Why should God bother showing miracles ?

[chinu]

For example: If a magician need NOT to bother showing magic to his own kids, in order to prove himself as their "Father" ? Then why should God bother showing miracles in order to prove himself as "Creator" ?


Kindly note: please do refrain posting in this thread if you don't expect miracles, thank you.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

God does show us miracles....everyday

Life’s a miracle.
Symbiosis that exists between certain organisms.
The harmony between the four fundamental forces
The beauty of sunrises & sunsets, everyone being different with the clouds.
And the sentience that we alone as physical lifeforms possess, which allows us to recognize them.

 

[chinu]

God does show us miracles....everyday

Life’s a miracle.
Symbiosis that exists between certain organisms.
The harmony between the four fundamental forces
The beauty of sunrises & sunsets, everyone being different with the clouds.
And the sentience that we alone as physical lifeforms possess, which allows us to recognize them.

Friend, thank you for your valuable input !

 

[Nimos]

For example: If a magician need NOT to bother showing magic to his own kids, in order to prove himself as their "Father" ? Then why should God bother showing miracles in order to prove himself as "Creator" ?


Kindly note: please do refrain posting in this thread if you don't expect miracles, thank you.

Its not really the same.

A magician do not prove that he is the father to his children by doing magic tricks. Him living with them and having been part of their whole lives, taking care of them and protecting them proves it.
And if he is a half decent father, he doesn't tell them that he is the creator of the universe either and that he send people that doesn't agree with him to hell for eternal suffering etc.

So really don't see how miracles are relevant in this example, whether they are real or not.

 

[SalixIncendium]

For example: If a magician need NOT to bother showing magic to his own kids, in order to prove himself as their "Father" ? Then why should God bother showing miracles in order to prove himself as "Creator" ?


Kindly note: please do refrain posting in this thread if you don't expect miracles, thank you.

I think the problem most people have is less about God showing them miracles than God showing them God.

A magician would need to show not his magic, but himself, to prove himself as a "Father."

 

[SalixIncendium]

Its not really the same.

A magician do not prove that he is the father to his children by doing magic tricks. Him living with them and having been part of their whole lives, taking care of them and protecting them proves it.
And if he is a half decent father, he doesn't tell them that he is the creator of the universe either and that he send people that doesn't agree with him to hell for eternal suffering etc.

So really don't see how miracles are relevant in this example, whether they are real or not.

There are those that think the creator made the train, got it rolling, stole the brake handle, and left.

This is actually what Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull was writing about in "Locomotive Breath." "Old Charlie" represents God in this classic tune:

"Locomotive Breath"

In the shuffling madness
Of the locomotive breath
Runs the all-time loser
Headlong to his death

Oh, he feels the piston scraping
Steam breaking on his brow
Old Charlie stole the handle
And the train — it won't stop going
No way to slow down

He sees his children jumping off
At stations one by one
His woman and his best friend
In bed and having fun

Oh, he's crawling down the corridor
On his hands and knees
Old Charlie stole the handle
And the train — it won't stop going
No way to slow down

He hears the silence howling
Catches angels as they fall
And the all-time winner
Has got him by the balls

Oh, he picks up Gideon's Bible
Open at page one
I thank God he stole the handle
And the train — it won't stop going
No way to slow down

No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down

 

[chinu]

I think the problem most people have is less about God showing them miracles than God showing them God.

A magician would need to show not his magic, but himself, to prove himself as a "Father."

Okay, which miracle-less way should God adopt to show "His" own self ?

 

[SalixIncendium]

Okay, which miracle-less way should God adopt to show "His" own self ?

By providing evidence that He did what His believers allege he did.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I survived stage 4 cancer, the doctors thought I was a goner, is that a miracle from god or a miracle of science?

 

[SalixIncendium]

I survived stage 4 cancer, the doctors thought I was a goner, is that a miracle from god or a miracle of science?

Why are you even classifying this as a miracle?

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

Why are you even classifying this as a miracle?

Because to me and my family it is a miracle. What do you classify as a miracle?

Give examples, please.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Because to me and my family it is a miracle. What do you classify as a miracle?

Give examples, please.

I don't. Thanks for asking.

Where do you think this miracle came from? Why do you think you were more deserving of such a miracle than others who suffer from cancer?

ETA: I'm sorry, the latter was a loaded question. In all fairness, you asked one as well. Please allow me to rephrase.

Do you think you were more deserving of such a miracle than another that suffers from cancer?

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I don't. Thanks for asking.

Where do you think this miracle came from? Why do you think you were more deserving of such a miracle than others who suffer from cancer?

ETA: I'm sorry, the latter was a loaded question. In all fairness, you asked one as well. Please allow me to rephrase.

Do you think you were more deserving of such a miracle than another that suffers from cancer?

It was clearly a miracle of science, I got a new wonder drug they were testing.

Why was I deserving of the new wonder drug. No idea.

You automatically assumed I thought it was a miracle from god. LOL

 

[SalixIncendium]

It was clearly a miracle of science, I got a new wonder drug they were testing.

Why was I deserving of the new wonder drug. No idea.

You automatically assumed I thought it was a miracle from god. LOL

If I assumed that, I wouldn't have asked...

Where do you think this miracle came from?

So you kinda assumed I assumed that.

But I'm genuinely happy for you and applaud your survival. I know it's not the new drug alone that saved your life. It takes a strong person and strong support.

 

[chinu]

By providing evidence that He did what His believers allege he did.

All believers who represents themselves as believers are NOT true believers. Mostly there are just false people making false claims.

 

[SalixIncendium]

All believers who represents themselves as believers are NOT true believers. Mostly there are just false people making false claims.

I'm not sure "mostly" is quite accurate, but I would agree that many believers are such by way of Pascal's wager.

 

[pearl]

I find it interesting that in the Gospel of John 'miracles' are not mentioned, as he refers to them as 'signs', a symbol of something greater than what the eye sees. Those who witnessed them raised the same question, what was the source, power of His miracles, was it from God or an evil source, magic? The miracle of healing the 'blind man' was not his physical sight, but his recognition of who Jesus is. Today we often hear, 'its a miracle, I found a parking place.'

"If you really heard a bird sing, if you really saw a tree you would know, Beyond words and concepts. If you look at a tree and see a tree you have not really seen the tree. When you look at the tree and see a miracle-then, at last, you have seen! Did you heart never fill with wordless wonder when you heard a bird in song? (deMello)

 

[chinu]

I find it interesting that in the Gospel of John 'miracles' are not mentioned, as he refers to them as 'signs', a symbol of something greater than what the eye sees. Those who witnessed them raised the same question, what was the source, power of His miracles, was it from God or an evil source, magic? The miracle of healing the 'blind man' was not his physical sight, but his recognition of who Jesus is. Today we often hear, 'its a miracle, I found a parking place.'

"If you really heard a bird sing, if you really saw a tree you would know, Beyond words and concepts. If you look at a tree and see a tree you have not really seen the tree. When you look at the tree and see a miracle-then, at last, you have seen! Did you heart never fill with wordless wonder when you heard a bird in song? (deMello)

Thank you for your reply.

 

[chinu]

Ithat he send people that doesn't agree with him to hell for eternal suffering etc.

God told all this to you in person ?

 

[chinu]

I thank God he stole the handle
And the train — it won't stop going
No way to slow down

No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down
No way to slow down

Good song!