Your Happiness

[Rival]

This discussion comes from the idea that having money, possessions etc. won't make you and keep you happy. The idea that, fundamentally, human happiness cannot be sustained for long. It is with this in mind that I ask this.

What would the state have to take away from you to make you feel as though you could not live your life at the basic level needed for your own sustained happiness (or perhaps comfortability - I'm letting you use your own definition for 'happiness')?

I'm not talking about basics for life such as money or food or taking away your children; I'm talking about something that is so intrinsic to your life that you feel you could not exist or would not want to exist without it.

 

[Secret Chief]

First thought. Music.

 

[JustGeorge]

I felt this way for a long time about having friends. I am a quiet person, but I'm not really an introvert, and having people to share my time with was very important to me.

Little by little, they all kinda dwindled. Moved. Grew apart. Had a falling out. The only difference was they don't seem to be replaced. I'm down to having one couple I consider my friends, and they generally are only interested in contact every few months. Things are too quiet for my liking. I can't say this is pandemic induced; it was like this before, and will be like it after.

Am I totally unhappy? No. I still have my family. I enjoy my family. Overall, I'm happy, though I feel there's something out of place. I do feel its messed with my head some... I'm just not meant to be this solitary.

 

[exchemist]

This discussion comes from the idea that having money, possessions etc. won't make you and keep you happy. The idea the fundamentally, human happiness cannot be sustained for long. It is with this in mind that I ask this.

What would the state have to take away from you to make you feel as though you could not live your life at the basic level needed for your own sustained happiness (or perhaps comfortability - I'm letting you use your own definition for 'happiness')?

I'm not talking about basics for life such as money or food or taking away your children; I'm talking about something that is so intrinsic to your life that you feel you could not exist or would not want to exist without it.

My house.

 

[Rival]

My house.

I'm not talking about basics for life such as money or food or taking away your children;

 

[exchemist]

It's the memories. My deceased wife and I made it our home together.

But now I'm not sure what sort of thing you have in mind. What can "the state" take away but material things, after all?

 

[Rival]

It's the memories. My deceased wife and I made it our home together.

But now I'm not sure what sort of thing you have in mind. What can "the state" take away but material things, after all?

Freedom to practice one's religion.

Freedom to air one's political views.

Freedom to meet in groups of six or see friends.

etc.

I'm not trying to link this to anything actually happening, but from the idea that the people will eventually become bored of bread and circuses, as the phrase goes, and will eventually seek something else. I'm looking for the something that one needs (personally) for one's sustained and continued happiness that cannot be replaced and without which one would be either suicidal or otherwise trying to flee such a place to gain what one lost.

 

[exchemist]

Freedom to practice one's religion.

Freedom to air one's political views.

Freedom to meet in groups of six or see friends.

etc.

I'm not trying to link this to anything actually happening, but from the idea that the people will eventually become bored of bread and circuses, as the phrase goes, and will eventually seek something else. I'm looking for the something that one needs (personally) for one's sustained and continued happiness that cannot be replaced and without which one would be either suicidal or otherwise trying to flee such a place to gain what one lost.

Oh I see. So this is a sort of disguised anti-lockdown thread, is it?

 

[Rival]

Oh I see. So this is a sort of disguised anti-lockdown thread, is it?

Huh? No. It comes from a Jordan Peterson video I was watching:

Who Dares Say He Believes in God? - YouTube

I wanted to know what it is that fundamentally drives people that they could not live without. The only entity I can think of that can take those things away is the state. I'm interested in what drives people to live their lives, what motivates them, gives them meaning, that could not be replaced. I want to know what goes beyond things like money, possessions, houses, etc. and makes you who you are fundamentally, what makes you you, that if taken away you would cease to be you in any meaningful way.

I said this has nothing to do with anything happening in real life. You'd do me a service by taking me at my word.

 

[dybmh]

Freedom to practice one's religion.

Freedom to air one's political views.

Freedom to meet in groups of six or see friends.

etc.

I'm not trying to link this to anything actually happening, but from the idea that the people will eventually become bored of bread and circuses, as the phrase goes, and will eventually seek something else. I'm looking for the something that one needs (personally) for one's sustained and continued happiness that cannot be replaced and without which one would be either suicidal or otherwise trying to flee such a place to gain what one lost.

You're on to something. Anything on the list would involve a lack of freedom.

I'll add to the list: Freedom to choose a spouse or to live without one. No forced marriages.

 

[danieldemol]

Taking away freedom to view online porn would be enough to make me wish I lived somewhere else.

 

[exchemist]

Huh? No. It comes from a Jordan Peterson video I was watching:

Who Dares Say He Believes in God? - YouTube

I wanted to know what it is that fundamentally drives people that they could not live without. The only entity I can think of that can take those things away is the state. I'm interested in what drives people to live their lives, what motivates them, gives them meaning, that could not be replaced. I want to know what goes beyond things like money, possessions, houses, etc. and makes you who you are fundamentally, what makes you you, that if taken away you would cease to be you in any meaningful way.

I said this has nothing to do with anything happening in real life. You'd do me a service by taking me at my word.

OK, so what makes me me? I don't think there is anything the state could take away that would do that. What makes me me is in my head: what I know, and what I remember. I am, or was, a chemist, a rower, a singer, a husband, a father. Whatever circumstances I was in, I would still be, or have been, those things.

 

[Yerda]

That's a hard one. Hostorically people have had their religions, languages, institutions taken away from the by others and still hung on in there. Hmmm...

 

[Brickjectivity]

This discussion comes from the idea that having money, possessions etc. won't make you and keep you happy. The idea the fundamentally, human happiness cannot be sustained for long. It is with this in mind that I ask this.

What would the state have to take away from you to make you feel as though you could not live your life at the basic level needed for your own sustained happiness (or perhaps comfortability - I'm letting you use your own definition for 'happiness')?

I'm not talking about basics for life such as money or food or taking away your children; I'm talking about something that is so intrinsic to your life that you feel you could not exist or would not want to exist without it.

Privacy

 

[Secret Chief]

Oh. Have I cocked up? Could the State take away music? If not I withdraw my inane suggestion and replace it with what...?

 

[Rival]

That's a hard one. Hostorically people have had their religions, languages, institutions taken away from the by others and still hung on in there. Hmmm...

Indeed, but I think some individuals might buckle, especially if it went for a prolonged time. Some folks aren't made for certain environments or cultures and will become depressed within them and even suicidal; this does not speak to 'sustained and continued happiness' - so for instance, a state may ban being outwardly an atheist and force folks to go to worship centres, and while the atheist may be able to exist, would he find sustained and continued happiness in such a society? Likely no.

 

[Rival]

Oh. Have I cocked up? Could the State take away music? If not I withdraw my inane suggestion and replace it with what...?

It actually could. I know certain sects of Islam ban music and arguably if you somehow ended up living in a Shariah state, that might be the case.

 

[Secret Chief]

It actually could. I know certain sects of Islam ban music and arguably if you somehow ended up living in a Shariah state, that might be the case.

Ok I'll stick with that, although I can't see anyone being offended by Slayer; given they've written some real toe-tappers - such as "Jihad."

 

[Yerda]

Oh. Have I cocked up? Could the State take away music? If not I withdraw my inane suggestion and replace it with what...?

Didn't the Taliban outlaw music and dancing?

Indeed, but I think some individuals might buckle, especially if it went for a prolonged time. Some folks aren't made for certain environments or cultures and will become depressed within them and even suicidal; this does not speak to 'sustained and continued happiness' - so for instance, a state may ban being outwardly an atheist and force folks to go to worship centres, and while the atheist may be able to exist, would he find sustained and continued happiness in such a society? Likely no.

There is a flipside to the human difficulty in maintaining happiness. We also tend to be unable to maintain misery for long periods of time. We have our level on the hedonic treadmill we tend to return to our base level over time. This is why we can lose the people we love desperately and survive and even be happy later. Or why children raised in warzones can adapt and function in peacetimes. Or why folk endure lengthy incarceration (even unjustly).

Having said that there are no doubt things I could lose that would ruin any joy I have in living but the immediate ones are things like having my loved ones taken from me. Losing some of the freedoms we have could make life difficult, maybe unbearable but people have done it and do it now and seem to bear it.

Good thread though. Got me thinking.

 

[Trailblazer]

I'm not talking about basics for life such as money or food or taking away your children; I'm talking about something that is so intrinsic to your life that you feel you could not exist or would not want to exist without it.

My religion and my cats, although not necessarily in that order.