Worshipping the symbolic Devil

[1137]

First, take this: what is the Devil? Better yet, what is God? We aren't talking of objective things here, we're talking about ideas that hold great power in our world? So what is the inverse of the devil, this "God"? Well, God to me seems to be the popular shared ideals and values and such of society. Not just one religion, not just one period. The Egyptians, the Christians, the Muslims, the Greeks perhaps all stand against this devil.

So what does this God stand for? To name a few...
- Exclusivism
- Arrogance
- Conformity
- Congregation
- Leadership
- Submission
etc

Notice all are RHP ideals, therefore the inverse, this devil, is the LHP ideals, which are opposite. So to be LHP is, symbolically, especially since the line here between subjective and objective is so blurred, is to be a devil worshipper (devil as opposed to Satan since Satan is specifically judeo Christian).

Thoughts?

 

[1137]

Further,
Is this devil not more worthy of "worship" as A more original force than this God? Mankind existed just fine before civilization, law codes, religion, etc. Some argue we were even better off, the mentioned issues causing oppression, western disease, social classes, inequality, war, etc etc etc. Even st the mythological level there was chaos before order, and chaos was / is an ever present danger

 

[Mindmaster]

First, take this: what is the Devil? Better yet, what is God? We aren't talking of objective things here, we're talking about ideas that hold great power in our world? So what is the inverse of the devil, this "God"? Well, God to me seems to be the popular shared ideals and values and such of society. Not just one religion, not just one period. The Egyptians, the Christians, the Muslims, the Greeks perhaps all stand against this devil.

Certainly if anything defines the RHP it is the status quo which is really what is about; keeping the worker bees at work. This tendency exists regardless of the period of time mentioned or its problems. In reward for your servitude you will get whatever you will swallow as adequate compensation at the time. It's especially easy to promise things that won't get paid up.

--snip--

Notice all are RHP ideals, therefore the inverse, this devil, is the LHP ideals, which are opposite. So to be LHP is, symbolically, especially since the line here between subjective and objective is so blurred, is to be a devil worshipper (devil as opposed to Satan since Satan is specifically judeo Christian).

Thoughts?

I think it is more than that. I don't think you qualify as a Theistic Satanist by merely embracing a few philosophical points. Religions aren't really defined by philosophies they're more like meta-philosophies with a doctrine. To compare.. LaVey Satanism can't exist without strictly adhereing to the tenets of _The Satanic Bible_, but Theistic Satanism can -- in fact a Theistic Satanist may seem very contrary at first glance since they are free to cherry pick ideas as it suits them.

There are certainly some Theistic Satanists that worship in a classical sense, but really this is the right-handed mode where blind faith and dogma dominate. I even hesitate to use the word belief at all because it really doesn't fit in my spiritual paradigm. In my pursuits to unravel the mysteries science has failed to pursue I stumbled upon a point of origination of the a current which I aligned myself with. That juncture is Satan and it is the source of Black Flame or whatever you want to call it. My relation again is like a familial relationship and nothing like some sort of subservience. Why is one a free actor if one is meant to mindlessly follow? Those are the questions I sought out and this is just where I arrived. It landed me in opposition, but there is no better name than Satanist. I feel it puts the right people on notice most of the time.

There are many other approaches to religion, but I find few are actually unique.

 

[Quintessence]

That's... one way of looking at things. Definitely not how I see it. The idea of "god" (aka god-concepts) is complex, as are ideas about its antithesis, for the theologies that have it (and not all do). I can't say I break things down as the OP does. Some attributes Doors suggests are "god" I would put squarely in "devil" were I wearing typical monotheistic lenses. The whole "god" vs. "devil" thing really doesn't have any place in Paganism, so I... I just have difficulty seeing in such a dualistic fashion. As a general rule, I don't feel any particular god is any more or less worthy of worship than any other. What you worship is a matter of personal preference. I'm not interested in worshiping god-concepts associated with Christian theology (e.g. their one-god or their devil, nor their saints and angels).

 

[crossfire]

First, take this: what is the Devil? Better yet, what is God? We aren't talking of objective things here, we're talking about ideas that hold great power in our world? So what is the inverse of the devil, this "God"? Well, God to me seems to be the popular shared ideals and values and such of society. Not just one religion, not just one period. The Egyptians, the Christians, the Muslims, the Greeks perhaps all stand against this devil.

So what does this God stand for? To name a few...
- Exclusivism
- Arrogance
- Conformity
- Congregation
- Leadership
- Submission
etc

Notice all are RHP ideals, therefore the inverse, this devil, is the LHP ideals, which are opposite. So to be LHP is, symbolically, especially since the line here between subjective and objective is so blurred, is to be a devil worshipper (devil as opposed to Satan since Satan is specifically judeo Christian).

Thoughts?

You might consider the Egyptian symbolism, which you seem to be fond of, of the crook (right hand)and flail (left hand.)
Notice how well the crook depicts RHP in Mindmaster's post:

Certainly if anything defines the RHP it is the status quo which is really what is about; keeping the worker bees at work. This tendency exists regardless of the period of time mentioned or its problems. In reward for your servitude you will get whatever you will swallow as adequate compensation at the time. It's especially easy to promise things that won't get paid up.

Notice how the flail works with LHP:

<...> That juncture is Satan and it is the source of Black Flame or whatever you want to call it. My relation again is like a familial relationship and nothing like some sort of subservience. Why is one a free actor if one is meant to mindlessly follow? Those are the questions I sought out and this is just where I arrived. It landed me in opposition, but there is no better name than Satanist. I feel it puts the right people on notice most of the time.

There are many other approaches to religion, but I find few are actually unique.

If the Black Flame is wisdom gained through adversity, then the flail is an apt symbol of this, no?

 

[ScottySatan]

This seems like a loaded question. But hell, what question isn't in some way? I hope you'll say why you asked.

I think before I we can answer this question, we need to answer the question, "what is worship?".

 

[Adramelek]

I think before I we can answer this question, we need to answer the question, "what is worship?".

Worship= to honor or reverence as a divine being or supernatural or supranatural/metaphysical power. However, to worship, to honor, to revere a thing or principle does not mean that you subjugate your self or surrender your will to said thing or principle. Therefore, that being said, it would be accurate to say that I do personally worship the Prince of Darkness, the First Principle of psyche-centric awareness, who I know as Set.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[ScottySatan]

Worship= to honor or reverence as a divine being
/QUOTE]

What do "honor" or "reverence" as verbs, entail, exactly?

 

[Informare]

The analogy I've used before is the way a guitar player might view someone like Steve Vai, or the the way physicist might view Albert Einstein. It's an admiration and recognition of the things they have achieved, and the way they have changed their field and the world around them. This comes with a certain amount of awe and reverence.

 

[Adramelek]

Worship= to honor or reverence as a divine being
/QUOTE]

What do "honor" or "reverence" as verbs, entail, exactly?

My showing honor and reverence to the Lord of Darkness means to show homage, admiration, and respect to the Greatest Black Magician in the Universe, That which to me is the creator of the human psyche. However, it is a sort of honor and reverence one has for something above all others. And yes, there is a sense of awe when one experiences the presence of Set.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[ScottySatan]

I guess I'm asking you to describe what you are actually doing physically and what thoughts run through your head at the time.

When you are worshiping something, what are you actually doing?

 

[Adramelek]

I guess I'm asking you to describe what you are actually doing physically and what thoughts run through your head at the time.

When you are worshiping something, what are you actually doing?

My thoughts and actions are best described in an invocation I use to summon the sense of Set during ritual workings:

Xepera - Xeper - Xeperu​

In the Name of Set, the supreme manifestation of the Lord of Darkness, I summon the Black Flame into my midst that I may Work my Will upon the warp and weave of creation. O Majesty of Set, hear me, look upon me, and enshrine within me the essence of the Highest of Life. Open the gate of the blazing trapezoid and come forth from thy celestial solitude to greet me as a Brother and kindred spirit.
Enshroud me with the Powers of Darkness; let Them become as One with me as I am become One with the Eternal Set, whose Throne is deep within the Darkness behind the Constellation of the Seven Stars. As I send forth my most sublime and exalted Self, arm it with the Shining Pentagram of Set and with the Sceptre called Giver of Winds that it may slay the Cosmic Stasis, dismay all challenges, and cast down all that is moved to appear against it.
Let then my eyes become the Eyes of Set, my strength become the Strength of Set, my will become the Will of Set!
From the primordial depths I am risen up and am become transformed like the mighty Khepera, with the wings of the falcon I soar the Infinite. I dwell in the Fane of the ever-burning Flame of Ba. Space and Time bend to my Will, and I am ancient one of Life, Death, and Life beyond Death. Hear then, this Doom that I pronounce and beware the Ka which now Comes Into Being through that Art which is mine to command!​

Hail, Set!​

/Adramelek\​

 

[ScottySatan]

My thoughts and actions are best described in an invocation I use to summon the sense of Set during ritual workings:

/Adramelek\​

Thanks for that. That helps me a little. For once, I didn't mean to put you on the spot. It's been a question of mine since childhood: "what is worship?". As a child it seemed to me that songs or spoken word detailing how awesome god was, was about the same as songs and spoken word about other awesome worldly things that were not god-sent.

"Oh god, I adore you"

"Oh, Girl from Ipanema, I adore you" (you know, the old samba song)

One song is apparently worship and the other is not...not really.

Edited to add: I think right now that this is probably the worst place in the forum to ask about this topic. I'm going to move it somewhere else.