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Why Quran's surrahs are not in order of Revelations?

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
It may seem majestic and magical to you, but that is only because you are not trained to recognise the derivative tropes of ancient superstition and mythology. And I repeat, maybe you are overwhelmed by confirmation bias and cognitive dissonance.

From a neutral perspective, both are possible, so people should keep in mind both when coming to Quran. They should not have confirmation bias nor cognitive dissonance and keep in mind possibility that Satan and his magic might be real and preventing them from seeing Quran for it's wonders and glory.
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
This is a serious question - since you believe in such things, how can you be sure that it is not YOU who is overwhelmed with sorcery?

I went through a lot of blindness to Quran in my life. I know what it looks to a person overwhelmed by sorcery. That said, sorcery of Iblis if you defeat it, you do so by the heavenly lights of Ahlulbayt (a) and I've yet to fully defeat it. They are connected through the Imam of time and sword of God on earth, and with that you can use them as weapons against Iblis by permission of God, Imam and Ahlulbayt (a). I am still largely possessed by it and by demonic forces. I haven't overcome my Qareen nor can I even claim I don't associate Iblis with God. I can't claim it, my mind knows God is One and the truth, but my heart is dark and deviated, and probably equates Satan with God.
 

KWED

Scratching head, scratching knee
From a neutral perspective, both are possible, so people should keep in mind both when coming to Quran. They should not have confirmation bias nor cognitive dissonance
From a neutral perspective, both may be possible, but they certainly aren't equally as likely. This seems to be a common logical error by apologists.

We know that people make stuff up as a means of gaining power and control over others, or fame and recognition, etc. We know that people suffer delusions that feel completely real. Therefore an explanation based on dishonesty or delusion is quite likely.
There is zero evidence for gods, satan and the supernatural, and every attempt to demonstrate their existence has failed. We also know that there are many conflicting, contradictory version of gods and religion. Therefore any explanation relying on them can be regarded as unlikely.

and keep in mind possibility that Satan and his magic might be real and preventing them from seeing Quran for it's wonders and glory.
For this to be considered a reasonable possibility, one first must show that satan actually exists. Otherwise you must consider the possibility that leprechauns are preventing you from seeing that the Quran is just ancient superstition, as genuine and reasonable.
 

KWED

Scratching head, scratching knee
I went through a lot of blindness to Quran in my life. I know what it looks to a person overwhelmed by sorcery. That said, sorcery of Iblis if you defeat it, you do so by the heavenly lights of Ahlulbayt (a) and I've yet to fully defeat it. They are connected through the Imam of time and sword of God on earth, and with that you can use them as weapons against Iblis by permission of God, Imam and Ahlulbayt (a). I am still largely possessed by it and by demonic forces. I haven't overcome my Qareen nor can I even claim I don't associate Iblis with God. I can't claim it, my mind knows God is One and the truth, but my heart is dark and deviated, and probably equates Satan with God.
But if satan is making you think that, you wouldn't know, would you?
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
From a neutral perspective, both may be possible, but they certainly aren't equally as likely. This seems to be a common logical error by apologists.

We know that people make stuff up as a means of gaining power and control over others, or fame and recognition, etc. We know that people suffer delusions that feel completely real. Therefore an explanation based on dishonesty or delusion is quite likely.
There is zero evidence for gods, satan and the supernatural, and every attempt to demonstrate their existence has failed. We also know that there are many conflicting, contradictory version of gods and religion. Therefore any explanation relying on them can be regarded as unlikely.

For this to be considered a reasonable possibility, one first must show that satan actually exists. Otherwise you must consider the possibility that leprechauns are preventing you from seeing that the Quran is just ancient superstition, as genuine and reasonable.

Your probability analysis of which one is more likely is purely conjecture based.
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
But if satan is making you think that, you wouldn't know, would you?

You can detect(1) the force of God and holy spirit (Imam) and Angels vs (2) Satan and his forces and his dark magic if you begin to take refuge in God and battle against Iblis.
 

KWED

Scratching head, scratching knee
Your probability analysis of which one is more likely is purely conjecture based.
:tearsofjoy:
No. It is based on hard evidence.
We have hard evidence that proves people lie to get what they want.
We have hard evidence that people have delusions that seem perfectly real to them.
We have zero evidence for gods, satan or the supernatural.
FACTS! Deal with them.
 

KWED

Scratching head, scratching knee
You can detect(1) the force of God and holy spirit (Imam) and Angels vs (2) Satan and his forces and his dark magic if you begin to take refuge in God and battle against Iblis.
No you can't. You are delusional.
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
:tearsofjoy:
No. It is based on hard evidence.
We have hard evidence that proves people lie to get what they want.
We have hard evidence that people have delusions that seem perfectly real to them.
We have zero evidence for gods, satan or the supernatural.
FACTS! Deal with them.

You have no evidence of the last statement. That's a fact. Make a thread showing you understand all arguments for God properly and why they don't make sense. But I guarantee you will strawman the arguments and not be able to present them as they truly are.
 

KWED

Scratching head, scratching knee
You have no evidence of the last statement. That's a fact. Make a thread showing you understand all arguments for God properly and why they don't make sense. But I guarantee you will strawman the arguments and not be able to present them as they truly are.
Are you seriously claiming that there is no evidence for there being no evidence for gods, satan and the supernatural?
If so, you are essentially saying that there is evidence for them.
So, present it and win all those as yet unclaimed prizes for producing said evidence. You will be a very rich man!
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
So, present it and win all those as yet unclaimed prizes for producing said evidence. You will be a very rich man!

I will be doing that exactly soon. Writing books. Let's see what happens.
 
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