Why is being gay considered wrong?

[Aqualung]

Yes he is, at homosexuals. He is calling homosexuals 'poison'.

No. He is not calling homosexuals poison. He is saying that if they are also calling themselves good christians they are mixing two imcompatible things. For all anyone should care, the poison is the church and the purity is the homosexuality. It makes no difference, because the point he put across is that the two seem incompatible to him, just as a poison is incompatible with something pure.

 

[Cold-Stone]

Cold-Stone, you can call me a hypocrit all you want. The fact is I am just calling them as I see them. I have always been a very open and blunt person. If I don't like something I say it. Just ask anyone on this board that has talked to me frequently to see that is true. I, however, don't base my "judgements" on personal translations of a book. I base what I say on what I SEE and THINK. I base my thoughts on educated research and science and fact. What gets me is that you don't. You are more willing to condemn those you don't truly understand and label as "poison" while you, of the "purity" you are, can keep yourself on a pedestal and make your "judgements" based on what you THINK your "God" wants. You presume to be the "know-all" of Christianity and yet it seems that you are in the vast minority of Christians on this forum that feel as adament as you on every stance you take. You have made VERY rude and presumptious statements here that are downright offensive to those you say you are trying to "help". Ever hear you get more flies with honey than with vinegar? And you are just drowning us in vinegar.

Yes Draka. When you get hot and heavy and misquote Matthew 7:1 (it's become the homosexual's most popular misquoted verse)-and then right after tell me thou shall not judge, you turn around and start to judge me for judging, that is hypocritical. Go back and read what you did. It's in text so you can't escape what you did : )

I don't have a problem with judgement (which is valid and godly). YOU DO. Thus I don't mind you judging and thinking and articulating. YOU DO.

Now if you've recanted your previous position and have joined my side, I want to congratulate you for crossing over the line from the secular to the Christian position.

Congratuations - It is my pleasure to help and serve you in your pursuit in the analyse in the market place of ideas. I doubt you'll use that absurdity again. : )

Jensa

It is your perspective, simple as that.

The cliche that all reality is perception was based off the philosophy of Bishop Berkley. (lol). This philosophy is self refuting. Since it is the biblical perspective (not mine) that perspective deems reality, the Bishop's wrong. Please, no cliche's please. This is based on pre-existential subjective analysis which is the skepticism and off topic of this forum discussion. If you want philosophy, start another thread and I will mutilate Bishop Berkley's position on his own ground.

For now, my reality is the Bible (objective), and via that objective reality, homosexuality is wrong.

Cold-Stone Advantage

 

[Green Gaia]

No. He is not calling homosexuals poison. He is saying that if they are also calling themselves good christians they are mixing two imcompatible things. For all anyone should care, the poison is the church and the purity is the homosexuality. It makes no difference, because the point he put across is that the two seem incompatible to him, just as a poison is incompatible with something pure.

Semantics. It's clear what he meant and who he meant to offend.

 

[DreamQuickBook]

Ones who don't follow what is plainly put forth in the Bible (in my opinion, anyway)

That's right. But, I guess, there is nothing in the Bible that says you can't pick and choose what you want to believe.

 

[Draka]

Yes Draka. When you get hot and heavy and misquote Matthew 7:1 (it's become the homosexual's most popular misquoted verse)-and then right after tell me thou shall not judge, you turn around and start to judge me for judging, that is hypocritical. Go back and read what you did. It's in text so you can't escape what you did : )

I don't have a problem with judgement (which is valid and godly). YOU DO. Thus I don't mind you judging and thinking and articulating. YOU DO.

Now if you've recanted your previous position and have joined my side, I want to congratulate you for crossing over the line from the secular to the Christian position.

Congratuations - It is my pleasure to help and serve you in your pursuit in the analyse in the market place of ideas. I doubt you'll use that absurdity again. : )


Cold-Stone Advantage

Whatever. Besides, I can just counter with that my religion doesn't have such a rule as to judging . But my religion doesn't put it really on us to make any distinct judgement about right and wrong and judging others as "worthy" of the "Kingdom of Heaven" or if they are "true" followers.

And as for recanting my previous stance...I don't think so buddy.

As for your crack about "absurdity"...I'm choking on the vinegar now. Maize...can I share your life preserver?

 

[Jaymes]

Jensa

The cliche that all reality is perception was based off the philosophy of Bishop Berkley. (lol). This philosophy is self refuting. Since it is the biblical perspective (not mine) that perspective deems reality, the Bishop's wrong. Please, no cliche's please. This is based on pre-existential subjective analysis which is the skepticism and off topic of this forum discussion. If you want philosophy, start another thread and I will mutilate Bishop Berkley's position on his own ground.

For now, my reality is the Bible (objective), and via that objective reality, homosexuality is wrong.

Cold-Stone Advantage

You ask me to not use cliches after claiming someone's gay because they have a San Fran accent? :biglaugh: You're a piece of work.

I'll say it again, since you didn't seem to get it the first time around. Nobody has appointed you the Man That Decides What The Bible Does and Does Not Say. Your view on what it says is not the be-all end-all on Biblical interpretation. Some people believe the Bible doesn't condemn monogamous homosexual relationships, and that is their view. You believe it condemns homosexuals who have any nonstraight relationship, and that is your view.

See how simple that was? Everyone looks at things differently, and just because you think the Bible says something it doesn't mean it does. I think it says the world is flat because it refers to things like taking someone to the center of the world and a mountain where all the kingdoms of the world can be seen, but it doesn't make me right just because I think it. It's all how you interpret things, and you sulking and calling everyone that disagrees with your interpretations nonChristian isn't going to change anything.

 

[matey]

Semantics. It's clear what he meant and who he meant to offend.

I don't think he meant to offend, I think he is 'sticking to his guns',
i.e. not compromising his beliefs, which seem to come from the Bible, which is the Word of God. If you don't believe the Bible is the Word of God, then you certainly would be free to make room for non-abstinence or adultery, [i.e. sex outside of marriage(marriage which is between a man and a woman.)] because you would have no fear of retribution, no Fear of God.

Poison, I think is not referring to the person, as Aqualung has repeated. It refers to the sin. The poison is non-abstinence or adultery. The poison is the whisper of Satan in your ear. It is duality.

Personally, I don't believe in compromise. Sure I do it, but I try not to, I try to stick to my guns.

 

[michel]

You ask me to not use cliches after claiming someone's gay because they have a San Fran accent? :biglaugh: You're a piece of work.

I'll say it again, since you didn't seem to get it the first time around. Nobody has appointed you the Man That Decides What The Bible Does and Does Not Say. Your view on what it says is not the be-all end-all on Biblical interpretation. Some people believe the Bible doesn't condemn monogamous homosexual relationships, and that is their view. You believe it condemns homosexuals who have any nonstraight relationship, and that is your view.

See how simple that was? Everyone looks at things differently, and just because you think the Bible says something it doesn't mean it does. I think it says the world is flat because it refers to things like taking someone to the center of the world and a mountain where all the kingdoms of the world can be seen, but it doesn't make me right just because I think it. It's all how you interpret things, and you sulking and calling everyone that disagrees with your interpretations nonChristian isn't going to change anything.

Cold - stone,

For one who is so determined to 'stick to the law of the Bible', you seem to have a remarkable aptitude for not following those parts that you do not consider suit your purposes;

Luke 6:37 Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:

 

[IndigoChild]

Well, I've never killed anyone. And I think that if you are killing in the name of God, and it actually was God-ordered, not just someone saying it is, that it isn't a isn.

LOL! Oh my goodness, when would killing EVER be God ordered? HOW could it ever be so?



Kat

 

[Cold-Stone]

I keep correcting this concept Michael. Did you not pay attention from before.

It is refering to a hypocritical form of judgement like Draka has done. This is condemned. But there is a righteous judgement (John 7:24, 2nd Corinthians 11:5, etc).

You must take the Encyclopedia of Divine Knowledge in its entire format. Not just 1 volume. A text without a context becomes a pretext.

This is not a buffet dinner where we can have a little chicken and mashed potatotes.

Context my friend. : )

I'm off for the weekend. Enjoy the sun if you have it.

Your Friendly Neighbor

Cold-Stone-Advantage

 

[IndigoChild]

Have you ever heard "love the sinner hate the sin?" I don't hate gay people. In fact, I try to love them just as much as I try to love any other child of God, and I do just as good a job. I'm also not judging. I'm recognising, and I think there is a key difference. If I were judging, I would treat them somehow differently than other people. I don't. I don't care if you personally are gay, or if anybody else, personally, is gay. It doesn't change anything.

Just because you don't understand homosexuality or agree with it does not make it a sin. Truth be told, there is no such thing as sin.

Kat

 

[Aqualung]

LOL! Oh my goodness, when would killing EVER be God ordered? HOW could it ever be so?

I'll direct you to the Old Testament, which apearantly you've never read

 

[Aqualung]

Just because you don't understand homosexuality or agree with it does not make it a sin.

No. But the fact that the Bible says it is a sin, makes it a sin.

Truth be told, there is no such thing as sin.

Kat

Yeah, well I guess that's you're opinion, and there is really no point in arguing such opinions where neither side will really be able to use proof, etc.

 

[IndigoChild]

I must admit confusion to the issue of how two married people can be adulterers by having sex with each other.

We might as well not bother talking to these people. They wouldn't know logic if it came up and introduced itself to them. If they want to worship an evil, hypocritical God, then let them. Theirs is a dying religion anyway, it's like arguing with someone who still believes the earth is flat.

Kat

 

[Pah]

...
It is refering to a hypocritical form of judgement like Draka has done. This is condemned. But there is a righteous judgement (John 7:24, 2nd Corinthians 11:5, etc).

You must take the Encyclopedia of Divine Knowledge in its entire format. Not just 1 volume. A text without a context becomes a pretext.

The premise of a "righteous judgement" is based on the premise of an existant God that particularily "inspired" the words quoted to claim "righteuos judgement". It has absolutely no bearing to the secular homosexual. Does it have applicanilty to the Christian homosexual? Not if you take the "Divine Knowledge in its entire format" within the context of New Covent of love. The Biblical concept of love includes sexual activity and that, my cold friend, is righteous.

Enjoy your weekend too! I really hope the sun finally shines for you.

 

[IndigoChild]

ld choo

I'm perplexed by the cherry-picking of Old Testament citations supporting or condemning various practices.

The OT forbids and mandates all sorts of things that no Christian I know of pays any attention to. It calls for penalties that would leave most people without a single sheep or goat to their name!

If Jesus obviated the old rules why do Christians still cite the OT in condemning homosexuality? I assume these faultfinders are scrupulously avoiding any contact with pigskin, as is mandated right next to the injunction against homosexuality. :sarcastic

Yeah, doesn't the OT advocate public vigilante executions for adulterers and avoiding women when they're having their period, and a bunch of other things that only arabic muslims still do?

Kat

 

[BUDDY]

As long as it doesn't harm anyone else, why the big deal?

Given the diversity of the members discussing the issue, my Biblical belief would be seen as irrelevant and therefore would have no constructiveness here.

I will say though that from a societal perspective, I believe that anything not being done my the majority of society, is viewed as odd, weird and someimes bad. I think that is the position that we find ourselves in today. Most people understand that homosexuals are not monsters, bad people, deviants, etc. But because of hundreds of years of being taught that they are, it is difficult to completely depart from that train of thought. I think that in the next few generations this tought pattern will almost completely depart and the only places it will be found is in portions of Texas, Arkansas and West Virginia. Seriously.

 

[IndigoChild]

I'll direct you to the Old Testament, which apearantly you've never read

I thought Jesus nullified the old testament's rules?

Truth be told, I couldn't read the Bible. It was like trying to read Shakespearean pornography. I couldn't even make it past the first page.

Kat

 

[jamaesi]

But he doesn't Jamaesi - it is only the sexual act between two of the same sex that is a sin - and God does not hate the sinner, he feels the pain of the sin. God wants nothing but Love - and so there is (In my mind) nothing wrong with being homosexual - if you are in a loving relationship, then that is fine. Unfortunately, if you are a Christian, and you wish to follow God's dictates, then you would be celibate. It sounds hard, it hurts me to think that you are denied what a heterosexual can enjoy, but it isn't my 'rule'. It would be so wonderful if it was not so, for all homosexuals, but it is not.

How do you know this? Did G-d come down and tell you or did you get it out a book that men wrote and that men have edited to suit their will?



All that´s being thrown around about a vengeful, jealous G-d who would sentence me to hell for being gay when I was made like this and not consider me his child, for a choice I never made and would never make, makes me glad I don´t believe in a G-d like that.

*shakes her head*


Thrown out by her family
In the midst of anger
Mom and dad can't make sense
Of her sexual preference
It seems the cars
Just drive by on this night
No one has any idea
What this feels like

You wave your flag
Tell me I'm free
Then use the word ***
To **** with me

Judged by parents and the public
The fingers pointed at them
Well I'll point mine right back
They must realize
You can't change whom you love
And gender is not the issue


Gender is not the issue. Hateful, judgemental people are.

 

[IndigoChild]

All that´s being thrown around about a vengeful, jealous G-d who would sentence me to hell for being gay when I was made like this and not consider me his child, for a choice I never made and would never make, makes me glad I don´t believe in a G-d like that.

*shakes her head*

Thrown out by her family
In the midst of anger
Mom and dad can't make sense
Of her sexual preference
It seems the cars
Just drive by on this night
No one has any idea
What this feels like

You wave your flag
Tell me I'm free
Then use the word ***
To **** with me

Judged by parents and the public
The fingers pointed at them
Well I'll point mine right back
They must realize
You can't change whom you love
And gender is not the issue


Gender is not the issue. Hateful, judgemental people are.

I understand 1000%. God is Love, incarnate. God IS the all of everything. For God to judge against homosexuals, s/he would have to judge against Itself.

Curse English's lack of a decent genderless pronoun!

Kat