Is the U.S. still free?

[raw_thought]

1. The right to a trial no longer exists. Without a right to a trial all the other rights vanish.[youtube]9P9zRBGPR8o[/youtube]
Rachel Maddow - Obama talks about Indefinite Detention - Dprogram.net - YouTube You can be put in prison for decades without ever being charged with a crime.
2. International corporations now have the right to censure what you view on the internet. For example, Verizon has restricted your access to Netflix in its war with netflix. The demise of net neutrality means that an ISP can eliminate your access to news sources that it does not like.Net Neutrality and the Future of the Internet | Nathan White
3. We no longer have the right to privacy. NSA broke privacy rules thousands of times per year, audit finds - The Washington Post
4. International corporations now have unlimited power over our politicians ( our influence is superflous).How Citizens United changed politics, in 7 charts - The Washington Post
The loss of the bill of rights unites the right and the left. Unfortunately, the economic power of international corporations ( with the media that it owns) continues to play us, one against the other.

 

[raw_thought]

Where I live (N.C.) a law was just signed by the governor, a law that makes it illegal to report the effects of fracking. For example, if you report gunk coming out of your kitchen sink faucet ( that was due to fracking) you will be charged with a crime!
Pro-Fracking Bill Flies Through North Carolina Legislature | ThinkProgress

 

[bobhikes]

The US constition is still the law of the land. Interpretation and enforcement have been fuzzied.

 

[raw_thought]

Perhaps it is still the law of the land. But in name only.

 

[Revoltingest]

Where I live (N.C.) a law was just signed by the governor, a law that makes it illegal to report the effects of fracking. For example, if you report gunk coming out of your kitchen sink faucet ( that was due to fracking) you will be charged with a crime!
Pro-Fracking Bill Flies Through North Carolina Legislature | ThinkProgress

Is this the 'crime' to which you refer?

The Senate bill includes language that would make it a crime to disclose the chemicals used in fracking. Releasing fracking fluid composition “knowingly or negligently” would be considered a misdemeanor. The bill would also prevent local bans on fracking and reduce groundwater testing in fracking areas. Senate Republicans originally wanted to make it a felony to disclose this information, which would have meant violators could have ended up in jail.

If so, it's not illegal to report gunk....only to analyze its composition & disclose it.
Even so, it wouldn't likely stand up in court.

 

[raw_thought]

I hope you are right! ( that it will not stand up in court).
If something so obviously unconstitutional is validated by the courts, then that is just one more nail in the coffin that suffocates the bill of rights. Unfortunately, I am not as confident in the system as you are.

 

[Revoltingest]

1. The right to a trial no longer exists. Without a right to a trial all the other rights vanish.[youtube]9P9zRBGPR8o[/youtube]
Rachel Maddow - Obama talks about Indefinite Detention - Dprogram.net - YouTube You can be put in prison for decades without ever being charged with a crime.
2. International corporations now have the right to censure what you view on the internet. For example, Verizon has restricted your access to Netflix in its war with netflix. The demise of net neutrality means that an ISP can eliminate your access to news sources that it does not like.Net Neutrality and the Future of the Internet*|*Nathan White
3. We no longer have the right to privacy. NSA broke privacy rules thousands of times per year, audit finds - The Washington Post
4. International corporations now have unlimited power over our politicians ( our influence is superflous).How Citizens United changed politics, in 7 charts - The Washington Post
The loss of the bill of rights unites the right and the left. Unfortunately, the economic power of international corporations ( with the media that it owns) continues to play us, one against the other.

I can't really answer you poll. By making the issue so black & white, it doesn't allow for constitutional law being a hybrid of strict construction, originalism, & personal values of the USSC justices. The right to a jury trial still exists, but it's been compromised by the Petty Offense Doctrine.

 

[raw_thought]

"If so, it's not illegal to report gunk....only to analyze its composition & disclose it."
Revoltingest
In other words, you are saying that you can report that gunk is coming out of your kitchen faucet. You just cannot blame fracking and/or try to prove it by analyzing what chemicals are coming out of your own sink!!!

 

[Revoltingest]

"If so, it's not illegal to report gunk....only to analyze its composition & disclose it."
Revoltingest
In other words, you are saying that you can report that gunk is coming out of your kitchen faucet. You just cannot blame fracking and/or try to prove it by analyzing what chemicals are coming out of your own sink!!!

I don't claim that much. If your link accurately represents the law, then
one is only prohibited from disclosing the composition of the "gunk". Even
then, this prohibition might be unenforceable because of the 1st Amendment.
But short of that, to "disclose" the chemical composition wouldn't likely include
court documents stating the results of one's analysis. So legal remedies for
harm suffered would be available.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I think it depends on the type of freedom we are talking about. Is this in reference to physical freedom? Or economic freedom? Or something else?

 

[Brickjectivity]

Where I live (N.C.) a law was just signed by the governor, a law that makes it illegal to report the effects of fracking. For example, if you report gunk coming out of your kitchen sink faucet ( that was due to fracking) you will be charged with a crime!
Pro-Fracking Bill Flies Through North Carolina Legislature | ThinkProgress

The bill keeps consumers from being able to prove that the oil company has contaminated drinking water, but they can report what is in their faucets. Its totally legal to report gunk in your own faucet, and it sounds like what they don't want is for you to be able to investigate the oil company by means of a subpoena.

 

[Quintessence]

Do you have any sources from, say, the New York Times or NPR? Something that really does their background research and is a touch more reputable? Seems to me many of your claims are greatly exaggerated.

 

[raw_thought]

Are you saying that my sources are questionable ( Washington post etc). Actually, the loss of our right to a trial is well established in all sources.
https://www.aclu.org/reform-patriot-act is just one source.

 

[Penumbra]

Seems to me that this topic is a lot more complicated, with a lot more gray area, than a yes/no poll would be applicable for.

 

[raw_thought]

I realize that the fact that the government can arrest you, keep you in prison for decades and never have to charge you with a crime is so outrageous that it seems unlikely. However, that is the way it is.
"“President Obama's action today is a blight on his legacy because he will forever be known as the president who signed indefinite detention without charge or trial into law,” said Anthony D. Romero, ACLU executive director."
FROM https://www.aclu.org/national-security/president-obama-signs-indefinite-detention-bill-law
In the OP a video of Maddow ( who usually defends Obama) and the above ACLU quote and Indefinite Detention Of Americans Survives House Vote shows that the left acknowledges that Habeas corpus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia has been eliminated.
The right?
Indefinite Military Detention Of US Citizens To Be Signed Into Law By Obama : Freedom Outpost
Non-partison?
With Reservations, Obama Signs Act to Allow Detention of Citizens - ABC News
Without the right to a trial all our other rights become meaningless. In effect we are guilty until proven innocent. I realize that most Americans will go to trial after committing a crime. However, the fact that a trial is now unnecessary means that we no longer follow the constitution.

 

[raw_thought]

Seems to me that this topic is a lot more complicated, with a lot more gray area, than a yes/no poll would be applicable for.

In what way is it complicated?
1. The constitution guarantees the right to a trial.
2. We no longer have a right to a trial.
3. Therefore, the constitution's most fundamental principle , the one that is necessary for all our rights no longer is followed.
4. Therefore, all the rights given us in the bill of rights no longer exist.

 

[raw_thought]

Don't you think that the fact that the government can arrest you, keep you in prison for decades and never have to charge you with a crime is outrageous? And violates the constitution?
I think we are no longer, the land of the free and home of the brave. We have become the land of the not free and home of the wienies.
" Those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Benjamin Franklin

 

[Brickjectivity]

It scares me. Another thing that scares me is that had senator McCarthy had so many tools at his disposal he could have detained indefinitely everyone that he wanted to incriminate. If you recall, Senator Joseph McCarthy began to charge citizens with involvement in communism and to investigate whether they were 'Subverting' the USA. He claimed without any proof that the state department had been infiltrated and that we were all in danger. Under current laws the senator, had he lived in this decade and been a little more clever, could have taken over the country.

 

[Revoltingest]

In what way is it complicated?
1. The constitution guarantees the right to a trial.
2. We no longer have a right to a trial.
3. Therefore, the constitution's most fundamental principle , the one that is necessary for all our rights no longer is followed.
4. Therefore, all the rights given us in the bill of rights no longer exist.

Instead of saying we have no right to trial, would it be more accurate that
we still have it, but that it's been eroded over the last few decades? Or do
you really maintain that the right to trial is simply gone.

 

[raw_thought]

"No Freeman shall be taken or imprisoned, or be disseized of his Freehold, or Liberties, or free Customs, or be outlawed, or exiled, or any other wise destroyed; nor will We not pass upon him, nor condemn him, but by lawful judgment of his Peers, or by the Law of the land."
Magna Carta (1215) Magna Carta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The right to a trial has been seen as fundamental to liberty since the dark ages! I guess we should get in a time machine, go back to Medieval England and learn about what freedom means!!!