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Featured Why Does Everyone Have to Reject the Messiah?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by wizanda, Feb 12, 2019.

  1. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    No worries.

    Which ones do and which ones don't?

    What's your view of Vishnu and Shiva?

    Says who?
     
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  2. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Judaism, Christian, Islam, Zoroastrian, Hindu, Buddhist, Taoist, Mayan, etc...

    Some of the philosophies don't like Confucianism; yet I've not studied every religion in full.
    Brahma = Creation, Vishnu = Sustainer, Shiva = Refresher...

    They're different character references of the Source.
    13 Dimensions and Commandments

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
    #102 wizanda, Mar 22, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2019
  3. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    On what basis do you classify all of these as major world religions?

    Are you the Messiah?

    Okay, so you espouse a common view of the Trimurti (which is far from the only view adopted by Hindus).

    Can you summarise this here?
     
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  4. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Millions of followers, and global scope.
    Got the New Name of Christ in the Bible, and in many religions - so it does seem likely.
    In my NDE saw the dimensions between Hell and Heaven, which appeared to match the 10 Commandments... Plus 2.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  5. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    I'm pretty sure that doesn't apply either to Zoroastrianism or the Mayan religion...

    If that is the case, why do you need to study other religions to see if they have a Messiah character? Surely this sort of thing should already have been communicated to you/you should know this sort of thing before studying those other religions?

    That doesn't exactly answer my original question. Do you believe another being guided you in some way/communicated these things to you?
     
  6. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    No kidding. In fact it's rare, outside of western encyclopedias, whose authors most likely put tit there to find some sort of comparison to their trinity concept.
     
  7. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    Indeed.
     
  8. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    They both used to have lots of followers.
    I'm proof reading what is useful, and just seeing how come people are confused down here.
    Yeah was told some of the deceptions in the Bible as a child; these same things apply across the Dharmic religions, and could all be explained.
    Somethings are guided because of the experiences; yet much is built on physics, the I-Ching, Commandments, many religions, multiple NDE testimonies, etc...

    It is a logical step to understanding reality... If someone has a better idea, I'm always willing to question more clear perspectives.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  9. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    This arguably applies to many other religions that don't make your list.. Take the national religions of past civilisations and empires.

    Hmm.

    So you don't exactly believe you were guided by another being?
     
  10. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    it wasn't a comparison, it was a simplification of a vast question, which isn't summarizable in words.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  11. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    The Source of reality is like a CPU that manifests it at a quantum level, thus it guides all of us; yet as an archangel, sort of always had an understanding of metaphysics.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  12. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    What if the Source of reality as you see it were only the Source of the material world? What if there was a Higher God?
     
  13. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Always open to having great faith "I do not know!"
    Open to questioning this reality is formulated, and only when there is a reality that is totally random could we say, "this is remotely the true reality".

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  14. IndigoChild5559

    IndigoChild5559 Loving God and my neighbor as myself.

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    There are many who have come and claimed to be the Messiah, but NONE have fulfilled the requirements:
    1. Bring all the Jews back to Eretz Yisrael.
    2. Rule from Jerusalem
    3. Usher in World Peace.
     
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  15. The_Fisher_King

    The_Fisher_King Trying to bring myself ever closer to Allah
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    Openness to possible alternative viewpoints is a great attitude!
     
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  16. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Within the Curse of Moses, 'Peace' (Deuteronomy 29:19-20) doesn't happen until the Lord has cleansed the dross (Rephaim, Nephilim) from our people with Fire (Deuteronomy 29:21-26).

    Then after everyone shall know the Lord, and we shall live in a time of Godliness; with everyone who didn't accept the Snare, and Curse removed (Deuteronomy 30:1-7).
    The New Jerusalem comes down from Heaven (Revelation 21:10).
    As the prophets so rightly put, a Jew is someone who accepts the Marvelous Works of the Lord (Zechariah 8:6-8).

    Our people have confused the theology, and thus were put under the Curse because EL is the Source, Eloh is a Divine Representative, and Elohim generally implies part of the Divine Council.

    Thus because Judah rejected the Rock of their Salvation (Deuteronomy 32:15), by rejecting Yeshua Elohim (Isaiah 52:10, Psalms 98:3) - which contextually is the "Salvation from our God".

    Thus Judah have gone after other Elohim, and rejected the Source - EL (Deuteronomy 32:16-18).
    Claiming to be the Messiah, and God sending someone before the things discussed, is part of the problem.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  17. IndigoChild5559

    IndigoChild5559 Loving God and my neighbor as myself.

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    Deuteronomy 29 and 30 refer to the curses and blessings of those Jews who choose to ignore the Torah and return to the Torah (respectively) right now in this world. The Torah makes no mention of any afterlife -- you have to wait til the prophets to learn of the world to come.

    Jerusalem, New Jerusalem, it's unimportant. The point is that JESUS didn't rule from Jerusalem. The messiah is an all or nothing deal. Either you fulfill all the prophecies and you are the messiah, or you don't and you aren't. Even *I* can say," Hi I'm the messiah, and I'll fulfill the prophecies the next time I come."

    Hogwash. And Zechariah doesn't say that at all. Try googling it and read.

    Who is Eloh?

    El is short for Elohim. Elohim has several different meanings, but mostly in the sacred texts it refers to the One True God, the yah hey and vav hey, NOT to a being on the divine council.

    You cite (but irritatingly do not quote) a lot of verses that don't back up what you are saying.

    In Deuteronomy 32:15-18 Jersharun refers to all Israel, not just Judah. It refers to them rejecting the LORD God, not Jesus, and turning to idolatry, as is recording in the rest of the Tanakh. You are reading INTO the text something that is NOT THERE.

    Isaiah 52:10 and Psalms 98:3 do not speak of Jesus, or even of the Messiah. When it speaks of God, it is referring to the Yad Hey and Vav Hey. And Salvation is not salvation from sin and entrance into heaven. It is salvation from our enemies, especially being delivered from Egypt.
     
  18. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, Luke 7:25,30 in no way says that everyone will reject Messiah.
     
  19. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    If an admin sees, hopefully they can edit the OP; it should say Luke 17:25 & Luke 17:30, sorry.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  20. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Shalom,
    Generally post each verse name in full, so it makes it link to each scripture on this site for everyone.
    The Messianic prophecy gets fulfilled over time, as the only appearance of the word 'Messiah' in the Tanakh is Daniel 9:26, and Isaiah 52:14 (Dead Sea Scrolls - 1QIsaa) - which both happen before the destruction of the 2nd temple...

    Then there is the Diaspora which is the Curse of Moses in Deuteronomy 28, Leviticus 26, Zechariah 11...

    After this all nations come against Israel in Zechariah 12, Deuteronomy 29, Ezekiel 38-39...

    And then the Messianic Age...
    EL (H410) is the Source, used in El Elyon (God Most High)...

    When H is added to a word it makes it breathed into manifestation; Hayah (H1961), and Havah (H1933) meaning similar to become.

    Eloh (H433) means a Divine Being, and the plural Elohim (H430), generally implies Beings within the Divine Council.

    In Isaiah 46:9 we're told in Hebrew that El (God) is not like the Elohim (Divine Beings), where it paraphrases Deuteronomy 32:7-9...

    Rabbinic Hebrew derived ideas are in violation of it, as El Elyon is the Source of our Reality, and YHVH is one of the Elohim.
    The Salvation (H3444) from God being made a promise in the Tanakh is not idolatry; what is being understood of the prophecies has made it into an abomination.

    The idea that the Source of reality created all this texts, and historical events, where people then deny it being from their God, is a form of atheism to us.
    It says Yeshuat Eloheinu (H3444 + H430) in both verses, the Salvation from our God.

    The context in Isaiah 52:10-14 is that the flesh of David is Chosen in Psalms 89:19-21 to be the Vessel of the Lord, and in Isaiah 52:14 with the additional yod on the word blemished in the dead sea scrolls, that makes it literally about the Messiah/Anointed.
    God is not parts, El is the Source, and Elohim are Divine aspects of the one Source... Yahavah means Lord of Creation; Yehoshua means Lord that Saves.
    Deuteronomy 30:4 If your outcasts are in the uttermost parts of the heavens, from there the Lord your God will gather you, and from there he will bring you back.
    The only way to establish the meaning of the Bible, is by using the Bible; word searching the Marvelous Work, is how we can acquire its meaning.

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
    #120 wizanda, Mar 24, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
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