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Why so many parents fail

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
BTW,

I have found that the ONLY people who ever claim to be experts (or at least act like they are) don't have children. They can tell you all sorts of GREAT theories about how they will do it differently. Usually once their child hits three, they start to realize that they have their hands full. By the time their wittle pwecious is a teenager, they know just how God felt when he had to confront Adam and Eve: totally out of control. :D
 

IndigoChild

Member
EnhancedSpirit said:
I believe most parents do the best they can. We must remember, that they can only use what they have, physically and emotionally. My mother was treated very cruelly by her father, and I'm thankful that she was able to break free of the abusive cycle. She was a heavy handed disciplinarian, but I never doubted that she loved me.

Until a person is taught differently they can only do what they know. They can only react to the stress of parenthood they way they were taught to by their own parents or by society.

And failure is really nothing more than delayed success.
Someone should begin offering parenting classes that take it from the angle of "children are people too," then.

Kat
 

IndigoChild

Member
Faminedynasty said:
I don't believe that all people are ethical, rational or fair enough to make good parents. In fact, millions of parents aren't. It probably has a lot to do with their own parents, the failures of the education system and the selfishness and greed that pervade our society. In addition, many parents don't know how to fairly and effectively discipline and teach their children respect, manners and morals.
Too many people breed because they feel they're required to, and if everyone in their life said it was not expected of them, that they would choose not to, because they don't like children. These people are just one of the groups of people who should not be allowed to vomit in the gene pool.

If I ruled the world, breeders and those wanting to raise children would have to be licensed. If they bred without a license, they would be spayed or neutered.

Kat
 

Fluffy

A fool
Over-Tolerance and Political Correctness. Lack of discipline. Low expectations. Treating children like their are stupid. Talking down to kids. Television. Video Games. Internet. Not enough reading, sports and creativity. Crappy Diets. Forcing children to attend Church. Favoring siblings. Lack of respect between spouses. Lack of communication and love between spouses. Lack of spouse. Placing education entirely in the hands of the Government.

All reasons why parents fail and children suffer.
I agree completely except that I would qualify "lack of discipline". In my opinion, it is either a complete lack of discipline, as you say, or the wrong kind of discipline, such as spanking.
 

DreamQuickBook

Active Member
Fluffy said:
I agree completely except that I would qualify "lack of discipline". In my opinion, it is either a complete lack of discipline, as you say, or the wrong kind of discipline, such as spanking.

Spanking... I think depends on the kid. I could have used a lot more spankings when I was a kid. My parents tried to be "nice" to me and I totally took advantage of them. The only thing I responded too was force and they were too timid to use it. So they couldn't punish me. They could take away everything I had (tv, radio, computer) wouldn't matter. I'd just leave and go to a friends house. They'd "ground me", but I'd just leave anyway. Some kids need to be spanked early, if not out right laid out lol. But like I said, depends on the kid.
 

IndigoChild

Member
I
Jocose said:
Over-Tolerance and Political Correctness. Lack of discipline. Low expectations. Treating children like their are stupid. Talking down to kids. Television. Video Games. Internet. Not enough reading, sports and creativity. Crappy Diets. Forcing children to attend Church. Favoring siblings. Lack of respect between spouses. Lack of communication and love between spouses. Lack of spouse. Placing education entirely in the hands of the Government.

All reasons why parents fail and children suffer.
I've never been a fan of people blaming the Media for their failures with their kids. If you don't want your kids exposed to the violence of the media, then TURN IT OFF. Lock it up, break stuff, do whatever you can to keep kids from it. Blaming the Media and then letting them take it in anyway is the height of hypocrisy.

And Internet? Really... I've been a nethead since I was 13, and I turned out just fine. The net is not the problem. If you raise your kids right, then they'll be responsible net users. I didn't look up porn until I turned 18, and I avoided violent sites on the net like the plague (and still do) because I was raised right.

I'm glad to see you got the thrust of my post, though. :D (That is, re: "Low expectations. Treating children like their are stupid. Talking down to kids... Crappy Diets. Forcing children to attend Church. Favoring siblings. Lack of respect between spouses. Lack of communication and love between spouses... Placing education entirely in the hands of the Government")

Kudos!

Kat
 

IndigoChild

Member
NetDoc said:
BTW,

I have found that the ONLY people who ever claim to be experts (or at least act like they are) don't have children. They can tell you all sorts of GREAT theories about how they will do it differently. Usually once their child hits three, they start to realize that they have their hands full. By the time their wittle pwecious is a teenager, they know just how God felt when he had to confront Adam and Eve: totally out of control. :D
I have helped raise kids, and I am also a long time observer of children. And I have also taken a lot of advice from those who have raised children, like Neale Donald Walsch.

Kat
 

IndigoChild

Member
NetDoc said:
I wonder how many glibly passing "judgement" on these parents actually HAVE kids. :D

Adam and Eve had the BEST parent anyone one could ask for... yet even THEY got kicked out of the garden. Too many kids blame their parents for their own inadequacies. I surely did it when I was a kid and before I became a parent.
The God of the Bible (at least the OT anyway) was a tyrannical, hypocritical, spiteful, vengeful, and arrogant little freak. He apparently grew up and became a halfway decent person by the time Jesus came around, but very few people seem to have figured that part out yet. Any modern parents who behaved as God did in the Old Testament would be thrown in jail for child abuse and murder... "lock him up and throw away the key!"

BTW, I never claimed to be an expert.

Kat
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Silly me. I only sought advice from people who seemed to do a great job raising their kids. But then again, most parents do a fabulous job. They do their best and should be appluaded for doing such a thankless job under the scrutiny of so many HARSH critics.

Of course being a Scoutmaster for many years and now a Sea Scout Skipper gives me no insight into the vagaries of raising kids. Niether does having succesfully raising a daughter (21) and almost raising a son (16), both of whom seem completely well adjusted to the realities of life.
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Indigo Child said:
The God of the Bible (at least the OT anyway) was a tyrannical, hypocritical, spiteful, vengeful, and arrogant little freak.
Here I thought you were only slightly judgmental. My mistake now that you have cleared it up. I wonder if he thinks the same about you?
 

drekmed

Member
sometimes the parents aren't the main effect the kids in some instances. i was raised almost the exact same way my older brother was, only 21 months difference, and i am completely different from him. i have different values, and beliefs, and i dont even act like him. my little sister is 5 years younger than me, and she is somewhat of a mix of my brother and i, as far as personality goes, but more like me. our father is extremely strict and overbearing, and our mother is the type that wont let the child make their own mistakes, overly protective. the reason i am different is because of my experiences and how i percieved them. we were all forced to go to church every sunday morning/night, and every wednesday night, and every night when there was some "revival" at our church, until i was 14. my dad had stopped going at that point because of his work schedule, and i got kicked out of the sunday school class i was in, because i didn't act like i was paying close attention to the teacher and refused to read aloud from the bible or pray aloud. my brother and sister also stopped being forced at this time too. i am the only one of us that is completely against religion being forced on children, take a guess why..... i have always been a little more rebelios than my brother, and my sister more so than i. my brother is rather aggressive in nature, i am extremely passive, and my sister is somewhat aggressive too.
but i digress, big time. but since this is only my second post on the forums, felt i needed to give a little more of my experience in life to explain the position i have.
my feelings are that the children should be not be forced to do anything, however manipulating them into doing something without the threat of force is completely acceptable. also the actual treatment of the child should depend on the child itself. they are people and as such have different personalities than other children you either have, or have seen. the "spare the the rod, spoil the child" idea is completely wrong, however if the child will not learn any other way, then try it out, if it works, it works. but there is no need for it to be the first method tried. just remember that the child will learn a lot by watching what you do and say, but they are also intelligent and can make their own decisions sometimes, so why not let them learn from their mistakes early, since you can only protect them for a short amount of time.

sorry bout the length, and any spelling or grammatical errors, and if this post just sucked in general. im at work and kinda tired. oh, and i am not married and dont have children of my own, so bash my ideas if you must.

drekmed
 

DreamQuickBook

Active Member
NetDoc said:
Here I thought you were only slightly judgmental. My mistake now that you have cleared it up. I wonder if he thinks the same about you?

Most likely too busy thinking about all the people he gets to burn in hell.
 

jamaesi

To Save A Lamb
I have found that the ONLY people who ever claim to be experts (or at least act like they are) don't have children.
The experts were once children, at least.

Most likely too busy thinking about all the people he gets to burn in hell.
What a pleasant G-d to worship. : )
 

IndigoChild

Member
NetDoc said:
Here I thought you were only slightly judgmental. My mistake now that you have cleared it up. I wonder if he thinks the same about you?
I'm not judging against people, just against the incomplete and erroneous concept of God that the Old Testament pushes. It was an okay God for the time, considering what people needed, but now it is just outdated.

Kat
 

IndigoChild

Member
jamaesi said:
The experts were once children, at least.


What a pleasant G-d to worship. : )
Why do you bleep out the o in God? Do you think God really cares about something so petty?

Kat
 

johnnys4life

Pro-life Mommy
Erm, How do you NOT be a hypocrite? I mean, if you want to teach your children that killing is wrong and that's about it...then maybe. Higher standards means you are bound to fail once in a while.
 

Melody

Well-Known Member
IndigoChild said:
Okay, but the main thrust of my post was that adults tend to treat children as sub-human or inhuman creatures, rather than as people with thoughts and feelings of their own.

Kat
Kat, I didn't miss your point and I do agree with you. When I lost my temper one day with my eight year old and treated him with less respect than I should have (backslid to the techniques I was raised with) he looked me right in the eye and said, "Mom, I have the same rights as an adult." In this case meaning he had the same right to expect to be treated with respect. It was not the first or last time I've apologized to my kids. :p

Children most definitely are people and, unfortunately, many people don't think they're people until the graduate from high school/get married/have kids/yada yada. Show me a child who is not shown respect by their parents and I'll show you a future adult who will treat their parents with disrespect.
 
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