• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Why !Fluffy! is sick of religion and politics

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
i've been going through something lately some of you might relate to.

i am sick of politics and religion. Now, i've never been one to lack an opinion on any subject. but it seems like there is a divisiveness reaching fever pitch on these and other forums - and of course this is reflected IRL (in real life) - and it's just so repetitive and obnoxious to me.

it's all just wrong on so many levels.

i believe there is a false dichotomy being promoted / nourished / manufactured in western politics. the question is, who profits from divisiveness? and why do we keep buying into it?

what if the truth is, most of us pretty much agree on important basics like the importance of individual liberty. we don't want the government breathing down our necks like big brother. we actually want to be left alone most of the time, government-wise. stuff like that. truthfully i think most of us are independent, self-sufficient, and just fine thank you. and most of us want those who aren't able to care for themselves, to be cared for - but not for them to be used as "causes" to bludgeon us over the head and make us feel guilty for drawing breath.

and then i see people manufacturing causes all the time. crusades. beating the drum, trying to convince us all the world is going to come to an end if we don't DO something or STOP something or BELIEVE something, right now.

the result? you get another bunch of people waving the opposite banners proclaiming the opposite message. so what do you do? Pick a side! Get on a bandwagon! Beat a drum! Stop the opposition! My team wins, yay!

and when it comes right down to it, our government doesn't care. the politicians are corrupt to the core, from tiny local townships up to the presidency, we are infested with self-serving, rhetoric spewing liars who will succeed eventually in bringing all of us under their yoke while raping the economy. if we let them. Where is true leadership? It is rarely seen in this country, our government is filled with "men without chests".

well i am actually so sick of it all i hate to get started on RELIGION. I actually don't believe in religion at all any more.

Jesus is another story, but i am not going to use him like some people do to put someone on one side of a fence or another.

But it just seems to me like men have done what they have always done with religion, like the Pharisees Jesus preached against all the time. they build monolithic iron-gated edifices, empires, power structures in the name of God. Then they decide who is IN, and who is OUT. They trade the free gift of Grace offered to all humanity, for their own manmade ordinances and rituals, do's and don'ts, blocking the way to heaven and grieving the masses with their legalistic bull to keep them in check. Whited sepulchres. Spiritually dead.

sigh. i need a good sermon i guess.

or some Ben & Jerry's Cherry Garcia...

Affectionately yours,
!Fluffy!
 

cardero

Citizen Mod
and then i see people manufacturing causes all the time. crusades. beating the drum, trying to convince us all the world is going to come to an end if we don't DO something or STOP something or BELIEVE something, right now.

the result? you get another bunch of people waving the opposite banners proclaiming the opposite message. so what do you do? Pick a side! Get on a bandwagon! Beat a drum! Stop the opposition! My team wins, yay!

"A mob doesn't think."
-Alfredo from the film Nuovo cinema Paradiso

Hi Fluffy!!-
-Pat Cardero from the "Why Fluffy is sick of religion and politics" thread
 

Booko

Deviled Hen
I'm sick of politics myself, mainly because I don't understand it! lol!

I"m sick of US politics, because I understand it too well (argh!) but mostly because I see no reason why I have to endure 2 YEARS of nonsense "news stories" about presidential wannabes and their hairdos or whatever.

*runs to hide in closet until after Nov. 2008...*
 

Mercy Not Sacrifice

Well-Known Member
i've been going through something lately some of you might relate to.

i am sick of politics and religion. Now, i've never been one to lack an opinion on any subject. but it seems like there is a divisiveness reaching fever pitch on these and other forums - and of course this is reflected IRL (in real life) - and it's just so repetitive and obnoxious to me.

it's all just wrong on so many levels.

i believe there is a false dichotomy being promoted / nourished / manufactured in western politics. the question is, who profits from divisiveness? and why do we keep buying into it?

what if the truth is, most of us pretty much agree on important basics like the importance of individual liberty. we don't want the government breathing down our necks like big brother. we actually want to be left alone most of the time, government-wise. stuff like that. truthfully i think most of us are independent, self-sufficient, and just fine thank you. and most of us want those who aren't able to care for themselves, to be cared for - but not for them to be used as "causes" to bludgeon us over the head and make us feel guilty for drawing breath.

and then i see people manufacturing causes all the time. crusades. beating the drum, trying to convince us all the world is going to come to an end if we don't DO something or STOP something or BELIEVE something, right now.

the result? you get another bunch of people waving the opposite banners proclaiming the opposite message. so what do you do? Pick a side! Get on a bandwagon! Beat a drum! Stop the opposition! My team wins, yay!

and when it comes right down to it, our government doesn't care. the politicians are corrupt to the core, from tiny local townships up to the presidency, we are infested with self-serving, rhetoric spewing liars who will succeed eventually in bringing all of us under their yoke while raping the economy. if we let them. Where is true leadership? It is rarely seen in this country, our government is filled with "men without chests".

well i am actually so sick of it all i hate to get started on RELIGION. I actually don't believe in religion at all any more.

Jesus is another story, but i am not going to use him like some people do to put someone on one side of a fence or another.

But it just seems to me like men have done what they have always done with religion, like the Pharisees Jesus preached against all the time. they build monolithic iron-gated edifices, empires, power structures in the name of God. Then they decide who is IN, and who is OUT. They trade the free gift of Grace offered to all humanity, for their own manmade ordinances and rituals, do's and don'ts, blocking the way to heaven and grieving the masses with their legalistic bull to keep them in check. Whited sepulchres. Spiritually dead.

sigh. i need a good sermon i guess.

or some Ben & Jerry's Cherry Garcia...

Affectionately yours,
!Fluffy!

Until people are willing to change not just what they do but who they are, these rhetorical questions will forever be asked.
 

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
Try anarchy! :)

Okay if you want me to.
:D


But my idea of anarchy is hiding with my loved ones on a deserted island where no one can tell us what to do (we are perfectly capable of doing that to each other, thank you).


I am trying to convince everyone in the family to sell their property, pool our money and find an island somewhere.

As yet no one has taken this seriously. I can't imagine why.
 

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
I"m sick of US politics, because I understand it too well (argh!) but mostly because I see no reason why I have to endure 2 YEARS of nonsense "news stories" about presidential wannabes and their hairdos or whatever.

*runs to hide in closet until after Nov. 2008...*

frankly they are all a bunch of blowhards and i won't listen to it. i won't, i say!!!
 

standing_alone

Well-Known Member
LOL, I've been sick of politics for quite some time (can't even stand to follow it closely at all anymore and I used to follow politics obsessively) and one of my majors is poli sci. That major's doomed. :D

What you say about United States citizens all agreeing about basic fundamentals like individual liberty is very true. You could poll all Americans about what they believe America should stand for and I bet you'd find nearly identical answers from people of most political persuasions. Of course, we differ on how those fundamentals should be approached, but we all pretty much value the same sorts of things. Unfortunately, our political system no longer is a body of representatives of the people who carry out the will of the people in accordance to the Constitution; our political system has become an exclusive club for those with enough wealth to successfully run a campaign, who then divide us against eachother to claim our votes and remain in that club. There are exceptions to this rule, some politicians speaking for the people, but that's just it, they are the exceptions (when they should be the damn rule in the first place!). It's no doubt why voter turnout is so low here. However, in order to get those institutions properly running again, we are going to have to use such avenues (as voting) to bring about any change. The problem is reading politicians and figuring out which ones are slime and which ones are genuinely concerned for the people.

I also understand what you say about religion, or more accurately, organized religion. Organized religion, from my experience and from what I've witnessed with others, is the antithesis to spirituality. The organized religious institutions I've witnessed cared more about their agendas or making sure the members are leaving "enough" in the collection plate. You don't need those structures or (corrupt) instututions or to shell out cash to connect with your spirituality or God or whatever term you use for such feelings and experience. Often, organized religions operate much like our corrupt government for similar reasons (those in the authoritative positions want power and money). It's no wonder why you're disappointed in both.
 

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
LOL, I've been sick of politics for quite some time (can't even stand to follow it closely at all anymore and I used to follow politics obsessively) and one of my majors is poli sci. That major's doomed. :D

What you say about United States citizens all agreeing about basic fundamentals like individual liberty is very true. You could poll all Americans about what they believe America should stand for and I bet you'd find nearly identical answers from people of most political persuasions. Of course, we differ on how those fundamentals should be approached, but we all pretty much value the same sorts of things. Unfortunately, our political system no longer is a body of representatives of the people who carry out the will of the people in accordance to the Constitution; our political system has become an exclusive club for those with enough wealth to successfully run a campaign, who then divide us against eachother to claim our votes and remain in that club. There are exceptions to this rule, some politicians speaking for the people, but that's just it, they are the exceptions (when they should be the damn rule in the first place!). It's no doubt why voter turnout is so low here. However, in order to get those institutions properly running again, we are going to have to use such avenues (as voting) to bring about any change. The problem is reading politicians and figuring out which ones are slime and which ones are genuinely concerned for the people.

I also understand what you say about religion, or more accurately, organized religion. Organized religion, from my experience and from what I've witnessed with others, is the antithesis to spirituality. The organized religious institutions I've witnessed cared more about their agendas or making sure the members are leaving "enough" in the collection plate. You don't need those structures or (corrupt) instututions or to shell out cash to connect with your spirituality or God or whatever term you use for such feelings and experience. Often, organized religions operate much like our corrupt government for similar reasons (those in the authoritative positions want power and money). It's no wonder why you're disappointed in both.

see, people? now here is an average normal person (actually i would say above average in terms of intelligence and ability to articulate) I WOULD VOTE FOR!!

standing alone has a better grasp on real life than 99% of the bureaucrats and politicians and talking heads on the nightly news. There are people like this all across america.

So why can't we have more of this kind of leadership? why???


$$$$$$$$$$$$, that's why.
 

MaddLlama

Obstructor of justice
Unfortunately, our political system no longer is a body of representatives of the people who carry out the will of the people in accordance to the Constitution; our political system has become an exclusive club for those with enough wealth to successfully run a campaign, who then divide us against each other to claim our votes and remain in that club. There are exceptions to this rule, some politicians speaking for the people, but that's just it, they are the exceptions (when they should be the damn rule in the first place!).

I have nothing to add to this, I'm just singling it out because I think this is probably the most important political idea/statement/truth of our time, and it ought to be screamed from the rooftops.
 

standing_alone

Well-Known Member
So why can't we have more of this kind of leadership? why???


$$$$$$$$$$$$, that's why.


Yup, money is pretty much the number one reason we don't have better representation. Really, who's going to understand the common, average American's situation and speak on their behalf better? The person who actually is a common, average American or some Ivy League grad lawyer? I put my dollar :p on the first one. However, the common, average American, unlike the Ivy League grad lawyer, can't afford to devote their time and loads of cash to trying to attain political office when they've got a family to feed and care for, house payments, car payments, etc., especially when elections are turning into longer and longer (and more trivial and trivial) spectacles every cycle (that obviously eat up a lot of cash; I mean, quality attack ads and air fare ain't cheap). We need to reject the "entertainmentization" (I think I just made up a new word :D) that has been done to our political system. We need to undo what has been done and bring our political system back to its roots. However, it will take a lot of habit breaking (I mean, hey, who doesn't love watching that map of the United States turn blue and red every presidential election? :D) and learning politics should be serious and, thus, taken seriously. Election reform is a must in order to restore integrety to our political system.

Another problem is that often those who would make the best politicians don't run because they don't want to play the game that is a mockery of what our Founding Fathers intended. Fixing the system (in which reforming elections would be a great start) could possibly attract the persons with true concern for this nation's people to run for office. But of course, everything is more complex than just this, but it's a start on the things that need to be done to restore integrety in American government, at least in my opinion.
 

Callmepaul

Member
But it just seems to me like men have done what they have always done with religion, like the Pharisees Jesus preached against all the time. they build monolithic iron-gated edifices, empires, power structures in the name of God. Then they decide who is IN, and who is OUT. They trade the free gift of Grace offered to all humanity, for their own manmade ordinances and rituals, do's and don'ts, blocking the way to heaven and grieving the masses with their legalistic bull to keep them in check. Whited sepulchres. Spiritually dead.

sigh. i need a good sermon i guess.

or some Ben & Jerry's Cherry Garcia...

Affectionately yours,
!Fluffy!

You don't need a good sermon my friend. You just gave us a wonderful one! Thank you!
 

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
Yup, money is pretty much the number one reason we don't have better representation. Really, who's going to understand the common, average American's situation and speak on their behalf better? The person who actually is a common, average American or some Ivy League grad lawyer? I put my dollar :p on the first one. However, the common, average American, unlike the Ivy League grad lawyer, can't afford to devote their time and loads of cash to trying to attain political office when they've got a family to feed and care for, house payments, car payments, etc., especially when elections are turning into longer and longer (and more trivial and trivial) spectacles every cycle (that obviously eat up a lot of cash; I mean, quality attack ads and air fare ain't cheap). We need to reject the "entertainmentization" (I think I just made up a new word :D) that has been done to our political system. We need to undo what has been done and bring our political system back to its roots. However, it will take a lot of habit breaking (I mean, hey, who doesn't love watching that map of the United States turn blue and red every presidential election? :D) and learning politics should be serious and, thus, taken seriously. Election reform is a must in order to restore integrety to our political system.

Another problem is that often those who would make the best politicians don't run because they don't want to play the game that is a mockery of what our Founding Fathers intended. Fixing the system (in which reforming elections would be a great start) could possibly attract the persons with true concern for this nation's people to run for office. But of course, everything is more complex than just this, but it's a start on the things that need to be done to restore integrety in American government, at least in my opinion.

Great post. You are right in every regard here, and what is more - we all know it!

I just keep thinking that a grass roots third party election effort could, might work now that we have free access to everything and everybody via the internet. But nothing ever congeals. People are still too uninformed i think, and most lack the time it takes to do the research needed to really formulate sound opinions regarding real issues.

That and the resounding apathy caused by the constant wrangling and fakery have effectively dampened people's enthusiasm for it, me included. I force myself to stay somewhat informed ONLY for the sake of my children and their children, and the sad realization that they may never have the pleasure of living in the same America my parents and grandparents knew.

Election reform could be a slippery slope considering what passes for representative government now. I don't trust a tenth of them to do anything good for the country unless it involves lining their own pockets or building bigger empires.

But it would be fun to brainstorm if anybody else wants to!!

These ideas are whacky but i'm just shooting from the hip:


I think most of us would like to find a way to wrest all the power away from the Republicrats. The two parties are corrupt and way too powerful. If I had my way:

Rule #1: No political ads would be allowed on television, radio or in the newspaper. Ever.
Rule #2: Straight news media that persistently try to slant / cover up / spin / doctor / repress any FACTS in order to favor one party or another will be heavily fined. (don't ask me how to police them or who would make decisions about bias, i have no idea)
Rule #3: Political opinion shows will be relegated to public access political stations branded appropriately, i.e. "the conservative network" or "the liberal network" or "the green party network" or "the constitution party network" etc. The media has failed miserably in making these things anything more than infotainment shouting matches that are usually heavily weighted on one side or another. Hopefully this would be the arena where parties and candidates would be able to present their platforms fairly and in a mature, rational manner. I would gladly vote to allocate the funding to give somebody other than the big 2 a free speech arena.

And how about this idea: let's make it illegal to be a career politician. Nobody can spend more than 5 years in public office. As for the learning curve, i don't care. i am just sick of the power hungry windbags who have made a career out of politics.

I also like the idea of stricter term limits. Like you can only be president once, for two years, unless you get a 60% or larger write in vote for a second term. Something like that might deter power mongers somewhat.

The whole idea is to tie their hands, keep their minds off the next election and their hands off the constitution, discourage power hungry types from staying in office for long, and encourage regular civic minded people to run for office.

Come on, Americans are nothing if not creative and ingenious. Does anyone else have any ideas?

that was fun. i'm feeling better already.
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Yo Fluffster! I feel your pain! Why, I think I might be...

Stuck in the Middle with You!

Well I don't know why I came here tonight
I've got a feelin' that somethin' ain't right
I'm so scared in case I fall off my chair
And I'm wonderin' how I'll get down the stairs
Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right
Here I am, stuck in the middle with you

Yes, I'm stuck in the middle with you
And I'm wonderin' what it is I should do
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face
Losin' control, yeah, I'm all over the place
Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right
Here I am stuck in the middle with you

Well you started off with nothin' and
You're proud that you're a self-made man, yeah
And your friends they all come crawlin'
Slap you on the back and say
Please...
Please...
 

!Fluffy!

Lacking Common Sense
Yo Fluffster! I feel your pain! Why, I think I might be...

Stuck in the Middle with You!

Well I don't know why I came here tonight
I've got a feelin' that somethin' ain't right
I'm so scared in case I fall off my chair
And I'm wonderin' how I'll get down the stairs
Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right
Here I am, stuck in the middle with you

Yes, I'm stuck in the middle with you
And I'm wonderin' what it is I should do
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face
Losin' control, yeah, I'm all over the place
Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right
Here I am stuck in the middle with you

Well you started off with nothin' and
You're proud that you're a self-made man, yeah
And your friends they all come crawlin'
Slap you on the back and say
Please...

Please...


awesome. now we have standing_alone's campaign song! :clap

Yes, it's the Stuck In the Middle Party!

SIMPs, UNITE!! woohoo!
 
Top