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Would Britain really have to adopt all EU law if we joined the EEA?

Ultimatum

Classical Liberal
So this is something that comes up a lot as a counter-argument for joining the EEA/EFTA post-Brexit: "But we would still have to adopt all EU law."

But would we, really? I mean, the people telling us this think that the single market lies within the EU, so their credibility is questioned from the offset.
Therefore, I decided to find out for myself!

And it turns out that, if you (the user of the former argument) weren't such an ignorant, idiotic "know-it-all", then you would also come to find out that the whole arguments is cut up and put in a blender according to Article 102 of the EEA Agreement, which states that EEA members have the right to deny EU law if it was thought to be against national interests!

So, in answer to the question? Nope! We would have the ability to reject every piece of legislation generated in the EU

But then, if you'd read Flexcit, you would already know this...
 

Kirran

Premium Member
Well, that's true. Very good.

I'm not sure why someone would think we'd have to adopt all EU law, although of course we would need to comply with certain strictures to remain within that Economic Area.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
And if you can actually think one step further you may actually ask yourself "hm if we don't agree to EU regulations what will the other side think and possibly not do".

But then again some people are Kippers and believe that trading with the UK is the greatest blessing anyone has ever been granted.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
As far as I can discover no one is offering the UK membership of an EEA/EFTA arrangement. nor is the EU proposing to extend such an existing arrangement to us. Were they to do so, like for Switzerland, we would need to comply will all EU financial and trade agreements and laws, but have no part in establishing them.

Like Every country we would have to comply with EU law when dealing with them, Just as they have to comply with other's laws.
The Advantaged of being inside the EU is overwhelming both in finance and trade. The links and agreements we have established between the EU and the rest of the world have taken many years to establish and mature. They are not transferable, we would have to recreate such agreements again, and probably not on such favourable terms.
 

Ultimatum

Classical Liberal
And if you can actually think one step further you may actually ask yourself "hm if we don't agree to EU regulations what will the other side think and possibly not do".

It doesn't matter what the other side thinks, as long as the EEA member state acts in accordance to the provisions set out in the EEA Agreement. Norway, for example, always contests EU law and have not encountered any major repercussions.
As an example,an EU directive on postal services in 2011 was outright rejected by Norway--and they went afraid to tell the EU that. Another example could be the oil and gas regulations covering offshore drilling--also rejected.
Sure, it may have prompted some concern and angry finger-wagging from Brussels, but Norway acted in accordance with the Agreement.

But then again some people are Kippers and believe that trading with the UK is the greatest blessing anyone has ever been granted.

Just for the record, I am no longer affiliated with any political party.

As far as I can discover no one is offering the UK membership of an EEA/EFTA arrangement.

No and I would also strongly fight any campaign to place us in the Norway Option long-term: to do so would be limiting what we could really accomplish.

nor is the EU proposing to extend such an existing arrangement to us.

What are you talking about? You do realise that we are already part of the EEA? And that joining EFTA has nothing to do with the EU?

Were they to do so

Yes.....?

, like for Switzerland, we would need to comply will all EU financial and trade agreements and laws, but have no part in establishing them.

Who the hell is advocating taking up the Swiss Option? No comparison should ever be made here as the EU-Swiss trading agreements took 16 years of blood, sweat, and tears to conclude--and the end result isn't even all that great.

Like Every country we would have to comply with EU law when dealing with them, Just as they have to comply with other's laws.

If you're talking about us having to meet all the applicable requirements if we still want to continue exporting goods to the EU then, yes, we would have to continue to follow these. But that's fine--it's not too much of a big deal: after all, it's what we do now, anyways.
The only thing we would have to do is build in an MRA into the free trade agreements--something I think we already have complied to as EEA participants...

The Advantaged of being inside the EU is overwhelming both in finance and trade.

Trade =/= EU
Trade = EEA/FTA/EFTA

And finance has nothing to do with the EU--anyone claiming otherwise is inherently ignorant. For example, all EU law relating to banking capital is sourced from the BCBS. Same goes for capital requirements and the like. But in a nutshell:

Financial Stability Board -----(national organisations: IMF, G20, central banks,)--------> European Union.

The links and agreements we have established between the EU and the rest of the world have taken many years to establish and mature.
They are not transferable, we would have to recreate such agreements again, and probably not on such favourable terms.

You are absolutely right--we could not possibly unravel 40 years of politico-economic integration at the snap of the finger, as Flexcit asserts: something that Ukip are quite so keen to do.
A post-Brexit Britain would require many laborious intermittent stages before, once again, becoming a fully sovereign nation independent from the project of "ever closer union".[/QUOTE][/QUOTE][/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
 

Altfish

Veteran Member
What Terrywoodenpic says.

I don't think anyone is saying that you have to comply with EU/EEA laws at all. BUT if you want to trade with these countries then your products will need to comply with any such laws/requirements.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
I don't even know what to say to someone who believes that the Swiss-EU agreements aren't even that great.

All companies involved would just laugh.
 

Ultimatum

Classical Liberal
What Terrywoodenpic says.

I don't think anyone is saying that you have to comply with EU/EEA laws at all. BUT if you want to trade with these countries then your products will need to comply with any such laws/requirements.

...which we have to do now, anyway. Therefore, it is a nil point to make in favour of continued membership.

I don't even know what to say to someone who believes that the Swiss-EU agreements aren't even that great.

Around 40% of Swiss legislation derives from EU rules--certainly, in my opinion, a great failure of reacquisition of sovereignty.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
Currently EEA membership is limited to EFTA or EU members.
if we leave the EU we also lose EEA membership rights.

To suggest that we have no financial role in the EU is farsical as it is one of the basic membershop rights.
The City of London will be very sorry to lose their dominant position in European financial makets ... to say Frankfurt.
and the cost to Uk plc would be far ranging.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Around 40% of Swiss legislation derives from EU rules--certainly, in my opinion, a great failure of reacquisition of sovereignty.

Yeah Switzerland certainly has it rough. Its not like its one of the best countries of the entire earth to live in.

And the EU is basically milking it dry. Yes.
 

Ultimatum

Classical Liberal
Currently EEA membership is limited to EFTA or EU members.
if we leave the EU we also lose EEA membership rights.

So you can't even understand what you wrote yourself? Flexcit advocates rejoining EFTA and, therefore, continuing to participate in the Single Market.

To suggest that we have no financial role in the EU is farsical as it is one of the basic membershop rights.

To suggest that we have no financial role outside the EU is just as idiotic. Therefore, because both sides cancel each other out, it's a moot point to make in favour of continue membership. If you want to continue to place your hands over your eyes and shout: "I have no idea what I'm talking about anymore", then, please, go ahead.

Financial regulation and the financial trading environment is going global--no longer will it be shackled to several blocks. As pledged by the G20 nations in November 2008 at the Washington summit: ""to enhance our cooperation and work together to restore global growth and achieve needed reforms in the world’s financial systems."

The City of London will be very sorry to lose their dominant position in European financial makets ... to say Frankfurt.
and the cost to Uk plc would be far ranging.

Literally what are you talking about? Their environment wouldn't change at all under a Flexcit...
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
So you can't even understand what you wrote yourself? Flexcit advocates rejoining EFTA and, therefore, continuing to participate in the Single Market.
To suggest that we have no financial role outside the EU is just as idiotic. Therefore, because both sides cancel each other out, it's a moot point to make in favour of continue membership. If you want to continue to place your hands over your eyes and shout: "I have no idea what I'm talking about anymore", then, please, go ahead.Financial regulation and the financial trading environment is going global--no longer will it be shackled to several blocks. As pledged by the G20 nations in November 2008 at the Washington summit: ""to enhance our cooperation and work together to restore global growth and achieve needed reforms in the world’s financial systems."Literally what are you talking about? Their environment wouldn't change at all under a Flexcit...

Why you might think that a plan dreamed up and flown by Richard North has any reality or acceptance, except by fellow EU sceptics, I have no Idea.

It is totally pie in the sky stuff and has no official backing by any one.

The chances of re joining EFTA are minimal in the extreme. Once bitten twice shy as they say... Who would trust us if be broke all our agreement and Left the EU. How committed and trustworthy do you think EFTA would believe us to be, when it is clear it would only be a ploy to be able to trade with the EU.

What sort of member are we anyway, that when time are tough, we want to renege on all our prior agreements and commitments. It is just those times when such agreements have their most value to any group. You might want to be thought a fair weather friend and quitter but that is not what the UK stands for.
 

Ultimatum

Classical Liberal
Why you might think that a plan dreamed up and flown by Richard North has any reality or acceptance, except by fellow EU sceptics, I have no Idea.

Perhaps you think this because you actually haven't read it?

It is totally pie in the sky stuff and has no official backing by any one.

Except that no one (as far as I'm aware), to date, has even tried to successfully refuting it. And, if you're so confident that it's "pie in the sky" stuff and, therefore, inadequate--then would you please point out what parts are?

The chances of re joining EFTA are minimal in the extreme.

Could you please back this up? What position of authority do you hold to state such a damning statement? Because all the evidence points to the contrary.

1. Iceland and Liechtenstein--not founding members of EFTA--have joined.
2. EFTA was set up exactly for this purpose--it was to offer a common market to those unwilling to joined the EEC (now called the EU).
3. The EU can't stop us from joining EFTA--they have nothing to do with the administration of this common market group: It's secretariat is based in Switzerland, it's official working language is English (hello!), the Council Chair is in Iceland, and has absolutely jack sh*t to do with the Euro.

Who would trust us if be broke all our agreement and Left the EU.

What--who would trust us if we decided, democratically, that we wanted to pull out from a political union, regain sovereignty, get back the power to make and manage our own trade deals, and, in the long-term, become a nation with its own seat at all the top tables?

Well I'll be damned if we're criticised for wanting to do any of that...
 
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