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Featured Why God allows Evil

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Estro Felino, Aug 2, 2022.

  1. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Why does He allow evil?
    That is the mantra that several, not to say many, atheists usually point out, whenever they want to underline the Christian doctrine contradictions.

    Why does He do that? Because He is not a dictator.
    God's Order is not any different than politics.
    There is the party of Good, led by Jesus. And there is the party of evil, led by Satan.

    There are Jesus' servants and there are Lucifer's servants. They belong to two different parties.
    As Matthew 13,49 says, the wicked and the just. The first fight for the sake of good, the second for the sake of evil.
    So if He were a dictator, He would prevent evil people from having a say.
    He would prevent them from joining "politics". From doing evil.

    He does not do that because
    1) He is not a dictator
    2) He respects people's free will
    3) He hopes they can choose the party of Good by themselves


    It is Satan that would like to be a dictator by killing all the good people, and ruling Earth with his wicked politicians .
    But he is not allowed to do that. He is forced to respect democracy, as God does.
     
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  2. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    In the afterlife, the wicked who have voted for their master....cannot be in the same room as the good who voted for Jesus...
    That sounds fair to me.
     
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  3. rational experiences

    rational experiences Well-Known Member

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    The eternal spirit that released life after all earth heavens mass was exact created held.... before us. Is unconditional love. Non changing. You can't argue to it or about it. Spirit.

    We argue as a human. We're family. As just two human parents couldn't produce all of us. Instead mass human as the same parents human produced all of us.

    Fallout diversified by nation human DNA. Mind behaviour changed.

    So we know no cruel family member is allowed. To blow us up. Murder us. Torture us. Starve us. We all belong.

    So now we need to give ourselves back what Satan star fall brain burn took from us. Mutual human family life on gods earth.

    As unconditional love has never changed.
     
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  4. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Very profound.
     
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  5. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    Seems to me you have misunderstood or are misrepresenting what atheists are saying.

    If I had the power to stop evil acts happening I would step in and stop them. If I had knowledge of a child being tortured and did nothing to stop it I would consider myself as guilty as the torturer.
     
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  6. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    That's exactly what I am talking about in the OP.:)

    He won't stop them because it is like He forced them to choose good, doing that.
    It would be dictatorial. As dictatorial as preventing someone from voting the party they like.
     
  7. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    So if I was to prevent a child being tortured I'm a dictator?
     
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  8. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    No, you would be a savior. Because you chose good. The party of the good.

    But God cannot and will not force men to choose good, by stopping them from doing evil.
     
  9. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    So what would I be if I had the ability to save a child from torture and I stood by and did nothing?
     
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  10. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    That is why I pointed out that God does not have that ability. Men do.
    Because if He did that, He would violate people's free will.
     
  11. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
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    I think you're looking at this from the point of view of the adult (ie. He has free will to choose to do good) and not the child (ie. He has no choice).

    Indeed, in a psychological sense the violence inflicted on the child likely has a permanent negative impact on the child's free will, and ability to rationally choose.

    If God is not omnipotent or omnibenevolent, that's fine. If He is, it becomes very hard to understand things from that child's point of view.
     
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  12. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    If God had had that ability, there would have been no crucifixion.
    It was not a suicide.
     
  13. paradox

    paradox (㇏(•̀ᵥᵥ•́)ノ)

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    This is not so straightforward because god instead of intervening here does punishment in afterlife, therefore it's not valid to say that god doesn't do anything.

    Another problem is that if god would intervene here then every evil human action would be prevented, this mean people would not be able to do evil at all, this further mean complete lack of free will, which is contradictory to god willing that people have free will.

    Also punishment in afterlife is far more just than taking free will away from you.
     
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  14. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    You didn't answer the question, just offered up apologetics for your God. A God which seems to me to be non existent because of the inaction.
     
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  15. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    I'm looking at it from the point of common decency. The lack of free will for the child was to be my next point.
     
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  16. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    That's a very good point. God's inaction surely strengthens the non-existence argument.
     
  17. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    I doubt that's any comfort to the abused children in the world.
     
    #17 John53, Aug 2, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022
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  18. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    This is a very interesting point. Nevertheless it is not an universal rule. Because we have cases of abused children who turned out to be great people, despite everything.
     
    #18 Estro Felino, Aug 2, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2022
  19. John53

    John53 Well-Known Member

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    So my next question which you've already seen I assume... Why does the child have no freewill. I'm certain they did not choose to be tortured.
     
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  20. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    Free will implies that human beings are all potential victims of other human beings (and animals, since they have free will too).
    Free will can also be used to counter this potential threat.
     
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