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Featured Women should keep silent in the assembly?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by IndigoChild5559, Jun 21, 2021.

  1. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein The Uncuckable
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    Yes: Priscilla and Aquila
     
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  2. wellwisher

    wellwisher Well-Known Member

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    The male brain is wired more front to back and the female brain is wired more from side to side. The wiring, side to side, allows women, on the average, to have more use of both her left and right hemispheres of the brain. This makes women both analytical; left brain and intuitive/emotional; right brain.

    Sometimes the balance between the hemispheres can swing left or right or happen at the same time. She may go from clear headed; left brain, to emotional, right brain, based on hormonal changes. Or both sides may play together, to form a composite of logic and feeling, that men are not always sure how to deal with.

    This side to side wiring is also connected to the audio parts of the brain in each of the two hemispheres; words and symbols of language. Women want and need to talk and communicate to exercise this wiring. Often this is about gossip, since gossip is about human emotions and reasonable cause and affect solutions, which is consistent with their brain wiring.

    The male brain is more front to back; frontal lobe and visual cortex. Men, on the average, tend to have less wiring side to side. They often consciously use one preferred side of the brain, such a left for reasoning skills, with the other side more unconscious; repressed emotions due to less conscious control.

    When a male gets mad, this is often processed unconsciously. The female has more control over the right hemisphere, so she can get mad more willfully and use it to game the system; nag. This is why this is treated different. There is a difference between premeditated and compulsive.

    Men tend to relay more on visual cues than they do on audio cues, due to the wiring front to back. Back before cell phones and GPS, if men and women were driving together and appeared to be lost, the women would want to stop and ask directions; verbal confirmation for good data and a renewed calm feeling. The male would try to use his spatial vision to figure it out; front to back. He would be less conscious of the danger since this emotion is from his more unconscious right brain side.

    These differences is why men and women would teach religion differently. A woman could be too strict or too lax based on her choice of ambient feeling; nag or indulge. If you try to make everyone feel good, you will need to get rid of anything that bothers anyone. The male is less about the ambiance of feeling and about his visual attempt to find a way express the lessons, often without a map.
     
  3. wellwisher

    wellwisher Well-Known Member

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    This was based on a type of husband and wife dynamics; work partners. Paul would lead through his visions without a map, and his work wife would complement him. Priscilla and Aquila could extend his range, through their lateral brain wiring, while allowing his visions to lead. From above this combined wiring forms the sign of the cross.
     
  4. Dan From Smithville

    Dan From Smithville Veteran Member
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    I enjoy how you take the driver's seat on these issues.
     
  5. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    The same is true of the household for us. I'm better at finances, he's better at day to day planning. He certainly doesn't feel emasculated by taking jobs we both agree he's good at. If anything was going to destroy his confidence, it would be setting up expectation that because his dangly bits lay a certain way, he needs to succeed at a job that neither brings him joy nor is part of his talent set.
    The problem isn't with him being a house husband, the problem is with cultural norms demeaning the role.
     
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  6. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
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    About men not asking for directions, my grandfather was the exact opposite of that stereotype. He would stop and ask for directions all the time. Although one thing I didn't know until many years later is that he couldn't read maps. On the other hand, I love maps and prefer to use them as opposed to verbal directions, which I can sometimes get confused due the imprecisions of spoken language. Also, there are some situations where I may not want people to know that I'm lost, so I won't ask for directions. But I've usually been pretty good at finding my way around places. (Although it's different in stores, since I can never find anything in stores.)

    Regarding the difference between male and female brains, I found this article on the subject: Battle of the Brain: Men Vs. Women [Infographic] | Northwestern Medicine

    [​IMG]

    So men have bigger brains, but women have more gray matter.

    But these are just tendencies; it doesn't account for each and every individual. There will always be those who don't follow those tendencies, and they have rights too. That's how I would look at it.
     
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  7. Brian2

    Brian2 Well-Known Member

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    In the epistles it is often difficult to know the full context and the circumstances that are being addressed.
    Paul seems to be wanting to create some order in the gatherings when the people meet. It seems that there could have been a problem in that area with women for some reason.
    This site might give some clues as to the possible reasons.
    What to Say When Someone Says Women Should Be Silent in Church
     
  8. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    Even these pink and blue brain style teachings are being questioned right now due to findings in developmental psychology. Even less difference is found in children's brains with evidence that the malleability exists before parenting starts. What kind of toys and tools you're given as a child exercises parts of your brain that then become your adult 'wiring.' Meaning things we take as innate gender properties may not be.

    What Science Really Says About the Differences Between Boys and Girls

    Because of this a lot of different parenting styles have come into fruition which don't treat boys and girls differently, and it's led to some pretty spectacular results. Like better emotional processing and interpersonal skills on both sides.
    Megan on TikTok
     
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  9. Fallen Prophet

    Fallen Prophet Active Member

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    All of God's children are able to change - to adapt to circumstances given them - but that is irrelevant to the ideal situation.

    Men and women were designed in particular ways - physically, spiritually, mentally, emotionally - to fulfill particular roles.

    Women were designed - ideally - to be the primary "raisers of the children" in more ways than one.

    The fact that people can adapt to less-than-ideal situations does not change that.

    A family or situation not fitting the mold does not mean there is anything wrong with the mold or the family.

    That's just mortality.
    That is an incredibly simplistic viewpoint. Man's instinct and drive to protect - to provide for and instruct - goes far beyond them simply being stronger.
    Irrelevant and not the ideal situation.

    The ideal would be a man being present to fight on behalf of the woman and children.

    However - any fighting a woman can learn to help the man would be awesome.
    Maleness?

    We are speaking of spiritual things - you can put away the college professors and bumper stickers - this ain't a political rally.

    Officiating a worship service or holding the Priesthood has nothing to do with "maleness" or any "greater spiritual insight".

    If anything - Man's need to receive the Priesthood in order to fulfill their spiritual roles may showcase a lack of "spiritual insight" on their part.

    They aren't born with everything they need to fulfill their role - like the ideal woman. They need a constant partnership with God.

    God's organization for the Universe and His Church is similar to His intended organization for the family of Mankind.

    God gives to Man. Man gives to Woman. Woman gives to children - then the cycle continues.

    It is not about superiority or spiritual insight - but about establishing a hierarchy of responsibility.

    For example - even though it was Eve who first decided to partake of the Fruit and convinced Adam to partake - it was Adam who bore the responsibility of that action and the blame.

    He was Eve's husband and Priesthood holder. This is an inalienable thing.

    Just like how only women can conceive - only men can officiate.
    It is the order of Heaven.

    The husband inherits the bulk of the responsibility for his family. His salvation literally depends on it.

    Therefore - an instinct was installed in Man to protect his family - both physically and spiritually.

    That's the ideal anyway.
     
  10. lostwanderingsoul

    lostwanderingsoul Well-Known Member

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    I would have to be as smart as God to understand his reason. I do not claim to be that smart. Perhaps you do?
     
  11. epronovost

    epronovost Well-Known Member

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    Why do you assume that your God is intelligent in the first place?
     
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  12. halbhh

    halbhh The wonder and awe of "all things".

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    Paul wrote letters to various churches, and in each letter, there are specific instructions to that individual church, to help it deal with a problem in that church in that city.

    A theme that Paul repeats over and over, in many of these letters, is that Christians should sacrifice their own freedoms when needed for the sake of the "weak" so that the weak not be lost.

    A famous example of this is that Paul writes he would even give up eating meat (for the rest of his life) if needed, for the sake of a weak brother or sister --

    "9Be careful, however, that the exercise of your rights does not become a stumbling block to the weak. 10For if someone with a weak conscience sees you, with all your knowledge, eating in an idol’s temple, won’t that person be emboldened to eat what is sacrificed to idols? 11So this weak brother or sister, for whom Christ died, is destroyed by your knowledge. 12When you sin against them in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if what I eat causes my brother or sister to fall into sin, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause them to fall."

    Even when the thing that would cause the "weak" to fall is perfectly innocent:

    8But food does not bring us near to God; we are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.

    1 Corinthians 8 NIV

    (and also another very clear example chapter is Romans chapter 14)

    So: even though the freedom we gain allows us to do new things, we are to give up any such freedom -- perfectly OK things that are harmless -- if that freedom would cause another believer that is weak in faith to become lost.

    The instruction to a city where apparently women were disrupting the services was for them to be quiet during the service, in that particular church. While it's 100% ok and fine for a woman to speak up and lead songs, preach and more... == totally fine and good == it is still the case that in a situation where it would cause a "weak" man to be lost, they need to at least temporarily sacrifice some of their perfectly good freedoms for the sake of that weak person.

    There are additional examples, if you need more....

    Yes, that's another, separate question: the best natural order inside a family, for harmony.
     
  13. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    The purpose of the meeting is Not the time to ask questions aka ' interrupt the meeting '.
    The time for questions is ' after ' the meeting.
    First, a woman to ask her husband, and then if need be they ask the spiritually older men in the congregation.
    It has nothing to do with being treated as a child, just as in the accepted headship school system that a teacher is over the student, the principal over the teacher, and the super over the principal.
     
  14. epronovost

    epronovost Well-Known Member

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    There is no specific mention on the nature of the meetings, which could very well be cérémonial or pastoral (aka teaching). It also clearly mentions that women are never to be teacher or hold any authority over men. In other words, a more vulgar way of putting would be quiet and listen and if you don't understand something wait for the end of lectures and ask your husband to explain you that; you are not fit to entertain discussion or debate on those subject. It's infantilising to such a point, that you youself, made an infantilising reference comparing women, in that context, to children in school to defend it.
     
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  15. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    The Bible describes only men as being charged with congregation oversight - Titus 1:5-6; 1 Timothy 3:1-2; James 3:1
    It's the order of creation, Adam first shows God's purpose in oversight (oversight as Adam was to care for Eve)- 1 Timothy 2:12-13.
    Not women clergy inside the congregation, but outside Jesus sent out both men and women (male and female) who can have the same active ministry share in carrying out what Jesus instructed all to do at Matthew 24:14.
    Women even serve as examples to the angels as per 1 Corinthians 11:8-10.

    Please note too that a man's authority is limited. The man is in subjection to Christ and to act accordingly as per 1 Corinthians 11:3.
    Even the congregation itself is to be in subjection to one another in displaying humble behavior as per Ephesians 5:21-30
     
  16. robocop (actually)

    robocop (actually) Well-Known Member
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    Thank you for correcting me. I think I got my idea from jewfaq.org.
     
  17. epronovost

    epronovost Well-Known Member

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    That doesn't make it any less unequal or infantilising towards women and frankly idiotic as it robs Christian congregation of the leadership qualities of its female members as well as their brilliance as teachers and scholars. Nice of you to detail the specific nature of the sexism and stupidity, but that doesn't make it less stupid and sexist.
     
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  18. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    By what the Bible tells, the reason why man did it seems to have been that he wanted to please the woman. Woman did it apparently because she wanted to become like God. I think the one who wants to please is better leader than the one who seeks high position, because that person is thinking others and not just oneself.
     
  19. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Again, we are speaking about -> Not to be interrupting at the meeting.
    True, woman are Not elders, but women can express without interrupting.
    Both men and women can see women's brilliance as teachers (scholarly). ALL are God's fellow workers- 1 Cor.3:9
    Women are to be teachers, just Not take the lead in the congregation meetings - Titus 2:3 B
    Just as Eve was Not Adam's head. Even Christ has a Head over him - 1 Corinthians 3:23 Christ belongs to God.
     
  20. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Sorry I was Not more clear (post # 193) because a college teacher would still be considered as being over an adult student.
     
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