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Featured Why Jesus Will Never Return and How the Bible Refutes Itself

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Hubert Farnsworth, Jun 4, 2019.

  1. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    I would say it is clearly not Biblical.

    You want to believe in the fallacy because it confirms your bias of Christianity being a fallacy.

    No, matter of fact the Bible warns of people that want to fly God's children away.

    Ezekiel 13: 19-23

    19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?

    20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.

    21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the Lord.

    22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:

    23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the Lord.

    Clearly the Lord does not like the idea of teaching people that some people will be whisked away from danger at the last moment.

    Matthew 24: 31

    31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    Doesn't say anything about whisking them away to Heaven. To say this represents the rapture is a stretch of the imagination to say the least. Master of fact it references the elect. The elect is a very small number of people. They are not all Jews/Christian's, or even a majority of, as some would like to believe. So again this refutes the rapture doctrine as false.
     
  2. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Yes it would to be considered Biblical.

    You look at the fallacies like the rapture then promote it as true so that you can use it as an argument against Christianity. You've done it here just now above.

    Straw man - Wikipedia

    From above: A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent.

    It's just one straw man argument after another, using fallacies that are either not present in the Bible, taken out of context, or scripture twisted to suit your needs.
     
  3. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    Good grief...

    The Rapture is a message of comfort (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18)

    The charlatans have completely screwed it up.
     
  4. stvdv

    stvdv Well-Known Member

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    Why Jesus Will Never Return and How the Bible Refutes Itself
    Never say Never again ... Good teaching of "James Bond 007"

    I just use common sense:
    1) Universe is very Big
    2) Human is very Small

    Conclusion: This Small human pretending to know about the future is Funny at best ... claiming HisBelief=UniversalTruth
     
  5. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    The final judgement of Matthew 25:31-33 is still ahead of us.
    The final signal of 1 Thessalonains 5:2-3 is still ahead of us before Revelation 7:14,9 leading up to Armageddon.
     
  6. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Rather, I find it is resurrection Not rapture for the dead.
    The humble 'figurative 'sheep' at the coming time of Matthew 25:31,37,40 are living people on Earth.
    Those living people can remain alive and continue to live on Earth right into the start of calendar Day One of Jesus' coming 1,000-year governmental reign over Earth.
    They come through the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9 alive on Earth.
    They are Not in some oxygen deprived atmosphere but are as Isaiah 26:20 says.
     
  7. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    The tribulation was local and it was over in 70 AD. Jesus told his followers to flee to the mountains.. They went to Pella.

    Isaiah 26:20 is part of a song. .. to hide and wait out the tribulation.

    (Read Isaiah 26:20,21)

    When dangers threaten, it is good to retire and lie hid; when we commend ourselves to God to hide us, he will hide us either under heaven or in heaven. Thus we shall be safe and happy in the midst of tribulations. It is but for a short time, as it were for a little moment; when over, it will seem as nothing. God's place is the mercy-seat; there he delights to be: when he punishes, he comes out of his place, for he has no pleasure in the death of sinners. But there is hardly any truth more frequently repeated in Scripture, than God's determined purpose to punish the workers of iniquity. Let us keep close to the Lord, and separate from the world; and let us seek comfort in secret prayer. A day of vengeance is coming on the world, and before it comes we are to expect tribulation and suffering. But because the Christian looks for these things, shall he be restless and dismayed? No, let him repose himself in his God. Abiding in him, the believer is safe. And let us wait patiently the fulfilling of God's promises.
     
  8. BilliardsBall

    BilliardsBall Well-Known Member

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    Your English skills can help you as we explore the possible meanings of the word, in ENGLISH, I'll help you and the other skeptics by highlighting each of the varied meanings that indicates "the generation that Jesus was speaking to, the people living when He spoke":

    1. fathered, birth, nativity

    2. that which has been begotten, men of the same stock, a family
      1. the several ranks of natural descent, the successive members of a genealogy

      2. metaph. a group of men very like each other in endowments, pursuits, character
        1. esp. in a bad sense, a perverse nation
    3. ***the whole multitude of men living at the same time***

    4. ***an age (i.e. the time ordinarily occupied be each successive generation), a space of 30 - 33 years***
    5. 1. a begetting, birth, nativity: Herodotus 3, 33; Xenophon, Cyril 1, 2, 8, etc.; [others make the collective sense the primary significance, see Curtius as above].
    6. 2. passively, that which has been begotten, men of the same stock, a family;
      a. properly, as early as Homer; equivalent to מִשְׁפָּחַה, Genesis 31:3, etc. σῴζειν Ῥαχάβην κ. τὴν γενεὰν αὐτῆς, Josephus, Antiquities 5, 1, 5. the several ranks in a natural descent, the successive members of a genealogy: Matthew 1:17, (ἑβδόμη γενεὰ οὗτός ἐστιν ἀπὸ τοῦ πρώτου, Philo, vit. Moys.
     
  9. OtherSheep

    OtherSheep <--- Bethulah

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    The bigger question is How can you tell who's "the dead in Christ" and who's a locust from the pit?
     
  10. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    The locusts are the invading armies of Rome.

    The weird locust-like beings will swarm up from the bottomless pit to torment mankind with excruciating stings for 5 months (Revelation 9:2-10).

    "5 months" is key.. It was over in August during the grape harvest and had begun in April.
     
  11. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Well one is an unrepentant sinner, and the other is an intentional sinner. Of course it's very hard to discern intent, other than pay close attention to the word.
     
  12. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    What happened with, "Behold I come shortly"*, and the issues regarding Paul's meeting with Christ** which effectively nullifies the second coming , or at least nullifies the entirety of Pauline Christianity.

    *Two thousand plus years and counting is a short time? Or are people abducted by aliens really screwing up their senses as to exactly what a short time is?

    **What happened to, If one hears to and fro that I am the Christ , to believe him not?
     
    #72 Nowhere Man, Jun 6, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2019
  13. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    Well, remember the Temple was destroyed and the tribulation happened AFTER the death of Paul.
     
  14. It Aint Necessarily So

    It Aint Necessarily So Well-Known Member
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    I don't need an argument against Christianity. I have no interest in any religion because I see no reason to believe in gods, nor to participate in religions. I'm already happy.

    It's like you're trying to trade a used car with somebody whose present car runs well.

    What?
     
  15. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Doesn't change the fact atheist tend to argue fallacies which are inherently weak arguments because they are false to begin with.
     
  16. BilliardsBall

    BilliardsBall Well-Known Member

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    I listed meanings of the word "generation" showing multiple possibilities against your remark, "failed prophecy". This is not a failed prophecy:

    "This generation [the Jewish people] will BE IN ISRAEL WHEN I RETURN TO THE REBUILT TEMPLE IN JERUSALEM."

    Indeed, having recently been in Jerusalem, I see this prophecy as soon to be fulfilled. The "generation" is THERE NOW, TRYING TO REBUILD THE TEMPLE.
     
  17. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    For one thing, in God's eyes a thousand years is as a day - 2 Peter 3:8
    So, it has only been a mere 'two days' in waiting time.
     
  18. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    It must be very upsetting for God to have that level of Dyschronometria.
     
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  19. TrueBeliever37

    TrueBeliever37 Active Member

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    Hi BilliardsBall,

    I know I am a little off topic, but don't you believe it's possible that the temple to be built was going to be a spiritual temple instead of a natural one? 1 Corinthians 3:16, 6:19, and 2 Corinthians 6:16 let us know our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit, and Ephesians 2:20-22 says all the building fitly framed together growth unto an holy temple...

    1 Peter 2:5 says ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house...
     
  20. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Just like with marriage happiness is Not a criteria but being self-sacrificing is. (for better or worse)
    To follow Christ one must ' pick up ' his (Christ's) model-example role to follow - 1 Peter 2:21
    So, it does Not matter if you are happy or unhappy for that matter.
    If you want to pick the day you want to die ___________ then have No interest in religion.
    If you think you don't look forward to the day you die, then it is Jesus who offers you everlasting life.
    For most people ' everlasting life ' on a beautiful coming paradisical Earth as Eden was.
    Everlasting life on Earth because ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth as per 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8
     
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