World Crisis and The Pathway to Peace

[paarsurrey]

The world is passing through very turbulent times. The global economic crisis continues to manifest newer and graver dangers almost every week. The similarities to the period just before the Second World War continue to be cited and it seems clear that events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Does one agree to it,please?

Regards

 

[danieldemol]

The world is passing through very turbulent times. The global economic crisis continues to manifest newer and graver dangers almost every week. The similarities to the period just before the Second World War continue to be cited and it seems clear that events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Does one agree to it,please?

Regards

An impending world catastrophe in no way implies that Ahmadi fundamentalism is “the” pathway to peace.
Kind regards,
Dan

 

[danieldemol]

An impending world catastrophe in no way implies that Ahmadi fundamentalism is “the” pathway to peace.
Kind regards,
Dan

Or any other fundamentalism.

 

[Estro Felino]

The world is passing through very turbulent times. The global economic crisis continues to manifest newer and graver dangers almost every week. The similarities to the period just before the Second World War continue to be cited and it seems clear that events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Does one agree to it,please?

Regards

Absolutely not...as for the EU, there are more and more campaigns for denuclearization, demilitarization...so world peace is more attainable now than ever.

 

[paarsurrey]

An impending world catastrophe in no way implies that Ahmadi fundamentalism is “the” pathway to peace.
Kind regards,
Dan

I am not aware of any "Ahmadi fundamentalism", please.
Please inform me about it, if there is any, please.
Regards

 

[danieldemol]

I am not aware of any "Ahmadi fundamentalism", please.
Please inform me about it, if there is any, please.
Regards

Sure, do you believe that people who have gay marriage should be excommunicated from the Jamaat, or do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?
If you do then you have probably considered the societal rules of your faith to be fundamentals and do not take a liberal approach to its laws.
That’s what I mean by a liberal vs fundamentalist Ahmadi.
There are other examples too such as pertaining to fining people for blasphemy or maiming unrepentant POWs.

 

[paarsurrey]

Sure, do you believe that people who have gay marriage should be excommunicated from the Jamaat, or do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?
If you do then you have probably considered the societal rules of your faith to be fundamentals and do not take a liberal approach to its laws.
That’s what I mean by a liberal vs fundamentalist Ahmadi.
There are other examples too such as pertaining to fining people for blasphemy or maiming unrepentant POWs.

What has gay marriage to do with the world peace? It is a social liking or disliking, not more than that.

"do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?"

It depends on the country/state one lives in. We don't take the law of a land in our hands. We do things in secular (or social) matters as per the rules of the state.

"There are other examples too such as pertaining to fining people for blasphemy or maiming unrepentant"

We are peaceful people and if somebody does blasphemy, we would tell him that it is not a good thing to do. We will give him our reasons and arguments in this connection.

Regards

 

[sun rise]

moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Does one agree to it,please?

I don't see it that way at all. Yes, dark forces have once again come to the surface in the USA, Turkey and in other nations, but no where near to the extent they were before WWII or the Cold War.

 

[Shad]

The world is passing through very turbulent times. The global economic crisis continues to manifest newer and graver dangers almost every week. The similarities to the period just before the Second World War continue to be cited and it seems clear that events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Does one agree to it,please?

Regards

Nope as only one power is capable of waging a global war outside of nukes is the USA. It has no reason to start a major conflict with a capable power. Second rate powers have no need. Russia vs the USA would be nuclear. China needs the Western economy for it's industry. The other nations are allies and/or do not matter.

 

[danieldemol]

What has gay marriage to do with the world peace? It is a social liking or disliking, not more than that.

It was related to your question pertaining to my view of what constitutes a fundamentalist

"do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?"

It depends on the country/state one lives in. We don't take the law of a land in our hands. We do things in secular (or social) matters as per the rules of the state.

So with a little less beating around the bush, one could consider what would happen in an Ahmadi society where Ahmadis had the power to make the laws of the state. What do you think would happen to adulterers in such a situation?

"There are other examples too such as pertaining to fining people for blasphemy or maiming unrepentant"

We are peaceful people and if somebody does blasphemy, we would tell him that it is not a good thing to do. We will give him our reasons and arguments in this connection.

Regards

Are you aware that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad lobied the British government of India unsuccessfuly to have a fine imposed for blasphemy?
If you are and you still believe that people should not be fined for blasphemy you are probably a liberal Ahmadi, and on that I congratulate you.

Also, without the beating around the bush, what is your answer concerning maiming or crucifixion of unrepentant Prisoners of War (POW) in an Ahmadi society will they be maimed or crucified if everyone were Ahmadi and thus there were nowhere to exile them?

Kind regards

 

[Augustus]

The similarities to the period just before the Second World War continue to be cited and it seems clear that events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

There might be a WW3 sooner or later, but there are no real similarities to the pre-WW2 era because Europe is not still dealing with the effects of WW1, political alliances have changed and the major powers all have nukes.

What is developing is a multi-polar world, which has been the norm throughout history. This may lead to greater tensions, but it certainly doesn't make WW3 certain in the near future, or even probable.

 

[paarsurrey]

danieldemol wrote:
"do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?"
paarsurrey said: ↑
It depends on the country/state one lives in. We don't take the law of a land in our hands. We do things in secular (or social) matters as per the rules of the state.

So with a little less beating around the bush, one could consider what would happen in an Ahmadi society where Ahmadis had the power to make the laws of the state. What do you think would happen to adulterers in such a situation?

If there is a state where population of Ahmadis is 100%, then the norms would be as per the constitution of that country. What others have to object to it, please?

Regards

 

[danieldemol]

danieldemol wrote:
"do you believe that an adulterer should be punished with 100 lashes if they are caught?"
paarsurrey said: ↑
It depends on the country/state one lives in. We don't take the law of a land in our hands. We do things in secular (or social) matters as per the rules of the state.



If there is a state where population of Ahmadis is 100%, then the norms would be as per the constitution of that country. What others have to object to it, please?

Regards

First of all, Ahmadis need not be 100% to have the power to make law, there could still be a sizeable minority of non-Ahmadis.

Secondly one may always criticise a law of the land if they feel it to be unjust, so the question remains why is 100 lashes for adultery unjust. Although this may deserve a seperate thread to explore more fully, I would say briefly that if you define marriage as between man and woman (or women) only, and if you are prepared to offer 100 lashes to anyone who practices sexual acts outside these bounds, you could potentially wind up giving 100 lashes to 2 perfectly monogamous gay men, which to me seems unjust.

Please discontinue dodging the question concerning the maiming or crucifixion of non-repentant POWs.

Thanks and regards

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

events are moving the world at an unprecedented pace towards a horrific Third World War.

Not old enough to remember the Cold War, huh?

 

[paarsurrey]

First of all, Ahmadis need not be 100% to have the power to make law, there could still be a sizeable minority of non-Ahmadis.

Secondly one may always criticise a law of the land if they feel it to be unjust, so the question remains why is 100 lashes for adultery unjust. Although this may deserve a seperate thread to explore more fully, I would say briefly that if you define marriage as between man and woman (or women) only, and if you are prepared to offer 100 lashes to anyone who practices sexual acts outside these bounds, you could potentially wind up giving 100 lashes to 2 perfectly monogamous gay men, which to me seems unjust.

Please discontinue dodging the question concerning the maiming or crucifixion of non-repentant POWs.

Thanks and regards

Please mention as to what % are Ahmadis and what % are non-Ahmadis in that hypothetical state.

Regards

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

First of all, Ahmadis need not be 100% to have the power to make law, there could still be a sizeable minority of non-Ahmadis.

Secondly one may always criticise a law of the land if they feel it to be unjust, so the question remains why is 100 lashes for adultery unjust. Although this may deserve a seperate thread to explore more fully, I would say briefly that if you define marriage as between man and woman (or women) only, and if you are prepared to offer 100 lashes to anyone who practices sexual acts outside these bounds, you could potentially wind up giving 100 lashes to 2 perfectly monogamous gay men, which to me seems unjust.

Please discontinue dodging the question concerning the maiming or crucifixion of non-repentant POWs.

Thanks and regards

Crucifixtion of non repentant POWs??

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Nope as only one power is capable of waging a global war outside of nukes is the USA. It has no reason to start a major conflict with a capable power. Second rate powers have no need. Russia vs the USA would be nuclear. China needs the Western economy for it's industry. The other nations are allies and/or do not matter.

The US isn't really capable of it, either. NB. Iraq and Afghanistan.

 

[paarsurrey]

Crucifixtion of non repentant POWs??

I don't know as to what made our friend @danieldemol to write the above sentence. There is no crucifixion of anybody ever made by the Ahmadiyya Muslims in any part of the world and there are no POWs ever held by Ahmadiyya Muslims, please.

Regards

 

[danieldemol]

Crucifixtion of non repentant POWs??

From the Ahmadiyya website https://www.alislam.org/quran/5:33
"The reward of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive to create disorder in the land is only this that they be slain or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on alternate sides, or they be expelled from the land... Except those who repent before you have them in your power."
I couldn't find an Ahmadi exposition for this verse, but according to their own website this verse reads that acceptable punishments include crucifixion, and cutting of the hand and foot on opposite sides.

Hence my question concerning how an Ahmadi society intends to treat non-repentant POWs.

 

[danieldemol]

I don't know as to what made our friend @danieldemol to write the above sentence. There is no crucifixion of anybody ever made by the Ahmadiyya Muslims in any part of the world and there are no POWs ever held by Ahmadiyya Muslims, please.

Regards

All of which relates to past circumstance, not to hypothetical future circumstance. Could you garantee no one would go to war against an Ahmadi society? There are probably fanatical people that would love to do so.