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Eating Meat =/= Cannibalism

Mycroft

Ministry of Serendipity
A friend of mine, tonight, said that 'eating meat is no different to cannibalism.' She's a vegan. I tried to explain that comparing the eating of meat to the eating of humans is a little drastic, and that there are several very good scientific reasons why the comparison is a false one.

Has anyone else encountered this somewhat extreme view?
 

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
No, but I've encountered similar false equivalences/appeals to emotion/guilt trips made, such as calling meat eaters "murderers", or comparing meat-eating to human slavery.

As someone who shares much of the animal empathy that causes people to become vegetarian or vegan, AND who opposes factory farming, such reasoning can hardly be called reasonable. In addition to being filled with logical fallacies, it's classist, since it doesn't take into account the fact that vegan diets (in particular) are VERY expensive in terms of getting the proper nutrients; it's ableist, since it doesn't take into account the various health issues people might have that would make a vegan diet dangerous for them, and never seems to address the fact that domesticated cats and dogs are largely carnivorous and require meat to survive.

Empathy is about feeling the emotions or pain we perceive in others. Extending that to non-human animals isn't really that hard, or even always unreasonable. Many animals do have humanlike sentience. I'm willing to work away from eating pork or octopus, for example. But other animals that we eat, such as cows and chicken, don't demonstrate that degree of sentience to my knowledge. And ESPECIALLY when it comes to fish?! It's been scientifically verified that fish can't feel pain, so as long as they're not endangered, chow down on that sushi.

I'm okay with working towards a world where vegetarian and vegan diets weren't so expensive, and factory farming no longer happened, if nothing else for the sake of the environment. I hope that will be achieved soon with lab-grown meat that didn't come from a killed animal.

Empathy isn't always a good thing, as it can be misapplied and used to justify an elitist position.
 

Baladas

An Págánach
A friend of mine, tonight, said that 'eating meat is no different to cannibalism.' She's a vegan. I tried to explain that comparing the eating of meat to the eating of humans is a little drastic, and that there are several very good scientific reasons why the comparison is a false one.

Has anyone else encountered this somewhat extreme view?

No, I haven't encountered this view specifically, but like Riverwolf said, I have seen eating meat equated with murder.
As you said, we are animals and are part of nature. I am personally a vegetarian (apart from eating fish), but I don't hold anyone to my chosen lifestyle.

I am strongly opposed to factory farming, and I empathize with the animals who suffer through it...but who am I to dictate what someone else eats?
 

Sees

Dragonslayer
Very much like saying sex with people = incest. :D

There is a lot of fluffy bunny bullcrap in vegan and vegetarian circles so it doesn't surprise me a bit.

Edit: clarity-wise for people who don't know me or never seen me mention such - I do eat a mostly vegan diet. I'm not against being vegan or vegetarian at all.
 
Last edited:

BSM1

What? Me worry?
Very much like saying sex with people = incest. :D

There is a lot of fluffy bunny bullcrap in vegan and vegetarian circles so it doesn't surprise me a bit.

Umm...fluffy bunny...fried with peppers and onions....
 

Deathbydefault

Apistevist Asexual Atheist
A friend of mine, tonight, said that 'eating meat is no different to cannibalism.' She's a vegan. I tried to explain that comparing the eating of meat to the eating of humans is a little drastic, and that there are several very good scientific reasons why the comparison is a false one.

Has anyone else encountered this somewhat extreme view?

Yeah, I heard a group of kids making comparisons like that at the library where I work.
I didn't say anything, of course. Just silently went on about my day whilst ignoring the stupid.
 

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.
Premium Member
Humph! Sounds like another extreme "bunny hugger".
Heck I still occasionally hunt and shoot wild "bunnies" and EAT THEM!
Samo with squirrels and other tasty wild small critters.
Then there are deer.
A lady once asked me "how can you shoot those creatures as they run wild through
the woods?"
Reply" "ya gotta lead 'em just right.":D:D
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
It's not "several very good scientific reasons" that falsify the comparison. It simply violates the definition of the word.
I trust your friend has more substantive objections you haven't mentionioned.
 

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
th
 

Mycroft

Ministry of Serendipity
No, but I've encountered similar false equivalences/appeals to emotion/guilt trips made, such as calling meat eaters "murderers", or comparing meat-eating to human slavery.

As someone who shares much of the animal empathy that causes people to become vegetarian or vegan, AND who opposes factory farming, such reasoning can hardly be called reasonable. In addition to being filled with logical fallacies, it's classist, since it doesn't take into account the fact that vegan diets (in particular) are VERY expensive in terms of getting the proper nutrients; it's ableist, since it doesn't take into account the various health issues people might have that would make a vegan diet dangerous for them, and never seems to address the fact that domesticated cats and dogs are largely carnivorous and require meat to survive.

Empathy is about feeling the emotions or pain we perceive in others. Extending that to non-human animals isn't really that hard, or even always unreasonable. Many animals do have humanlike sentience. I'm willing to work away from eating pork or octopus, for example. But other animals that we eat, such as cows and chicken, don't demonstrate that degree of sentience to my knowledge. And ESPECIALLY when it comes to fish?! It's been scientifically verified that fish can't feel pain, so as long as they're not endangered, chow down on that sushi.

I'm okay with working towards a world where vegetarian and vegan diets weren't so expensive, and factory farming no longer happened, if nothing else for the sake of the environment. I hope that will be achieved soon with lab-grown meat that didn't come from a killed animal.

Empathy isn't always a good thing, as it can be misapplied and used to justify an elitist position.

The 'murderer' stance also ignores the fact that tens of millions of animals are killed (on purpose as well as accidentally) in the course of harvesting crops. Voles, Shrew, Mice are swept up in the blades of combine harvesters, as well as have poisons laid out for them so they die horrible, painful, and agonisingly slow deaths. Farmers often take the dogs out 'setting' to destroy, kill, shoot rabbits when a warren is found near a field of crops, etc.
 

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
The 'murderer' stance also ignores the fact that tens of millions of animals are killed (on purpose as well as accidentally) in the course of harvesting crops. Voles, Shrew, Mice are swept up in the blades of combine harvesters, as well as have poisons laid out for them so they die horrible, painful, and agonisingly slow deaths. Farmers often take the dogs out 'setting' to destroy, kill, shoot rabbits when a warren is found near a field of crops, etc.

And the fact that... pretty much all of modern medicine, cosmetics, anything-that-goes-on-or-in-the-body, is tested on animals for years before being approved for human testing. Which means, for every pill that gets through, there were hundreds, if not thousands, of failures that were tested on lab rats, pigs, chimps, and many other animals that share similar traits with us. That's a lot of horrible lives and deaths, so we can live better lives.

And... I can't be against that right now, much as I REALLY want to be. Sure, I'd love it if we could push towards a world where animal testing weren't necessary, but the only other alternative right now is to test exclusively on humans, which... well... yeah.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
The closest I've come to is my mom's belief that eating the skin on a piece of chicken is "cannibalism."
 
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