1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Why don't Christians live what they preach?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Pah, Feb 5, 2005.

  1. angellous_evangellous

    Ratings:
    +0
    Now think how silly it would be for you to pick whatever philospher you choose and than not to have read what they have written. That is what it is like for a Christian to wave the Christianty flag and than have not read the word of God.


    ---

    Excellent point, Rob. Very quotable. There is nothing sillier than a biblically ignorant "Christian," particularly if they are not a new convert. I am assuming that we should all give new converts some time to read and make sence out of the Bible, if they have not studied it already.

    If I knew how to send frubals and had them to send I would send them to you. :woohoo:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. No*s

    No*s Captain Obvious

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2004
    Messages:
    5,917
    Ratings:
    +471
    Click on the word "Frubals" above their frubal number :).
     
  3. Lycan

    Lycan Preternatural

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2005
    Messages:
    668
    Ratings:
    +122
    Atheism is not the only alternative to not being a christian...

    ...Being a good, decent, honest person is also not exclusive or synonomous to christianity. In my experience, I have met 3 times as many very wonderful, tolerant, extremely moral pagans than I have christians.

    I don't believe, in most cases, that religion defines a person to the extent it is ment to.

    IMHO,
    Lycan
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. retrorich

    retrorich SUPER NOT-A-MOD

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    2,321
    Ratings:
    +497
    NetDoc: Once again, you have hit the nail squarely on the head.

    I would add that they have also turned it into a gospel of hypocrisy and arrogance.
     
  5. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    Ratings:
    +3,192
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    You know,

    I was at best agnostic until I ran into a WHOLE congregation of people who were living the life and who were incredibly loving. I had to study the Bible then to find out WHY they were so different. It's one thing to judge Christianity by all of the hypocrites you see. It's sorta like judging a diet by all the people who don't have the discipline to follow it. But once you find a body of God's people, it becomes obvious that they are quite different from the rest of the world. They have changed from meanness and arrogance to love and humility.

    Robtex, using the Bible as a mirror means to use it to see YOUR faults first which is not only EXCELLENT advice, but a Biblical principle.

    Matthew 7:3 "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, `Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye".

    Too many pseudo Christians want to point fingers at all sorts of specks and keep hitting people with the boards in their own eyes.
     
  6. painted wolf

    painted wolf Grey Muzzle

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    15,369
    Ratings:
    +1,653
    Sadly NetDoc the most vocal Christians are the hypocrits. Its not like everyone wants to judge ALL Christians based on thier actions but they do make it difficult to not wonder. Extremists need to be faced and spoken against by the mainstream more reasonable parts of the religion. Unfortunatly this doesn't seem to happin to often.

    When was the last time you saw a major public Christian movement against the Jerry Falwells?
    Where is the main stream movement against the 'christian coalition' and afilliated groups?
    Where are the church leaders denouncing them?

    Extrimists make it very difficult for decent people. Who wants to publicly/nationally stand up and denounce another memeber of thier religion and seem intolerent themselves?
    Sadly they use this fact to thier advantage.

    wa:do
     
  7. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    Ratings:
    +3,192
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    Actually we do it all the time. But we don't make good copy for the newspapers.

    We won't employ their tactics against them and thus become them. Just like I don't feel it neccesary to take out full page ads against ANY movement. I am more concerned with making a local impact on the people who surround me. The best way to change the world is one person at a time.
     
  8. painted wolf

    painted wolf Grey Muzzle

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    15,369
    Ratings:
    +1,653
    Then my friend you need to becme more 'newsworthy'.

    I'm not sure I think that having church leaders say they don't agree with the extremists is becoming like them... I think that by not speaking up the church leaders are giving the impression that they either don't care or are giving tacit aproval of thier actions.

    Local impact is important, but when one sees a National movement one may feel that it is more justified and more correct. If the only people who speak up against something are locals and the whole nation seems to be behind the other movement... well thats a lot of peer-pressure.
    I'm not saying don't work with the individual, but remember that the world is watching what is going on here.

    wa:do
     
  9. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    Ratings:
    +3,192
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    Thanks anyway. :D

    That's not the same as "denouncing" them.

    I am not worried about "public opinion". People have found or created many, many reasons to not believe in Jesus and the scriptures. I honestly feel the only TRUE way into the fold is to be loved in. Until you have met a group of people who are genuinely more interested in you then they are in themselves, you just can't understand what Christianity is all about. It's not about being "right". It's not about "exposing sin". It's not about who can pray the longest or the loudest.

    Jesus had only 12 really close disciples. 12. Sure there were masses that followed him, but his harsh speech was usually one on one, or in the company of these few men.

    I had the chance to meet Falwell a few years ago. As it was a private conversation, I won't post the details. Suffice it to say, that I didn't fawn over him. He did express concern over my continued employment with this client. I have not been asked back to service their network.
     
  10. johnnys4life

    johnnys4life Pro-life Mommy

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Messages:
    1,135
    Ratings:
    +154
    NetDoc got it right on the head with the Bible quote about the plank in your eye. The verse I was thinking of was what one of the disciples wrote, and if I could find the verse I'd quote it exactly, (but I can't because I can't remember exactly which book it was in, and when I looked up "mirror" in the Bible search tool it came up with nothing, which I know is wrong because it's in the New Testament at least twice), so I am a little flustered here.

    Anyway the verse goes something like this: (this is not exact so please forgive me) a man who reads the words of God and does not live it is like a man who sees himself in the mirror, and goes away and forgets what he looks like. That's pretty much the whole point.

    So the point of that is this, you can sit down and read the Bible, agree with the part about loving your neighbor, and then go call your neighbor a jerk because he ran over your mailbox, as if you just "forgot" what you just read. It's like looking in the mirror over your bathroom sink, seeing that your face is filthy, but instead of wiping it off you say BOY, my face SURE is dirty, it's much better to be clean, and walk away. And it won't do you one bit of good.

    Of course there are nice atheists and pagans and agnostics, but just remember that God called good and bad men alike, the Bible even says so, to be Christians. The difference then, is that many bad men and women have come to know Christ, and totally changed their lives, I doubt you can say that for athiesm in general.

    It's kind of like me when I got away from Christianity for a while. I just forgot how bad of a person I was without it, and how much I needed God in my life. I started living for myself again until I saw what a mess I was making, and the guilt and pain I was causing, and came back. Now I am not saying I'm perfect, but with God's guidance, I know I am getting less mean!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    Ratings:
    +3,192
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    That scripture IS an awesome scripture as well:

    James 1:23 Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror 24 and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. 25 But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it--he will be blessed in what he does. 26 If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless. 27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.
     
  12. non-duality

    non-duality Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    53
    Ratings:
    +7
    My opinion is:

    There where saints like Jesus was one, who wanted to give an example by their lives. The message was: follow me and do as I do. But the followers decided, it is would not be possible to live a live as they did. So they decided it is also good to worship this saints. By the time they felt superior by worshipping than others who acted in charity. They said if you do acts of charity but you don’t worship God in our way you will not come to heaven. The idea of hell was used to put others in fear. Ridiculous is that hell is supposed to be a place apart from God unless they call God omnipresent. By the time they said: you can do as good as possible but you will not reach God, because you use the wrong name. That is the second ridiculous thing, because God is omniscience. So God always knows when he (or she) is called and will respond. The influence of a believe in our behaviour can just come back, if we stop to elevate our saints into unreachable heights and say all of them were human beings as we are.
     
  13. MagickIsFun

    MagickIsFun Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2005
    Messages:
    127
    Ratings:
    +11
    i agree with above statements point.
     
  14. non-duality

    non-duality Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    53
    Ratings:
    +7
    Hello Sunstone to your question:

    “It's interesting that religious beliefs seem to make so little difference in people's behaviour. Subjectively, we think our beliefs matter a great deal to our behaviour. But objectively, they don't seem to have that much influence on it. Why is that?”

    My opinion is:

    There where saints like Jesus was one, who wanted to give an example by their lives. The message was: follow me and do as I do. But the followers decided, it is would not be possible to live a live as they did. So they decided it is also good to worship this saints. By the time they felt superior by worshipping than others who acted in charity. They said if you do acts of charity but you don’t worship God in our way you will not come to heaven. The idea of hell was used to put others in fear. Ridiculous is that hell is supposed to be a place apart from God unless they call God omnipresent. By the time they said: you can do as good as possible but you will not reach God, because you use the wrong name. That is the second ridiculous thing, because God is omniscience. So God always knows when he (or she) is called and will respond. The influence of a believe in our behaviour can just come back, if we stop to elevate our saints into unreachable heights and say all of them were human beings as we are.

    Martin
     
  15. non-duality

    non-duality Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2005
    Messages:
    53
    Ratings:
    +7
    sorry for ansering the second time, last time i had trouble with my computer, i found aferwards the text was already there. Unfortunately i cannot take it away now.

    Martin
     
  16. desi

    desi Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2004
    Messages:
    204
    Ratings:
    +10
    Christians have come to see themselves as stuck in sin so they don't try to avoid it, they praise God they can still go to heaven because 'Jesus died for their sins... If you just believe in Jesus you will go to heaven too!'

    Following the example of Godliness has been lost by and large.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. johnnys4life

    johnnys4life Pro-life Mommy

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Messages:
    1,135
    Ratings:
    +154
    You are absolutely right, I have noticed that too. I think a lot of people just think sin is sin when OTHER people are doing it, but not as it applies to thier own lives because of course, their circumstances are "special". But thank goodness that is not true for all of us!
     
  18. jesusfreakjess

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Messages:
    19
    Ratings:
    +3
    Ok well for one no body is perfect,2 christians don't do exactly what they preech but fairly close.
     
  19. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2004
    Messages:
    16,472
    Ratings:
    +3,192
    Religion:
    Christian Taoist
    Matthew 7:18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. 21 "Not everyone who says to me, `Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, `Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23 Then I will tell them plainly, `I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

    By and large, it was never found.
     
  20. jesusfreakjess

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Messages:
    19
    Ratings:
    +3
    I really just want everyone to realize and understand novody is perfect
     
Loading...