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Featured Why Islam makes more sense conceptually of all the Abrahamic faiths

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Epic Beard Man, Jul 16, 2018.

  1. Spiderman

    Spiderman Veteran Member

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    If Islam is the true faith, why did Allah leave such dispute over the rightful heir?

    You speak of Trump negatively, but Trump doesn't chop off heads or talk about having his enemies tortured and mutilated. Do you need me to quote the Qur'an again about burning people, crucifying them, torturing them, cutting off hands and feet?

    If Islam is the true faith, why is Islam the Religion that tortures, bullies, imprisons, and mutilates the most people (for Religious reasons) of any Religion on Earth, in the 21st century?

    Why do Islamic regimes make sex-slaves of non-muslims, but no 1st world Christian regimes do this (that I know of).?

    Why are the most misogynistic laws in the 21st century found in Muslim Theocracies, if it is the true faith?
     
  2. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    That's fine, I'm not trying to convince you to agree about what reality is, only to explain that the special relationship we believe we have is not meant to exclude a relationship between G-d and non-Jews as it seemed that you said about Judaism in your OP.

    Yes, that's the one.
     
  3. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    What I find common in a lot of religious faiths is that historical faiths all tend to diverge from whence their original message was intended for and a similar paradigm shift can be said about its adherents. Sometimes the death of charasmatic leaders produces the fragmentation of a once unifying ideology.
     
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  4. Desert Snake

    Desert Snake Veteran Member

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    Your context is fictional, there are many religions, if you are not religious, christianity is the 'older' religion than judaism, with the form deity /egypt, ankh , and pre-judaism mythic similaritiy to m east polytheistic concepts.


    So forth. You seem to like to create your own fictional paradigms for these subjects, without actually researching anything.
     
    #104 Desert Snake, Jul 17, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2018
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  5. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    It is disappointing isn't it? I am fairly close to abandoning the whole business and just trying to find the intelligent Creator.
     
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  6. Spiderman

    Spiderman Veteran Member

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    He claims to have studied Islam for ten years and claims "Muslims are required to respect all creatures."

    That is like saying, "I've studied Fascism for ten years, and fascists are required to respect all creatures".

    The Qur'an contains far more hate, violence, and graphic torture than Mussolini's "Doctrine of Fascism."

    The Doctrine of Fascism contained no graphic torture at all. Not so with the Koran.
     
  7. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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  8. Spiderman

    Spiderman Veteran Member

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    Hence,
    @Epic Beard Man
    I proved that you speak ignorance about the Religion you claim to have "studied for ten years."

    What I have a problem with is Fascist Dictatorships!

    Muhammad established a Fascist form of government.

    I read Mussolini's "Doctrine of Fascism" and it was very spiritual, Monotheistic, and Religious!

    Muhammad was a statesman and a Fascist Dictator.

    Im very troubled to see so many people like yourself, claiming to be for equal rights and social justice, while promoting Fascism which robs so many people of liberties and threatens us all!
     
  9. Tumah

    Tumah Veteran Member

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    Are we agreeing to disagree about what Judaism says?
    What do you mean that G-d has an exclusive relationship with G-d?
    Does the Talmud factor into your position about Judaism's stance or only the Tanach?

    Again, I am not trying to convince you about the truths of Judaism. I'm only trying to correct your understanding about what Judaism says. I don't particularly care if you believe it to be true or not, I just don't want you to accidentally present Judaism as saying something it doesn't.
     
  10. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
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    Your communication if aggressive and offensive. We won't talk.
     
  11. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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  12. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    Can you explain what the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is.

    Christ Jesus fortold in Mark 13, what the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is.
    And when it will happen.
    And who can commit it.
     
  13. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    Like I said, you have no understanding about the bible.
    As you have not answered, for what reason did God come down here, in the body of flesh of Jesus Christ.
    What was the real purpose for God to do this.
    There was a reason behind, About Moses, Noah, Abraham, What God did.
     
  14. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

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    Nope on the contrary, it's just a simple question, When did the original sin take place. It happen way before the book of Genesis was written.
    And way before Adam and Eve came to be.
     
  15. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Islam doesn't make more sense; it is a mess of plagiarization without all the additional contexts, as it matches Rabbinic Judaism's ideas since the Babylonian Exile, and not the Tanakh:

    The God Most High (El Elyon) gave Israel to YHVH Elohim as his nation (Deuteronomy 32:7-9).

    YHVH Elohim said he would become Yeshua Elohim to set a Snare for the whole of mankind, which catches out those who don't pay attention to additional contexts.

    H3444 (Yeshua) + H1961 (To become) = Exodus 15:2-3, Psalms 118:14-21, Isaiah 12:2

    Please don't claim to acknowledge the prophets, when it sounds more like reading what external scholars have to say about the religious beliefs, and not the texts.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
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  16. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    “Deniers of Baha’ism” is an addition to the text inserted by the Muslim divines, the term “donkey” is stated in response to an individual and forms Baha’u’llahs way of critiquing that individual for being able to carry the scriptures but not understand them.
    Hence the reason donkey is not in the plural form because it does not refer to all deniers of the Baha’i faith
     
  17. LuisDantas

    LuisDantas Aura of atheification
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    Is that so?

    It seems to me that some diversity of interpretation and implementation is not only expected, but also healthy. There is also a real need to consider the change of possibilities arising from historical, social and technological circunstances. That, too, has some effect on religious priorities and possibilities - and it should.

    Reliance on the originator is not necessarily a good trait, and it does not explain nor justify the actual lengths of divergence that happen later.

    And again, Islaam is rather remarkable in that respect, even among the Abrahamic doctrines.
     
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  18. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    What comes to mind is the following:

    "Most Jews hold that being the "Chosen People" means that they have been placed on earth to fulfill a certain purpose. Traditional proof for Jewish "chosenness" is found in the Torah, the Jewish bible, in the Book of Deuteronomy (chapter 14) where it says: "For you are a holy people to Hashem your God, and God has chosen you to be his treasured people from all the nations that are on the face of the earth." In the Book of Genesis (chapter 17) it also written: "And I [G-d] will establish My covenant between Me and you [the Jewish people] and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you."

    Source:https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/the-quot-chosen-people-quot

    The source also notes:

    "But does "chosenness" really mean the Jews were divinely chosen? After all, how did the notion of one God become known to the world? Through the Jews. And, according to Jewish sources, that is the meaning of chosenness: to make God known to the world. As Rabbi Louis Jacobs has written: "We are not discussing a dogma incapable of verification, but the recognition of sober historical fact. The world owes to Israel the idea of the one God of righteousness and holiness. This is how God became known to mankind."


    Although accurate in relation to being the oldest among the Abrahamic faiths, the concept of monotheism was not even brought about solely from Judaismas Zoroastrianism is older than Judaism and the belief in the one god Aten, worshipped by Akhenaten is older than that. It is even argued by Muslim scholars that Islam is primordial faith of all mankind or fitrah in Surah al-A’raaf 7:172 :

    And [mention] when your Lord took from the children of Adam - from their loins - their descendants and made them testify of themselves, [saying to them], "Am I not your Lord?" They said, "Yes, we have testified." [This] - lest you should say on the day of Resurrection, "Indeed, we were of this unaware."


    So although according to Judaism, Jews are tasked with duties to fulfill and are chosen above all nations to fulfill them, Islam takes the general approach in that all human beings prior to their existence in the world made a covenant with God. I get your explanation but however you slice it, the philosophy behind chosenness still has an exclusionary element.
     
  19. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    You tell me Christian, how this makes sense?
     
  20. Epic Beard Man

    Epic Beard Man Bearded Philosopher

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    Yup, right! In your opinion...Next!
     
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