Winners think success was earned even if it was down to luck

[Audie]

"Self-made" is a myth in and of itself.

Which perception explains your response to
what I said.

What you evidently took as a list of myths
is in fact the opposite.

 

[LiveBetterLife]

Which perception explains your response to
what I said.

What you evidently took as a list of myths
is in fact the opposite.

I think you've misinterpreted how I addressed your posts as some kind of argument against what you said. I've actually agreed with a much of what you've said in this thread and the issue is far more complex than you're apparently arriving at.

 

[Audie]

I think you've misinterpreted how I addressed your posts as some kind of argument against what you said. I've actually agreed with a much of what you've said in this thread and the issue is far more complex than you're apparently arriving at.

Which part of this passage is myth?

An extensive survey of millionaires has found out that many myths about them are false. Most millionaires are self made, they did not inherit their money. Most millionaires have ordinary jobs, not jobs like doctors or athletes. Most millionaires do not come from wealthy families, they mostly come from at or below median incentives families.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That we all have constraints in our lives caused by other people, events, and pure chance. does not mean that we do not have free will.
Free will is not unconstrained by our environment, but our environment does present opportunities that we, as free agents, can exploit.
Free will exists and flourishes with in such possibilities, however limited or however broad.

If it is constrained, it is not free will but compatibilism.

 

[LiveBetterLife]

Which part of this passage is myth?

An extensive survey of millionaires has found out that many myths about them are false. Most millionaires are self made, they did not inherit their money. Most millionaires have ordinary jobs, not jobs like doctors or athletes. Most millionaires do not come from wealthy families, they mostly come from at or below median incentives families.

The myth is that there are "many myths [about millionaires]".

You and I have extrapolated this already in this thread. What exactly are you driving at?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

If it is constrained, it is not free will but compatibilism.

We all have free will but there might be consequences. The constraints are not absolute they are conditional. We can choose the harmful as well as the beneficial. It is always our decision.
We're it not so wrong choices would never be our fault.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The myth is that there are "many myths [about millionaires]".

I've known millionaires, and I've heard lots of nonsense about them. And there are indeed many myths. Such as, my step-siblings family, probably more money than anyone on this forum, and the family matriarch and patriarch worked their way up from being poor immigrants to exuberantly wealthy. Not all of their children and grandchildren are rich (my siblings are not). Most of them though have put in the work to make their own income, with only a couple of them "extremely benefiting" from family wealth. They all benefited, but a few of them are very average in terms of intelligence and probably wouldn't have had the money they do if they didn't come from wealth. And because of the generosity of a few in that family, myself and some others have enjoyed things that we would not have otherwise gotten to (ever stay in a castle?).

 

[LiveBetterLife]

I've known millionaires, and I've heard lots of nonsense about them. And there are indeed many myths. Such as, my step-siblings family, probably more money than anyone on this forum, and the family matriarch and patriarch worked their way up from being poor immigrants to exuberantly wealthy. Not all of their children and grandchildren are rich (my siblings are not). Most of them though have put in the work to make their own income, with only a couple of them "extremely benefiting" from family wealth. They all benefited, but a few of them are very average in terms of intelligence and probably wouldn't have had the money they do if they didn't come from wealth. And because of the generosity of a few in that family, myself and some others have enjoyed things that we would not have otherwise gotten to (ever stay in a castle?).

My point is that these "millionaire stories" are all to individual affect and to imply that there are is some kind of conspiratorial "set of myths" about them is reductive at best.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

We all have free will but there might be consequences. The constraints are not absolute they are conditional. We can choose the harmful as well as the beneficial. It is always our decision.
We're it not so wrong choices would never be our fault.

We don't have free will though. So much of what makes us an individual is very dependent upon the culture we come from. Another good chunk depends on genetics and our experiences. Unless we can definitively demonstrate we make no conscious decision (and we already make numerous unconscious ones that we definitely know of), the only reasonable position is compatibilism, because our will is clearly not free enough to be considered free.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

My point is that these "millionaire stories" are all to individual affect and to imply that there are is some kind of conspiratorial "set of myths" about them is reductive at best.

It's not, because myths and stereotypes about the rich exist just as they do for every group. Money can buy many things, social immunity is not one of those things.

 

[LiveBetterLife]

It's not, because myths and stereotypes about the rich exist just as they do for every group. Money can buy many things, social immunity is not one of those things.

I never said there weren't myths about anyone.

What exactly are you trying to argue with me about?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

We don't have free will though. So much of what makes us an individual is very dependent upon the culture we come from. Another good chunk depends on genetics and our experiences. Unless we can definitively demonstrate we make no conscious decision (and we already make numerous unconscious ones that we definitely know of), the only reasonable position is compatibilism, because our will is clearly not free enough to be considered free.

I do not believe that to be the case.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I never said there weren't myths about anyone.

What exactly are you trying to argue with me about?

That there are, factually and indeed, numerous myths regarding the rich. They exist for that group just as they exist for every other group.

 

[LiveBetterLife]

That there are, factually and indeed, numerous myths regarding the rich. They exist for that group just as they exist for every other group.

You may as well take umbrage over the fact that everyone has their own opinion.

Pretty redundant stuff there Shadow.