Why exactly do Jehovah's Witnesses evangelize?

[savagewind]

"
I think the accepted Bible translators agree with me. Why would anyone have a problem with that except those who want it to say otherwise?

I think YOU'RE the one who calls every other Christian organization Babylon the Great. It is Babylon the Great who gave the faithful and discreet slave all the things they teach. That is a fact, so let's go with that.

Num 16:2, 3:
" 250 prominent Israelite men who were leaders of the community and representatives in the assembly, and they rebelled against Moses. 3 They came together against Moses and Aaron and told them, “You have gone too far! Everyone in the entire community is holy, and the Lord is among them. Why then do you exalt yourselves above the Lord’s assembly?” (Holman)

Perhaps you should have quoted the result of that confrontation....

Num 16:20-33:
"20 The Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, 21 “Separate yourselves from this community so I may consume them instantly.”


22 But Moses and Aaron fell facedown and said, “God, God of the spirits of all flesh, when one man sins, will You vent Your wrath on the whole community?”


23 The Lord replied to Moses, 24 “Tell the community: Get away from the dwellings of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram.”


25 Moses got up and went to Dathan and Abiram, and the elders of Israel followed him. 26 He warned the community, “Get away now from the tents of these wicked men. Don’t touch anything that belongs to them, or you will be swept away because of all their sins.” 27 So they got away from the dwellings of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram. Meanwhile, Dathan and Abiram came out and stood at the entrance of their tents with their wives, children, and infants.


28 Then Moses said, “This is how you will know that the Lord sent me to do all these things and that it was not of my own will: 29 If these men die naturally as all people would, and suffer the fate of all, then the Lord has not sent me. 30 But if the Lord brings about something unprecedented, and the ground opens its mouth and swallows them along with all that belongs to them so that they go down alive into Sheol, then you will know that these men have despised the Lord.”


31 Just as he finished speaking all these words, the ground beneath them split open. 32 The earth opened its mouth and swallowed them and their households, all Korah’s people, and all their possessions. 33 They went down alive into Sheol with all that belonged to them. The earth closed over them, and they vanished from the assembly"

This what happens when we oppose those whom God has put in their place.

You are SO cute! Jesus is the greater Moses. Correct? The 144,000 are with Jesus IN HEAVEN. Correct? To obey anyone else is to do what YOU say we do. You're doing it.

 

[savagewind]

It is very simple math. Please try it. Scripture says 144,000 are in heaven. OK? You put some of them on Earth. Why? When you put some of them on Earth you take some away from Heaven. That is simple math.
You are right that God has an organization. And you are right that God is over all, Jesus leads God's organization, and the 144,000 go with him. Look at some of the diagrams the governing body of Jehovah's Witrnesses have drawn for you!
Can you not see that God's organization is spiritual?
So......it is YOUR men who are behaving like Korah, Dathan, and Abiram.
According to the JWs anyone who might can be set above the rest to tell you what to think.
Numbers 16:3.
Matthew 18:20 Can you not see how they replace Jesus like Korah, Dathan, and Abiram tried to replace Moses?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

I don't think you "see" much of anything djh. You just think you do.

At least "I" see for myself, not just what 7 men tell me I see! You don't see or believe anything that the GB don't tell you to see or believe.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Jesus' words to his disciples as was departing were....
Acts 1:8:
" but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.”

He also said in Matt 24:14 that "This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come."

The preaching of the good news had to be carried on right till the end of the present system of things.....who was supposed to do this work of taking the kingdom message to the remotest parts of the earth? The apostles? They have been out of action for almost two thousand years now....yet the preaching work is being conducted just as Jesus said it would....in "all the world"....just not by the churches.

Please show us one scripture that commands every person, every where, to preach the Gospel. And please, Mat 24:14 does not say, "this gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached by everyone, everywhere, in the whole world".

What did Paul say?

1Co 12:27-30 (ESVST) 27 Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it. 28 And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Christendom baptizes infants...do they not? Is this scriptural? Is that an acceptable baptism in your estimations?

Christendom as a whole, or just the other cults? I don't know about all the religions out there, but the only one I know that baptizes infants is the Catholic church. I myself don't believe infants should be baptized, because they cannot make the decision to die to self and follow Christ.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Since all who served God in the past had to belong to the visible part of his organized people, I see that as a requirement, rather than sprinkling a bit of water on a baby's head and uttering some words that will mean very little in that child's life.

So again, what "you" think and what the GB says, overrides what Jesus commanded. So tell us, do you obey Jesus, or do you obey the 7 men in NY?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Is Christendom doing what Christ commanded? They certainly didn't when I was part of the church. The reason I left was because I saw nothing but hypocrisy.
With one corner of their mouth they praised the Prince of Peace whilst with the other they support the bloodshed of their nations. Is this doing what Christ commanded?

I believe some of the churches are doing what Christ commanded, not all. Not every JW does everything Christ commanded either. If you think they do, you really are deceived. To think that every person on earth has been commanded to preach the gospel is absurd. For people to put their trust in someone that claim to be God's anointed and only channel to the world, but openly admits they can and will make mistakes is absurd. JW's don't put their trust in God or the Bible, they put their trust in what the 7 men in NY tell them.

How do I know that's true? The gentleman I study with, who has been a JW for 30 years, does not consult the Bible when asked a question. When I ask a question he has not been trained to answer, he says, "well lets see what it says" and opens his, "what does the Bible really teach" book. This is a man who has been a member of "God's organization", has been taught by "Jesus' appointed" slave, for 30 years and doesn't turn to the Bible to answer any questions, he turns to WT literature as his source and authority. He's not spreading the Bible gospel, he's spreading what the GB says the gospel is.

I have yet to have a conversation with a JW where they have not brought up the subject of bloodshed. It seems as though, when a JW starts seeing the truth, they have to get back on track and think about them not going to war. Why is that? Just like my friend, well be talking and I'll show him something from the Bible, and I can see him actually seeing what is says, then he immediately says, "but who are the only people that won't go to war?" JW's have to grab on to something when they start seeing the truth, and that's all they have, "we don't go to war, we don't kill".

What did Solomon say? The GB likes to use Solomon to support their doctrine.

Ecc 3:1-8 (ESVST) 1 For everything there is a season, and a time for every matter under heaven:
2 a time to be born, and a time to die;
a time to plant, and a time to pluck up what is planted;
3 a time to kill, and a time to heal;
a time to break down, and a time to build up;
4 a time to weep, and a time to laugh;
a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
5 a time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together;
a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
6 a time to seek, and a time to lose;
a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
7 a time to tear, and a time to sew;
a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
8 a time to love, and a time to hate;
a time for war, and a time for peace.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

I think YOU'RE the one who calls every other Christian organization Babylon the Great. It is Babylon the Great who gave the faithful and discreet slave all the things they teach. That is a fact, so let's go with that.

This is awesome SW! You are totally right. The GB talks so much trash on Christendom, but quotes Christendom to prove some of their doctrine. Makes no sense to me!

 

[djhwoodwerks]

These people.....

"Everyone who does not abide in the teaching of Christ, but goes beyond it, does not have God; whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 Do not receive into the house or welcome anyone who comes to you and does not bring this teaching; 11 for to welcome is to participate in the evil deeds of such a person."

The ones who think they know better than the slave Jesus appointed. The ones Jesus spoke about in Matt 7:21-23, who think that they are good Christians but are kidding themselves; promoting lies as Christian truth.

How has Christendom Gone "beyond" the teachings of Christ? By turning God's son into God himself....something he never taught.

By teaching that man has an immortal soul that goes to either heaven or hell, making Christ's teaching about the resurrection redundant.

By teaching that God punishes human souls in a hell of torture for all eternity, making a mockery of his justice and turning him into a heartless monster.

By teaching that all Christians are going to heaven, when that was never God's plan from the beginning. I don't think you understand how messed up Christendom's doctrines really are.

If you have never even tried to get a handle on Christ's actual teachings because of being entrenched in Christendom's lies, then you will never experience the joy of having a real relationship with Jehovah as the God and Father of the one he sent to rescue us. You think we are brainwashed?...look at what you believe.

Well now, let's take this in context, shall we?

2Jo 1:5-11 (ESVST) 5 And now I ask you, dear lady — not as though I were writing you a new commandment, but the one we have had from the beginning — that we love one another. 6 And this is love, that we walk according to his commandments; this is the commandment, just as you have heard from the beginning, so that you should walk in it. 7 For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. 8 Watch yourselves, so that you may not lose what we have worked for, but may win a full reward. 9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting, 11 for whoever greets him takes part in his wicked works.

This doesn't mean "all" the teachings of Christ. John said that many deceivers are out in the world, those who "do not confess Jesus came in the flesh". If anyone comes to you and does not bring "this" teaching, (what teaching?) that "Jesus came in the flesh", don't let them in your house or even greet them.

What does that mean? Anyone that denies Jesus, don't receive them or greet them.

 

[InChrist]

I

"And every day, in the temple and from house to house, they did not cease teaching and preaching that the Christ is Jesus." (ESV)

or Acts 20:20?
"how I did not shrink from declaring to you anything that was profitable, and teaching you in public and from house to house" (ESV)


Jesus' words to his disciples as was departing were....
Acts 1:8:
" but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.”


The preaching of the good news had to be carried on right till the end of the present system of things.....who was supposed to do this work of taking the kingdom message to the remotest parts of the earth? The apostles? They have been out of action for almost two thousand years now....yet the preaching work is being conducted just as Jesus said it would....in "all the world"....just not by the churches.

The apostles only went from house to house to lodge with other Christians in various towns or those who were receptive to the message concerning Jesus Christ, who then invited them to lodge. They did not go from door to door of strangers as the Watchtower instructs it members to do and takes such pride in claiming to be the only ones who share the message of the Bible. The historical fact is that since the time of the apostles Christians have gone throughout the world spreading the gospel of Jesus Christ, as Jesus said to do...
So they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for His name. And daily in the temple, and in every house, they did not cease teaching and preaching Jesus as the Christ. Acts 5;41-42 Saying believers are to be His witnesses ( not Jehovah's) ...but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.”Acts 1:8

The number of individual and family Christian missionaries, missionary organizations, Bible translators, church groups, and others who have taken the message of salvation through Jesus Christ and His coming kingdom to nations throughout the world, or in their neighborhoods, inner cities, workplaces, nursing homes, hospitals, etc. ,is endless. So the claim of the Watchtower is outright false and besides that they are spreading a false gospel and are not witnesses for Jesus Christ or preaching His name to the nations or door to door.

'Acts 20:17-20 Paul is not discussing preaching to unbelievers but rather teaching those who already were Christians. He says;

"However, from Mi·le´tus he sent to Eph´e·sus and called for the older men of the congregation. When they got to him he said to them: "YOU well know how from the first day that I stepped into the [district of] Asia I was with you the whole time, slaving for the Lord with the greatest lowliness of mind and tears and trials that befell me by the plots of the Jews; while I did not hold back from telling YOU any of the things that were profitable nor from teaching YOU publicly and from house to house."
A more accurate way to understand these scriptures in Acts is "we were teaching you at your homes" similar to the way Witnesses hold congregation book studies. Paul here relates his past activity in teaching "the older men of the congregation" privately within Christian homes. Early Christians did not have Churches but met in homes, and it is to this that Paul was referring.

Romans 16:5 "and [greet] the congregation that is in their house." Colossians 4:15 "Give my greetings to the brothers at La·o·di·ce´a and to Nym´pha and to the congregation at her house."
In 1972 the Watchtower acknowledged that Acts 20:20 does not apply to door to door preaching. Hence, Organization for Kingdom-Preaching and Disciple-Making the page 56 footnote used the following quote from Doctor Robertson, showing that kai kat' oikous was used to indicate preaching to existing Christians such as Aquila and Priscilla."
http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/preach.php

 

[InChrist]

Is the Watchtower governing body directive to go door to door founded in the scriptures or a command of men upon the members?

 

[Deeje]

At least "I" see for myself, not just what 7 men tell me I see! You don't see or believe anything that the GB don't tell you to see or believe.

You are entitled to do and believe whatever you like djh. If our GB are not the slave you are looking for, then please tell me who he is for you and we will see if he measures up?
Let's compare your "slave" to mine....? Jesus says he exists and is appointed by the Master in his absence to feed Christ's household....so who is he? You must have found him and identified him, so please share with us so that we can all benefit from the "food" he is serving.

You seem to be rather obsessed with proving that our GB are wrong. If they are, why all this attacking? Do you subconsciously fear that we are right? Who are you trying to convince?

You do realize that Jesus already knows who is a sheep and who is a goat...don't you trust him?

 

[blue taylor]

According to you is Revelation 3:20 opinion?

What does that have to do with Paul meeting Jesus?

 

[Deeje]

I believe some of the churches are doing what Christ commanded, not all. Not every JW does everything Christ commanded either. If you think they do, you really are deceived. To think that every person on earth has been commanded to preach the gospel is absurd. For people to put their trust in someone that claim to be God's anointed and only channel to the world, but openly admits they can and will make mistakes is absurd. JW's don't put their trust in God or the Bible, they put their trust in what the 7 men in NY tell them.

How do I know that's true? The gentleman I study with, who has been a JW for 30 years, does not consult the Bible when asked a question. When I ask a question he has not been trained to answer, he says, "well lets see what it says" and opens his, "what does the Bible really teach" book. This is a man who has been a member of "God's organization", has been taught by "Jesus' appointed" slave, for 30 years and doesn't turn to the Bible to answer any questions, he turns to WT literature as his source and authority. He's not spreading the Bible gospel, he's spreading what the GB says the gospel is.

The "Bible Teach" Book is exactly what the title suggests....it shows people what "the Bible" teaches.

I have yet to have a conversation with a JW where they have not brought up the subject of bloodshed. It seems as though, when a JW starts seeing the truth, they have to get back on track and think about them not going to war. Why is that? Just like my friend, well be talking and I'll show him something from the Bible, and I can see him actually seeing what is says, then he immediately says, "but who are the only people that won't go to war?" JW's have to grab on to something when they start seeing the truth, and that's all they have, "we don't go to war, we don't kill".

What did Solomon say? The GB likes to use Solomon to support their doctrine.

Ecc 3:1-8 (ESVST) 1 For everything there is a season, and a time for every matter under heaven:
2 a time to be born, and a time to die;
a time to plant, and a time to pluck up what is planted;
3 a time to kill, and a time to heal;
a time to break down, and a time to build up;
4 a time to weep, and a time to laugh;
a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
5 a time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together;
a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
6 a time to seek, and a time to lose;
a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
7 a time to tear, and a time to sew;
a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
8 a time to love, and a time to hate;
a time for war, and a time for peace.

LOL....this applied in Israel when God's nation had a well defined territory to defend. There was indeed a "time to kill" and "a time for war" back then, with God's sanction.

But please show me a teaching of Jesus Christ that advocates bloodshed or participation in the wars of the nations...? How do we "love our enemies" with bombs and tanks and AK47's? Would you like to show me the clauses where Christ's teachings can be put aside for political agendas?

 

[savagewind]

LOL....this applied in Israel when God's nation had a well defined territory to defend. There was indeed a "time to kill" and "a time for war" back then, with God's sanction.

But please show me a teaching of Jesus Christ that advocates bloodshed or participation in the wars of the nations...? How do we "love our enemies" with bombs and tanks and AK47's? Would you like to show me the clauses where Christ's teachings can be put aside for political agendas?

Jesus never "advocates bloodshed" but he also did not tell the soldier to quit his job like your governing body tells people to quit their jobs. Luke 3:14

 

[savagewind]

What does that have to do with Paul meeting Jesus?

It says Jesus will meet people.

 

[blue taylor]

What is not all nonsense? This is a place of sharing so......share.

Regarding God's Kingdom, please read Isaiah 9:6-9, and Daniel 2:44.

And where do you get "No compassion for others, no forgiveness for others"? Is this in relation to disfellowshipping?
Thousands are re-instated, every year! Welcomed back! (My ex-wife was one. Twice!) You are not getting the full truth regarding Jehovah's Witnesses, only half-truths, which means half-lies. But that's your decision.

What's the "weird version of life after death"?

The old testament is for Jews, and it says so. Shunning is against the teachings of Jesus, as I have stated.

 

[Deeje]

"While the earliest Christians endeavored to be good citizens, their faith prevented them from taking the life of another or from sacrificing their own lives for the State. The Encyclopedia of Religion states: “The early church fathers, including Tertullian and Origen, affirmed that Christians were constrained from taking human life, a principle that prevented them from participating in the Roman army.” In his book The Early Church and the World, Professor C. J. Cadoux writes: “Up to the reign of Marcus Aurelius at least [161-180 C.E.], no Christian would become a soldier after his baptism.”

Why do members of the churches of Christendom not view things this way today? Because of a radical change that took place in the fourth century. The Catholic work A History of the Christian Councils explains: “Many Christians, . . . under the pagan emperors, had religious scruples with regard to military service, and positively refused to take arms, or else deserted. The Synod [of Arles, held in 314 C.E.], in considering the changes introduced by Constantine, set forth the obligation that Christians have to serve in war, . . . because the Church is at peace (in pace) under a prince friendly to Christians.” As a result of this abandonment of Jesus’ teachings, from that time until now, the clergy of Christendom have encouraged their flocks to serve in the armies of the nations, although some individuals have taken a stand as conscientious objectors." ('96 WT)

 

[InChrist]

Let's compare your "slave" to mine....? Jesus says he exists and is appointed by the Master in his absence to feed Christ's household....so who is he? You must have found him and identified him, so please share with us so that we can all benefit from the "food" he is serving.

I believe the scriptures indicate that the faithful slave mentioned in Matthew and Luke is any believer(s) who are faithfully sharing the biblical message of Christ and of course as pointed out below no one really knows for certain they are considered a faithful slave until Christ returns bless and reward those who He says have been faithful.

"Another difficulty arises when we consider that the Watchtower leaders have already declared themselves to be the “faithful and discreet slave," but when does Jesus declare them to be “faithful and discreet”? According to Matthew 24:45, He declares this when He returns. Therefore, it is nothing short of presumptuous and arrogant for someone to claim this position before Christ actually returns to bless those who are faithful and discreet.

This next point is likely to be the most detrimental that the Watchtower has yet to address. Many JW’s may not realize that there is a parallel account in Luke regarding the “faithful slave.” In Luke 12:37, Jesus describes the blessing of the slave when He returns. Peter’s response to the parable is noteworthy: “Lord, are you addressing this parable to us, or to everyone else as well?” If Jesus were referring to a small group of men that would appear 2,000 years later, then He surely would have made this clear. Instead, He goes on to explain the parable similarly to Matthew’s account in 24:45. Jesus is providing an answer to Peter’s question and directing it to the audience of Jesus. Therefore, there must be persons in Jesus’ audience who are the “faithful and discreet slave.”

So who really is the “faithful and discreet slave?" The answer is very simple: anyone who is found faithful to Christ’s command to “give them their rations at the proper time,” (Luke 12:42) when He returns. Surely these faithful slaves have existed since the first century. After all, Jesus directly admonished Peter to “feed my sheep,” (John 21:15-17). "

https://carm.org/new-light-on-faithful-discreet-slave-watchtower

 

[blue taylor]

What is not all nonsense? This is a place of sharing so......share.

Who accepts the gospel of Thomas as scripture? Please quote something from the Bible canon.

Then tell us what the kingdom of God is....so we can all learn from you...what this mystical "inside and outside" thing is? Please explain.

You have no idea how the canon of the new testament was created. God had nothing to do with it. Eusebius chose the books of the new testament when Constantine (a pagan until his death) instructed him to make 50 copies of scripture for the new religion. He chose what to put in and what to leave out. He put in everything that agreed with his version of Christianity, and left out everything that opposed his (Constantine's) theology. The Codex Sinaiticus is the oldest complete New Testament we have. It includes the Epistle of Barnabas, The Shepard Of Hermas, and the Didache. It also varies considerably from a "modern version" , of which there are over 300. Take your pick. The Kingdom is all around you. You just can not see it. Just as the Apostles could not see it. Seek and you shall find.