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Featured Why is Islam so dangerous?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Raymann, Apr 25, 2019.

  1. Road Warrior

    Road Warrior Seeking the middle path..

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    The Old Testament is full of similar blood and guts. Slavery, execution for specific crimes like homosexuality, etc.

    Examples: Bible Gateway passage: 1 Samuel 15 - New International Version
    Samuel said to Saul, “I am the one the Lord sent to anoint all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

    Bible Gateway passage: Joshua 6 - New International Version
    20 When the trumpets sounded, the army shouted, and at the sound of the trumpet, when the men gave a loud shout, the wall collapsed; so everyone charged straight in, and they took the city. 21 They devoted the city to the Lord and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.
     
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  2. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    By what authority do YOU speak for most Muslims?
     
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  3. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    The entire new testament comes from decades till centuries after the death of jesus as well.
    I don't see how this is relevant.

    The fact of the matter is that a great many people consider those hadiths to be very important in their religious experience and beliefs.

    I don't give a rat's behind what is "truelly" authenticated (in your opinion) or what isn't.
    What matters is what people actually believe.

    Just like I don't give a rat's behind what shariah law is "truelly" all about (in your opinion) or not.
    What matters is how it is actually implemented in practice.
     
  4. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    I don't authenticate hadiiths.. There were over 60,000 of them.
     
  5. Raymann

    Raymann Member

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    Not according to this article:
    The most dangerous verse in the Quran


    Those who have disbelieved were Christians.
    Why do they have to be forced out of their religion?
    Their only crime was to believe in Jesus, what is wrong with that?
    What hostility is this verse talking about?
    Believing in Jesus is not committing any hostility.
    Use your brain.
    How is it that you happen to forget to mention that the messenger who delivered the letter enter into the Byzantine's territory and suggested to the Byzantines they should worship Allah, the only real God?
    The problem is that the Byzantines official religion at the time was Christianity and just like in Islam Christianity had a thing called BLASPHEMY.
    Suggesting to the Byzantines that they were worshiping a false God (Jesus) was actually committing the crime of blasphemy and the penalty was death.
    This is the reason the Muslims attacked the Byzantines even when THEY WERE NEVER ATTACKED, violating one of the most sacred rules of Islam and setting a bad precedent for the future.
    Today groups like ISIS take advantage of this bad example.
    Again, it is in the Islamic culture to use Hadith and the Terrorists know which ones to use.
    Winning with the voice of reason and wisdom in Islamic countries?
    Are you serious?

    I give you that, I haven't compared the level of violence in them.
    The thing is that Jews and Christians somehow manage to ignore the violent passages better than Muslims.


     
  6. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    Wouldn't mind that either.

    Well, scratch that... I would actually mind the books themselves disappearing.
    I would mind the religions being erased from collective memory, as they clearly are a very important part of our collective cultural heritage.

    What I actually wouldn't mind, is for all those religious believers to stop taking their religion so bloody seriously.
     
  7. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    I think the same goes for theists in general.
     
  8. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    200,000? LOLOL.. What a joke. American Thinker is such a dumb rag.
     
  9. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    Which is just as irrelevant.

    Also, the 'your' in "(in your opinion)" that I added there, isn't necessarily about you... it is about anyone who wishes to express their opinion / beliefs about them.

    It's basically a no true scottsman.
    Every christian denomination thinks THEY have the correct "interpretation" or "understanding" or "revelation" and that ALL the others got it wrong.

    Islamic denominations aren't any different.
    You say that hadith isn't "relevant" because it's not "authenticated". Cool.
    For a great many muslims though, they are very relevant. So they disagree with you.

    You obviously think you are correct. But they think the same.

    And I'm just an external bystander watching you argue about it - which to me seems very similar to fighting a war using action figures.

    So I don't care what "true islam" is.
    I only care about how it is being practiced - because it's the actual practice that has effects on society and other people. The rest is not relevant for me.

    I don't care about Islam - the religion, any more then I care about the Norse gods.
    But I do care about people and how they behave and how their behaviour affects society.


    And what I see is that Islam seems to have a FAR larger share of fundamentalists as opposed to a religion like christianity for example.

    I also note that the radicals in Islam are, in general, a lot more dangerous and violent then their christian counterparts. Christians today, for example, don't have a habbit or tendency to form militia's armed to the teeth to go on killing sprees and organize brutal terrorist attacks on innocent bystanders.

    Let's not pretend as if this isn't a problem in the islamic culture.
    Let's not pretend as if when we see on the news that some bomb exploded somewhere in a public space, that "muslim terrorism" isn't the very first thing on our minds. Let's also not pretend that more often then not, that first thought will also be correct.
    Let's not pretend that these militia's aren't motivated by their islamic religious beliefs.
    Let's not pretend that suicide bombers religiously believe that as islamic martyrs, a special place of glory is reserved for them in paradise where they will be rewarded for their "great courage" and "righteous action".


    Please, let's not pretend.
     
  10. Mark Sinista

    Mark Sinista seeker of Truth

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    Yeah Christians ignore the violent laws today but don't tell me it happened overnight.

    There are only 15 countries that implement Sharia Law fully and partly. There are around 50 muslim majority countries, and the rest represent the majority. The other countries live without Sharia Law just fine.

    l live in a Muslim country and we are living with other religions just fine. I have friends and co-workers of other religions and beliefs. We all get vacations on our religious festive days. We join them too. Extremists are not taken kindly by the law here. Women are not oppressed here to follow any Sharia rules. They live freely as they see fit.

    Yes many of the muslims follow hadiths. But tell me the reality of it. They follow those mainly to know how to pray, how to fast, how to dress, what's forbidden to eat, how to go by daily days in general. When I talk with hadith followers, they don't even know about the violent things in them nor do they follow them, nor do they preach them. They don't even know about the so called violent verses of the Quran.

    Things are changing gradually on Sharia Law imposed countries too. People are getting vocal about this more and more. Change will come.

    The extremism and terrorism are hated by the majority of the Muslims. They too have the risk of suffering because of those terrorists as much as the west do. The forming of terrorists didn't rely solely on the religious factors. There are other much complex factors in play.

    Now back to the original topic, "Why Islam is so dangerous?" So dangerous that the question of inevitable war against Islam is raised.

    We have established that the core teachings of Islam doesn't teach us violence. Also, the terrorists are only a minority and the majority only want to live in peace.

    So why the the hate against Muslims in general? If you start war against us, how's that fair? by proposing the idea you are leaning towards the extremist spectrum yourselves.

    I made my point and after this nothing I can say that can change your minds if not already. I respect other religions and didn't degrade them in any of my post. I expect to be shown the same respect. The debate will never end as I said in my first post. Nothing we say here is gonna change that much anyway. I leave my knowledge here for the people and their understanding.
     
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  11. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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    The US drove people into the arms of the religious fanatics while trying to fight left-leaning influence.

    Look up the Egyptian Revolutionary Command Council.
     
  12. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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    This is hilarious cherry picking.
     
  13. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Ploughing my own furrow
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    If one believes Shariah to be the whole shebang as you have set it out, and as certainly quite a few Muslims believe, then, yes, the two cannot be separated. But not all Muslims believe that.
     
  14. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Ploughing my own furrow
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    How so?
     
  15. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    Left leaning influences where?
     
  16. Raymann

    Raymann Member

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    Who's is the dumb rag?
    The Internet Site (American Thinker) or the author of the article?
    For your information, he didn't invent the figure "200,000".
    The info is available with little effort:
    Take a look:
    Historiography[edit]
    According to al-Waqidi and Ibn Ishaq, the Muslims were informed that 100,000[6] or 200,000[7] enemy troops were encamped at Balqa'.[6][19] Consequently, modern historians refute this stating the figure to be exaggerated.[8][9][10] According to Walter Emil Kaegi, professor of Byzantine history at the University of Chicago, the size of the entire Byzantine army during the 7th century might have totaled 100,000, possibly even half this number.[20] While the Byzantine forces at Mu'tah are unlikely to have numbered more than 10,000.[a][11]

    Battle of Mu'tah

    Are you planning on apologizing to this gentleman?
    That was very rude on your part.


    I was expecting some kind of rebuttal after I provided good reason to believe my interpretations are the correct ones.
    Is it that easy to prove the Quran passages are violent?
    Go figure!
     
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  17. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    I'm saying the number are grossly exaggerated just as they are in the Old Testament.
     
  18. The Emperor of Mankind

    The Emperor of Mankind Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic

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    Do you include the hadiths considered 'sahih' in this?
     
  19. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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    Nassar. The Kurd rebels are socialist, The Shah purged socialists only to need them against the religious. Afghanistan. The Ba'ath Party started as a socialist party. Look up Pan-Arabism
     
  20. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

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    Nasser wanted to build the Aswan Dam and Eisenhower agreed to finance it.. After the Lavon Affair, Eisenhower withdrew his offer driving Nasser into the arms of the Soviets and causing the Suez Crisis.

    I remember it like it was yesterday. The Shia rioted in Arabia.
     
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