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Featured Works aren't necessary for salvation, in fact, you are not supposed to be doing "works", at all

Discussion in 'Same Faith Debates' started by Desert Snake, Aug 28, 2018.

  1. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    Ehhh likewise?
    In other words, you're supposed to compare and contrast the Scripture.
     
  2. Milton Platt

    Milton Platt Well-Known Member

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    But that doesn't verify that any of it (if any of it at all) is truthful. There needs to be outside verification. That is the biggest problem. there is none. You cannot verify the truthfulness of any of it, except in the case of a few verifiable geographic locations, for instance.
     
  3. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    One can personally verify things. So, that's wrong. Also, that myth about Bible contradictions, concerning places, I haven't noticed any.


    So, I disagree.
     
  4. Milton Platt

    Milton Platt Well-Known Member

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    Yes, one can personally verify things if one has access to the information. The information is not contained in the Bible, though.
     
  5. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    Anyways, we're supposed to use other sources. In fact, [Thessalonians, Paul says, whether by word or scripture.

    You don't even have to know how to read, to be good in faith, so forth.
     
  6. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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  7. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    If one has faith in what Jesus instructed to do at Matthew 28:18-20; Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 then one would have the faith to do the same spiritual work that Jesus did at Luke 4:43. Not physical works as the primary thing but spiritual works.
    Anyone, including atheists, can be good neighborly Samaritans, but they do Not do as Jesus instructed.
    So, we should 'walk' as instructed at Micah 4:5. Walk by faith and Not by sight ( sighted things ).
     
  8. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    You must not be reading the same Bible.

    James 2:23-24
    23]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the friend of God.
    24] Ye see then that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
    [KJV]

    James 3:18
    And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace
    [KJV]

    Romans 10:4
    For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
    [KJV]

    You might be under the law of Righteousness, in your religion, however real Bible followers, aren't.
     
    #48 Desert Snake, Sep 6, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018
  9. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    Romans 10:3
    For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
    [KJV]

    That's about as clear, as it gets.
     
    #49 Desert Snake, Sep 6, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018
  10. IndigoChild5559

    IndigoChild5559 Loving God and my neighbor as myself.

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    Perhaps you should define what you mean by "works."

    To me as a Jew, good works would mean obeying God by refraining (thou shalt not) from those things which are prohibited i.e. not stealing, and doing (thou shalt) those things that God asks i.e. giving 10% to support the synagogue and the poor.

    Is your definition different than that?

    Because if it is the same, then I can't understand you saying that we shouldn't love our neighbor as ourselves.
     
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  11. osgart

    osgart Nothing my eye, Something for sure

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    My father used to say works do not save you, faith in jesus saves you. Works are the manifestation of saving grace, true repentance. Salvation is not earned.

    Works follow from faith, and those who do works out of a sincere heart are merely manifesting their faith. The works themselves earn nothing of salvation.

    So sitting on the couch enjoying salvation and doing absolutely nothing means that the couch potato has no faith, nor belief as is of true repentance. A faithful person will do God's will moved out of compassion, they will act by the motivations of their new nature. Thats the definition of being born again.

    I used to be christian, for a short time and this is what was taught.

    The reason i fell away, was that they wanted me to take the bible as literal history. So i didnt make the christian cut i guess.

    But i do know and enjoy the lessons of true repentance. It even makes sense the context of works in regards to faith.

    It means to me that you cant call yourself a christian, or truly repentant and of a new nature, if you dont manifest the spirit of those things.
     
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  12. Tomas Kindahl

    Tomas Kindahl ... out on my Odyssé — again!

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    Are you speaking of the Pauline teaching or the Protestant teaching after a debate with the Catholics? The problem with returning to the original is that you also need to take into account the interpolations that some non-Paulinist wrote to turn the message of Paul to something that could be accepted by the adherents of that non-Paulinist.

    Either way you have to harmonize that theory of Paul's with the Epistle of James, which claims something dissimilar. Or you can do as me: try to find the real foundation of the Christian religion and suddenly everything crashes!
     
  13. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    I actually do think that they can harmonize,☆ however, the book of James, references fo Abraham, seem,... I don't know. I wouldn't call those works, even without any opposing argument. So, it is what that is.
    Yes, I find the real truth, I don't believe the 'story', that is usually told. Im not really a an 'Epistltlist', either, disagree with some stuff, in there.
    ☆the concepts, can sort of.
     
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  14. Tomas Kindahl

    Tomas Kindahl ... out on my Odyssé — again!

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    OK, then you may be in line with what is Paul's original teaching.
     
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  15. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake ️️️️️️️️️️

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    Yes, probably. Im not a 'religious exclusivist', i find that nonsense.

    I believe the Epistles to be what 'that type of belief', really is.
     
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