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Why I think "own" should not be there; Proverbs 3:5

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I think that Proverbs 3:5 was written thus: Trust in יְ֭הוָה with all your heart and on understanding do not lean.

They added "own" there and I believe it is wrong to read it that way.

It is a FACT that people put their trust (or lean) on the knowledge of wise men and woman. I do not think that it is wrong to learn by knowledgeable and wise persons. I believe it is alright to trust what makes sense, what promotes love and what builds confidence.

I worry that the way Proverbs 3:5 is read discourages trusting in your own conscience and encourages latching on to people who come in the name of The Lord.

Simply. 1. Trust God and 2. do not rely on worldly wisdom.

On the one hand, it is God alone that the writer trusts in and on the other hand, he warns you not to settle on what your heart tells you. What does it tell you? Some people's heart says to trust in what another person says and so in effect he or she becomes your master and you become his or her accomplice.

To add "own" there seems to encourage faith in not yourself (which isn't a bad thing to put faith in yourself) but in those of station (a very bad thing, imo).
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
@wizanda. When I look for the meaning, I do not put my trust in what someone (who knows who?) says it means. I go back to the information that THEY (we don't know who) used to come to their* conclusions. I click on Strong's text analysis and then I look at the transliteration to see where else the same word was used (originally or as far back as they* know).

*We do not know who they are.
 

Kemosloby

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I think you need to take it for what it means. Trust not in your own understanding without God, but if you trust in your own understanding with God it's not all your own understanding. If you comtemplate the word of God and take it into your heart it's no longer all your own understanding, though it is now your own understanding.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
@wizanda. When I look for the meaning, I do not put my trust in what someone (who knows who?) says it means. I go back to the information that THEY (we don't know who) used to come to their* conclusions. I click on Strong's text analysis and then I look at the transliteration to see where else the same word was used (originally or as far back as they* know).

*We do not know who they are.
So, you don't go to the Jews who actually study the text and have done for centuries?
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I think you need to take it for what it means. Trust not in your own understanding without God, but if you trust in your own understanding with God it's not all your own understanding. If you comtemplate the word of God and take it into your heart it's no longer all your own understanding, though it is now your own understanding.
Do people know what the word OWN means?

If someone tells me that I should not lean on my own understanding I might say, "whose understanding can I lean on, yours?"

It is a fact that people lean on the understanding of their favorite worldly or religious philosophy.

Right? So? It is alright if I pick one and lean on it?
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
So, you don't go to the Jews who actually study the text and have done for centuries?
Psalm 118:8
It is better to take refuge in the LORD Than to trust in man.
Psalm 118:9
It is better to take refuge in the LORD Than to trust in princes.
Isaiah 2:22
Stop regarding man, whose breath of life is in his nostrils; For why should he be esteemed?
Jeremiah 17:5
Thus says the LORD, "Cursed is the man who trusts in mankind And makes flesh his strength, And whose heart turns away from the LORD.
Psalm 146:3
Do not trust in princes, In mortal man, in whom there is no salvation.

Do you think I should?
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
Psalm 118:8
It is better to take refuge in the LORD Than to trust in man.
Psalm 118:9
It is better to take refuge in the LORD Than to trust in princes.
Isaiah 2:22
Stop regarding man, whose breath of life is in his nostrils; For why should he be esteemed?
Jeremiah 17:5
Thus says the LORD, "Cursed is the man who trusts in mankind And makes flesh his strength, And whose heart turns away from the LORD.
Psalm 146:3
Do not trust in princes, In mortal man, in whom there is no salvation.

Do you think I should?
Yep.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Jeremiah 8:9
"The wise men are put to shame, They are dismayed and caught; Behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, And what kind of wisdom do they have?

1 Corinthians 1:20
Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

1 Corinthians 1:21
For since in the wisdom of God, the world through its wisdom did not know Him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

1 Corinthians 2:12
We have not received the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.

James 2:5
Listen, my beloved brothers: Has not God chosen the poor of this world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom He promised those who love Him?

1 Corinthians 1:27
But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
I think you're saying that to trust the people explaining the scriptures is better than to trust the people who wrote them. Is this correct?
I'm pretty sure the Jews are qualified to explain Jewish Scriptures, yes.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
Every Jew or just the right ones?
Not sure how to accurately answer this, but I'll try...

In my opinion, an Orthodox Rabbi; but also any other Yeshivah graduates...

But my bias is showing

'The right ones' ;)
 

Tumah

Veteran Member
Someone. You probably do not believe own was added, so why are you asking?:rolleyes:
I'm just wondering who you thought added it.

I mean, if you were to ask me, I'd say exactly what you're doing is exactly what the verse is saying not to do. You have an understanding of how things are supposed to be and that doesn't conform with what the verse is telling you. So based on your understanding you are editing the verse.

Its almost as if you believe G-d can't possibly have disagreed with you or meant something you are missing. I wonder than if your god's name is savagewind?
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I'm just wondering who you thought added it.

I mean, if you were to ask me, I'd say exactly what you're doing is exactly what the verse is saying not to do. You have an understanding of how things are supposed to be and that doesn't conform with what the verse is telling you. So based on your understanding you are editing the verse.

Its almost as if you believe G-d can't possibly have disagreed with you or meant something you are missing. I wonder than if your god's name is savagewind?
I am not leaning. It doesn't say, Trust in G-d with all your heart and thinking do not do".

No thinking! No questions!

I am not leaning.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I'm just wondering who you thought added it.

I mean, if you were to ask me, I'd say exactly what you're doing is exactly what the verse is saying not to do. You have an understanding of how things are supposed to be and that doesn't conform with what the verse is telling you. So based on your understanding you are editing the verse.

Its almost as if you believe G-d can't possibly have disagreed with you or meant something you are missing. I wonder than if your god's name is savagewind?
My God says that they are all alive to God. That means I may ask the writer what he wrote, and I did!
 
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