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Why do God/s "hide" from disbelievers?

viole

Ontological Naturalist
Premium Member
Why does it seems like God or Gods hide from disbelievers but atleast in some way are recognised by or shown to believers?
You mean the great Juju at the bottom of the sea, God, Allah, Zeus, Thor, Apollo.... or which one?

For instance, why do you think that Apollo was hiding from disbelievers, but not to believers in Him, in your opinion?

Ciao

- viole
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
It's not that the gods hide. It's that those who reject a particular model of theism do not:
  • Have an ontological framework that permits such gods to be defined as "existing" in their view
  • Have a background (culture and personality) that permits them to accept a particular understanding of gods
Just as a reminder, for most of human history, the gods were understood as various natural and social forces that comprise reality itself. These do not "hide" from anyone. These gods are literally the air you breathe, the love that stirs in your heart, and the creativity that inspires invention. Whatever it is that is deemed sacred or worthy of worship? Those are a people's gods. They don't hide unless one does not to look and study theology and religion (e.g., they "hide" from the blind and ignorant).
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Why does it seems like God or Gods hide from disbelievers but atleast in some way are recognised by or shown to believers?

Any thoughts?

The word god is an ambiguous word. When a believer asks "why don't you believe in god?" They're referring to their specific god. It's an unhelpful question given "I don't believe in god" signals to, for example, a christian they don't believe in "his or her" god.

A productive question (I'm not saying your question isn't productive) to ask is "what is your experience of awe?" or What experience changed your life drastically that you never been the same since... what do you do or value that makes you feel whole?

Aka. The question (not you and any particular believer) is biased.

-
Also, because believers (any believer) have preset definitions of god, many atheists only go by that preset definition given to them not their own (if they have one as being an atheist many don't). So, instead of rejecting gods in general (pagan, eastern, mythological, abrahamic, etc), they just reject the "abrahamic" god-Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Bahai, and otherwise.

If the believer (any believer) has no intentions of learning about atheists views without interpreting it through his or her religious biases (which is hard, takes a lot of openness and patience), it's hard for the atheist to be reciprocal, and be interested in the views of believers.

You (not accusing you of being wrong or anything) have to be mindful that there are different definitions of gods that are not all creators and don't have similarities to abrahamic definitions. The experiences are different than abrahamics.

Therefore, it's not that god (abrahamic) hides from atheists. It's just that believers have predefinitions of god, and by definition atheists do not.
 
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Audie

Veteran Member
It's not that the gods hide. It's that those who reject a particular model of theism do not:
  • Have an ontological framework that permits such gods to be defined as "existing" in their view
  • Have a background (culture and personality) that permits them to accept a particular understanding of gods
Just as a reminder, for most of human history, the gods were understood as various natural and social forces that comprise reality itself. These do not "hide" from anyone. These gods are literally the air you breathe, the love that stirs in your heart, and the creativity that inspires invention. Whatever it is that is deemed sacred or worthy of worship? Those are a people's gods. They don't hide unless one does not to look and study theology and religion (e.g., they "hide" from the blind and ignorant).

It is not a lack, shortcoming, or inability
on my part that results in undetecttable beings playing no part in my life.

If someone's background somehow
"Permits" them to see flying saucer and cavorting with mermaids, so much the worse for them.
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
Why does it seems like God or Gods hide from disbelievers but atleast in some way are recognised by or shown to believers?

Any thoughts?

There are a few things that are wrong with your premise, in my opinion.

First, if God or gods are shown to believers, then why would there be a reason to believe?

Second, would you feel a need to hide from someone who didn't believe you existed?
 

Audie

Veteran Member
There are a few things that are wrong with your premise, in my opinion.

First, if God or gods are shown to believers, then why would there be a reason to believe?

Second, would you feel a need to hide from someone who didn't believe you existed?

And that how things " seem" to someone-
is not evidence of anything except about how
they feel.
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
It is not a lack, shortcoming, or inability on my part that results in undetecttable beings playing no part in my life.

The gods aren't "undetectable beings", though... not most of them, anyway. We've all got shortcomings and inabilities - that can include the inability to classify gods as "real" and the inability to understand that gods are not necessarily "undetectable beings" for example. We've all got boxes we think inside that limit how we perceive the world. There's no shame in it; it's an inevitable human condition. The thesis I'm trying to get across is: it's not that the gods "hide" but that our assumptions about the world blind us to certain things.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
What an anthropomorphic God, playing hide and seek, like five year old children on a rainy day. Just who is this fellow, anyway?

To me the spiritual path is hide & seek. He hides in our hearts and we seek Him there. When we 'find' Him, we become Him.
 
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