingdom

.
If Jesus is not ruling the earth right now, WHO is?

Yes. Since His kingdom is not of this present world order [kosmos], He is not and will not manifest His authority to the whole world NOW.

His kingdom is spiritual.
There is no question that His authority will be manifested in an even greater way than it was when He walked the earth at His second coming (discussed below).

His authority doesn't get any greater because He already has "all" authority. He will simply manifest His authority to the whole world by His physical appearance and supernatural power. And demand allegiance from every single human being and nation.

His authority will never be any greater, but He will most certainly manifest His authority at His second coming.

Romans 14:11
It is written: "'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will acknowledge God.'"

Yes, but I don't believe the judgment for non Christians will be a one time sentencing event. It is a period of time perhaps 100 yrs (Isa 65:20) sometime after the millennium. When the rest of the dead will be resurrected - not to immortality - but back to physical life.

Please provide a Scripture that says judgement for non christians will be more than a one time sentencing event.

Lazarus and many others who were resurrected back to physical life throughout scripture apparently died twice. I believe Heb 9:27 is a hebraism generally describing judgment after death. Similar to our idiomatic expression, "You only live once". Which isn't necessarily true. There are many people who have clinically died and lived again.

Lazarus and others were resurrected by a miracle of God for His purposes. In doing this God set aside the natural order of what physical life has been since the fall of man.

Doctors are not God. They can say a person is clinically dead using all the knowledge and tools they have, but it is God who determines when men die, not doctors. Sorry, but I'm not a believer of men today dying and coming back to life. But that's a topic for another thread.

Immediately upon Christ's return, Christians, who are currently being judged , will either be resurrected to immortality or back to physical life and thrown into a lake of fire at Gehenna (Isa 66:24;Mat 25:41;2Th 1:8-10), burned up ceasing their existence forever---the everlasting second death.

The rest will be resurrected to physical life 1,000 yrs later (Rev 20:5) for their second chance at physical life but their first chance at salvation. Those who reject salvation will be burned up in the world wide inferno we read about in 2 Pet 3:10. This purification of the earth will initiate the next phase of the kingdom--the Father actually coming down from heaven and dwelling with the remaining faithful (Rev 21:2-3).

God gave Lazarus and others a second chance at physical life . He will do the same with the

everyone who did not get a fair shot at knowing Christ. The only name under heaven by which we can be saved (Act 4:12). Just what you would expect from a just God! To me, this all brings to life the part of the Lord's prayer that states, "thy kingdom come".

Again, you make these statements, yet provide no specific Scripture which says such a thing. Please provide the verse that says that "everyone who did not get a fair shot at knowing Christ" will get a second chance.

You fly in the face of plainly written Scripture which says,

Romans 1:18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them.20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

Your entire argument is based on your private interpretation of prophesy and with assertions which have no specific plain language Scriptural support.

 

[moorea944]

If that doesn't raise red flags for you, nothing will.

Is this the same future "phase" that there is no Scripture that states the kingdom would come in phases?
.
Please quote the specific Scripture that says Jesus has chosen not to exercise His full authority.
.
If Jesus is not ruling the earth right now, WHO is?

His kingdom is spiritual.
There is no question that His authority will be manifested in an even greater way than it was when He walked the earth at His second coming (discussed below).

His authority will never be any greater, but He will most certainly manifest His authority at His second coming.

Romans 14:11
It is written: "'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will acknowledge God.'"

Please provide a Scripture that says judgement for non christians will be more than a one time sentencing event.

Lazarus and others were resurrected by a miracle of God for His purposes. In doing this God set aside the natural order of what physical life has been since the fall of man.

Doctors are not God. They can say a person is clinically dead using all the knowledge and tools they have, but it is God who determines when men die, not doctors. Sorry, but I'm not a believer of men today dying and coming back to life. But that's a topic for another thread.

The rest will be resurrected to physical life 1,000 yrs later (Rev 20:5) for their second chance at physical life but their first chance at salvation. Those who reject salvation will be burned up in the world wide inferno we read about in 2 Pet 3:10. This purification of the earth will initiate the next phase of the kingdom--the Father actually coming down from heaven and dwelling with the remaining faithful (Rev 21:2-3).

Again, you make these statements, yet provide no specific Scripture which says such a thing. Please provide the verse that says that "everyone who did not get a fair shot at knowing Christ" will get a second chance.

You fly in the face of plainly written Scripture which says,

Romans 1:18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them.20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

Your entire argument is based on your private interpretation of prophesy and with assertions which have no specific plain language Scriptural support.

Are you saying that the kingdom is here now and that Jesus is king now? Not sure what your really saying here.....

 

[katiemygirl]

="moorea944, post: 4386164, member: 16938"]As Mountain Climber stated before, Jesus taught his disciples how to pray. "Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth......."

James, the other premillennialist on this thread, says the kingdom is here. You say it is not.

Explain this.

Col. 1:13. For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

And this:

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power."

And this:

Rev. 1:9 I, John, am your brother and your partner in suffering and in God’s Kingdom and in the patient endurance to which Jesus calls us. I was exiled to the island of Patmos for preaching the word of God and for my testimony about Jesus.

 

[katiemygirl]

Are you saying that the kingdom is here now and that Jesus is king now? Not sure what your really saying here.....

That is precisely what I am saying. If you want to know my reasoning, you'll need to go back and read my posts to James, which give Scriptural support for my position. Sorry, but I don't have time to rewrite everything I've already written..

 

[katiemygirl]

Ecc 3:18 I said in my heart, "Concerning the condition of the sons of men, God tests them, that they may see that they themselves are like animals."
Ecc 3:19 For what happens to the sons of men also happens to animals; one thing befalls them: as one dies, so dies the other. Surely, they all have one breath; man has no advantage over animals, for all is vanity.​

Perhaps you are reading into the text too much information. Solomon was merely pointing out some of the physical similarities between men and beasts.

MC has a specific agenda. He says he's not a JW, but his posts say different.

 

[Mountain_Climber]

MC has a specific agenda. He says he's not a JW, but his posts say different.

That is an easy assumption to make in the lack of knowledge and understanding.

I get that from JWs and I get it from you. Not surprising.

JWs don't believe the kingdom of God is to be right here on earth. I do. JW's teach the inherited sin nature concept. I don't. There are many things they and I disagree concerning. And on that basis there is no way they would ever entertain me joining their group (which I wouldn't do anyway unless they suddenly made some major changes in their operation and their beliefs).

 

[Mountain_Climber]

Ecc 3:18 I said in my heart, "Concerning the condition of the sons of men, God tests them, that they may see that they themselves are like animals."
Ecc 3:19 For what happens to the sons of men also happens to animals; one thing befalls them: as one dies, so dies the other. Surely, they all have one breath; man has no advantage over animals, for all is vanity.​

Perhaps you are reading into the text too much information. Solomon was merely pointing out some of the physical similarities between men and beasts.

No, I am not reading too much into it, for that is by no means all I base that truth on. And it is truth regardless of the fact that you obviously do not yet know it to be truth.

Are you so blind as not to be able to see that these sacrificial animals were a picture of Jesus the man? Hang with those who are blind and get your understanding from them and you cannot expect to ever see.

Do you honestly believe that it was sheer coincidence that Peter knew the unclean things he was told to eat in the vision given in Acts pictured men?

You reverence us as Jews in yourself and that has stifled your reasoning things through in the scriptures. It put you into the perfect position to have our blindness rub off on you. And there are many a blind Jew among us to portray their self as knowledgeable to you and help you along in that blindness.

 

[moorea944]

That is precisely what I am saying. If you want to know my reasoning, you'll need to go back and read my posts to James, which give Scriptural support for my position. Sorry, but I don't have time to rewrite everything I've already written..

If the kingdom is here now, then Jesus has returned. He hasnt yet. The world now is not run by our Lord yet, it is run by the kingdoms of man. Scripture tell us that when Christ does return, he will destory the kingdoms of man. (Daniel 2}. He will restore Israel, there will also be wars, like in Ezek 38&39. So many things must happen when the kingdom is "actually" here.

I also notice that you like to pick and chose your verses to fit your beliefs. You need to understand the language of scripture. Do you actually read the OT, or do you feel the NT is the only book we need now in our day and age. Just curious. If so, you miss out on so much on scripture telling us that it will be an actual kingdom.

The "kingdom of God" is therefore the time after Christ's return when these promises will be fulfilled. Whilst God is ultimately the King of His entire creation even now, He has given man freewill to rule the world and his own life as he wishes. Thus at present the world is comprised of "the kingdom of men" (Dan. 4:17).

At Christ's return, "the kingdoms of this world (will) become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever" (Rev. 11:15). Then God's will and desires will be completely and openly performed in this earth. Hence Jesus' command for us to pray: "Thy kingdom come (that) Thy will be done in earth, as it is (now) in heaven" (Matt. 6:10). Because of this, the "kingdom of God" is a phrase interchangeable with "the kingdom of heaven" (Matt. 13:11 cp. Mark 4:11). Note that we never read of 'the kingdom in heaven'; it is the kingdom of heaven which will be established by Christ on earth at his return. As God's will is completely obeyed by the angels in heaven (Ps. 103:19-21), so it will be in the future kingdom of God, when the earth will only be inhabited by the righteous, who will then be "equal unto the angels" (Luke 20:36).

Daniel then saw a little stone hit the image on the feet, destroying it, and itself growing into a great mountain which filled the whole earth (Dan. 2:34,35). This stone represented Jesus (Matt. 21:42; Acts 4:11; Eph. 2:20; 1 Peter 2:4-8). The "mountain" which He will create all over the earth represents the everlasting Kingdom of God, which will be established at his second coming. This prophecy is in itself proof that the kingdom will be on earth, not in heaven.

 

[katiemygirl]

="moorea944, post: 4386292, member: 16938"]If the kingdom is here now, then Jesus has returned

.
The kingdom is here now. I posted 3 verses to you, which show the kingdom being spoken of in the present tense. I asked you to address them. I'm waiting for your answers.

I also notice that you like to pick and chose your verses to fit your beliefs. You need to understand the language of scripture. Do you actually read the OT, or do you feel the NT is the only book we need now in our day and age. Just curious.

I pick and choose as much as you and everyone does, no more, no less.

Yup, I actually read the whole Bible, and I understand the language as well as you or anyone does.

Where we differ is in interpretation of prophesy.

When the interpretation of prophesy contradicts the plain language of Scripture, then the interpretation of prophesy is faulty. And this is what you and other premillennialists do constantly.

The "kingdom of God" is therefore the time after Christ's return when these promises will be fulfilled. Whilst God is ultimately the King of His entire creation even now, He has given man freewill to rule the world and his own life as he wishes. Thus at present the world is comprised of "the kingdom of men" (Dan. 4:17).

Is Jesus KING now?

I posted this to you yesterday afternoon.

Speaking of Acts 2:30-31

God promised David that one of his descendants would sit upon his throne. David was looking into the future, speaking of the Messiah's RESURRECTION. That is what the verse says.

That's the part you're refusing to acknowledge. Jesus is sitting on David's throne right now and has been. He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords. He has been given all authority in heaven and on earth.

30 But he was a prophet, and he knew God had promised with an oath that one of David’s own descendants would sit on his throne. 31 David was looking into the future and speaking of the Messiah’s resurrection.

 

[moorea944]

.
The kingdom is here now. I posted 3 verses to you, which show the kingdom being spoken of in the present tense. I asked you to address them. I'm waiting for your answers.


I pick and choose as much as you and everyone does, no more, no less.

Yup, I actually read the whole Bible, and I understand the language as well as you or anyone does.

Where we differ is in interpretation of prophesy.

When the interpretation of prophesy contradicts the plain language of Scripture, then the interpretation of prophesy is faulty. And this is what you and other premillennialists do constantly.


Is Jesus KING now?

I posted this to you yesterday afternoon.

Speaking of Acts 2:30-31

God promised David that one of his descendants would sit upon his throne. David was looking into the future, speaking of the Messiah's RESURRECTION. That is what the verse says.

That's the part you're refusing to acknowledge. Jesus is sitting on David's throne right now and has been. He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords. He has been given all authority in heaven and on earth.

30 But he was a prophet, and he knew God had promised with an oath that one of David’s own descendants would sit on his throne. 31 David was looking into the future and speaking of the Messiah’s resurrection.

Well, it looks like this is a good standoff then. I showed you verses that the kingdom will not happen until Christ returns and then he will rule as King. Oh well.

.
The kingdom is here now. I posted 3 verses to you, which show the kingdom being spoken of in the present tense. I asked you to address them. I'm waiting for your answers.


I pick and choose as much as you and everyone does, no more, no less.

Yup, I actually read the whole Bible, and I understand the language as well as you or anyone does.

Where we differ is in interpretation of prophesy.

When the interpretation of prophesy contradicts the plain language of Scripture, then the interpretation of prophesy is faulty. And this is what you and other premillennialists do constantly.


Is Jesus KING now?

I posted this to you yesterday afternoon.

Speaking of Acts 2:30-31

God promised David that one of his descendants would sit upon his throne. David was looking into the future, speaking of the Messiah's RESURRECTION. That is what the verse says.

That's the part you're refusing to acknowledge. Jesus is sitting on David's throne right now and has been. He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords. He has been given all authority in heaven and on earth.

30 But he was a prophet, and he knew God had promised with an oath that one of David’s own descendants would sit on his throne. 31 David was looking into the future and speaking of the Messiah’s resurrection.

Two different things my friend. Verse 30 is talking about the messiah would sit on his throne someday. Verse 31 is talk about about his resurrection. It's NOT saying that he is sitting on it now. Look at the other verses that we posted. Jesus comes back first, then David's throne is restored.....

 

[moorea944]

Plus, 2 Sam 7 tells us that David will be raised first, then everything is restored.

 

[katiemygirl]

Well, it looks like this is a good standoff then. I showed you verses that the kingdom will not happen until Christ returns and then he will rule as King. Oh well.

Two different things my friend. Verse 30 is talking about the messiah would sit on his throne someday. Verse 31 is talk about about his resurrection. It's NOT saying that he is sitting on it now. Look at the other verses that we posted. Jesus comes back first, then David's throne is restored.....

You can read Acts 2 however you choose to.

I gave you three verses (Col. 1:13, Mark 9:1 and Rev. 1:9), which explicitly speak about the kingdom in the present tense. I quoted them for you and asked you to explain them.

 

[katiemygirl]

Plus, 2 Sam 7 tells us that David will be raised first, then everything is restored.

I have read 2 Samuel 7 carefully several times over, in its context, and I do not see where it says David will be raised first, then everything is restored. Please supply the specific verse you are referring to.

 

[katiemygirl]

That is an easy assumption to make in the lack of knowledge and understanding.

I get that from JWs and I get it from you. Not surprising.

JWs don't believe the kingdom of God is to be right here on earth. I do. JW's teach the inherited sin nature concept. I don't. There are many things they and I disagree concerning. And on that basis there is no way they would ever entertain me joining their group (which I wouldn't do anyway unless they suddenly made some major changes in their operation and their beliefs).

You may not belong to their org., but you hold many of their beliefs. I have read enough of your posts to make that determination.

I am happy we have one thing in common. I do not believe inherited sin is taught in the Scriptures.

 

[moorea944]

You may not belong to their org., but you hold many of their beliefs. I have read enough of your posts to make that determination.

I am happy we have one thing in common. I do not believe inherited sin is taught in the Scriptures.

But we do inherit a sin nature from Adam. We are prone to sin. We are mortals, we sin and because we sin, we die.

 

[katiemygirl]

But we do inherit a sin nature from Adam. We are prone to sin. We are mortals, we sin and because we sin, we die.

I'm glad you said we inherit Adam's sinful nature and not his sin. On this point, we agree.

You said there would be mortals, and therefore sin, in your future earthly kingdom. I thought there was supposed to be peace.

I have read 2 Samuel 7 carefully several times over, in its context, and I do not see where it says David will be raised first, then everything is restored. Please supply the specific verse you are referring to.

 

[JesusBeliever]

Gee you guys have been busy and I've got some reading to do! But before I do, this question stood out to me and I thought I'd try to answer it.

Find me an NT reference for who or what represents the wolf, lamb, snake, leopard , cow, bear and lion?

Hi James, firstly the NT isn't the only part of Scripture we should rely on for this, because the OT also has a habit of revealing deeper meanings to some of the symbols. Below are just some examples I found that should help show that all animals spoken of in Scripture represent people:

"Her princes in the midst thereof are like wolves ravening the prey, to shed blood, and to destroy souls, to get dishonest gain." Eze 22:27

"And ye my flock, the flock of my pasture, are men, and I am your God, saith the Lord GOD." Eze 34:31

"Rebuke the company of spearmen, the multitude of the bulls, with the calves of the people, till every one submit himself with pieces of silver: scatter thou the people that delight in war." Psa 68:30

"We roar all like bears, and mourn sore like doves: we look for judgment, but there is none; for salvation, but it is far off from us." Isa 59:11

"My soul is among lions: and I lie even among them that are set on fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows, and their tongue a sharp sword." Psa 57:4

A verse I only found tonight should be considered as it is spoken in relation to the New Covenant and it is this:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast." Jer 31:27

Note that just a few verses later He repeats this phrase "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD" and goes on to speak of the New Covenant:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:" Jer 31:31

Recall also that the Apostle Peter makes this connection between unclean animals and people of other nations:

"And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean." Act 10:28

"Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common." Act 10:12-15

Consider this forum in light of these Scriptures. It could be said that this forum is a partial fulfilment of Isaiah 11:6-9. Before the invention of the internet such a varied collection of people from around the world being able to converse openly about their faith without threat of harm or even death was unheard of! Let's be thankful to God for what we have been given! I know myself, I couldn't imagine having ever spoken in person what I have written on this forum.

 

[katiemygirl]

Gee you guys have been busy and I've got some reading to do! But before I do, this question stood out to me and I thought I'd try to answer it.
Hi James, firstly the NT isn't the only part of Scripture we should rely on for this, because the OT also has a habit of revealing deeper meanings to some of the symbols. Below are just some examples I found that should help show that all animals spoken of in Scripture represent people:

"Her princes in the midst thereof are like wolves ravening the prey, to shed blood, and to destroy souls, to get dishonest gain." Eze 22:27

"And ye my flock, the flock of my pasture, are men, and I am your God, saith the Lord GOD." Eze 34:31

"Rebuke the company of spearmen, the multitude of the bulls, with the calves of the people, till every one submit himself with pieces of silver: scatter thou the people that delight in war." Psa 68:30

"We roar all like bears, and mourn sore like doves: we look for judgment, but there is none; for salvation, but it is far off from us." Isa 59:11

"My soul is among lions: and I lie even among them that are set on fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows, and their tongue a sharp sword." Psa 57:4

A verse I only found tonight should be considered as it is spoken in relation to the New Covenant and it is this:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast." Jer 31:27

Note that just a few verses later He repeats this phrase "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD" and goes on to speak of the New Covenant:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:" Jer 31:31

Recall also that the Apostle Peter makes this connection between unclean animals and people of other nations:

"And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean." Act 10:28

"Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean. And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common." Act 10:12-15

Consider this forum in light of these Scriptures. It could be said that this forum is a partial fulfilment of Isaiah 11:6-9. Before the invention of the internet such a varied collection of people from around the world being able to converse openly about their faith without threat of harm or even death was unheard of! Let's be thankful to God for what we have been given! I know myself, I couldn't imagine having ever spoken in person what I have written on this forum.

Thank you JB for a great post!

We truly are blessed to have the freedom to converse openly with people from all over the world!

Your approach to study is excellent. Search the Scriptures to learn how these kinds of words and symbols are used in other places.

I've read a couple of commentaries on Revelation, and that is how they approached the study of John's apocalyse.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[moorea944]

I'm glad you said we inherit Adam's sinful nature and not his sin. On this point, we agree.

You said there would be mortals, and therefore sin, in your future earthly kingdom. I thought there was supposed to be peace.

There will be peace. Peace on earth for a thousand years, after, Jesus subdues the nations. The kingdoms of man must submit to Christ first, then peace. There will still be death, but of old age, not by war during the time of peace.

I have read 2 Samuel 7 carefully several times over, in its context, and I do not see where it says David will be raised first, then everything is restored. Please supply the specific verse you are referring to.

 

[moorea944]

You can read Acts 2 however you choose to.

I gave you three verses (Col. 1:13, Mark 9:1 and Rev. 1:9), which explicitly speak about the kingdom in the present tense. I quoted them for you and asked you to explain them.

Katie, the key to understanding any divine expression is recognizing it has to fit perfectly with all other expressions.
Let's examine these individually:

Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son

If someone is trying to take this literally then they have already lost. Although we have been delivered from the assured power of darkness, the actual transition away from the power of darkness certainly hasn't happened yet. We get diseased. We die. We can be mugged. We have to understand that God sometimes expresses things in the past tense that haven't happened yet. The principle is explained in Rom 4:16-17 where Paul explains that God calls things that are not as though they were... explaining why God said He had already made Abram a father of many nations when the man didn't even have a child yet. God has the right to use the past tense for future events... because when He says it will happen, it is as good as done... even if the event hasn't happened yet.

Mark 9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

I don't understand how this is a problem, but I will explain it. This promise is also made in Matt. 16:28 and Luke 9:27. Seven days later (which is "after six days" and "about 8 days" from the promise) it is Peter, James & John that witnessed a vision of the Kingdom of God. We know this was a vision and that Moses & Elijah were not actually there because Jesus himself calls this transfiguration mount experience a vision (Matt. 17:9). It would be very unwise for anyone to suggest Jesus was either lying or just uninformed that this experience was simply a vision.... of the future Kingdom promised for the 7th divine day (Ps. 90:4; 2 Pet. 3:8). The fact that there were 3 records of the promise and the transfiguration vision validates the 3 immortalization events in the divine plan (Jesus, the saints at the beginning of the Millennial Kingdom and the remaining saints at the end of the Kingdom). The Kingdom lasts for 1,000 years (Rev. 20:2, 20:7). We are not invited to inherit the Kingdom until Jesus returns and judges us (Matt. 25:31-34... Jesus has not returned in glory yet. That is an unchallengeable fact for all but the insane.)

Rev 1 9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Paul defines himself as a brother to those he writes...a brother in the Kingdom (meaning the 'hope" and not the current status) and in the "patience" of Jesus Christ. Why would we have to be patient if we had already inherited the Kingdom? It would be all over and this would be just a huge divine joke.... because we still die, we still cry, we still hurt, we still get hungry and thirsty... all things that are supposed to end when we inherit the Kingdom.

These references have to blend perfectly with all other divine expressions... or God is a liar, and that is impossible (Tit. 1:2; Heb 6:18). They have to blend with the promise that we have to experience a change in nature to inherit the Kingdom (John 3:1-8) where we become like the wind. Our bodies have to be redeemed (Rom 8:23). Other than Jesus Christ there has not been a single body yet redeemed from the power of sin. We still get sick. We die. We brake bones. We hurt.

The key Katie, to all divine expressions is how they all have to agree perfectly. There can be no contradictions... whatsoever. This is the principle of God manifestation (multitudinous singularity). It is the principle of peace, of harmony. Hope this helps.