Why Didn't God Leave Huge Quantities of Secular Evidence For Jesus?

[Subduction Zone]

I believe again you are defining myth according to your own desires. I define it differently.

How do you define myth? And please, watch the personal insults. My desires have nothing to do with why we know that the Nativity stories are myths. You should be asking how we know that.

 

[Skywalker]

How do you define myth? And please, watch the personal insults. My desires have nothing to do with why we know that the Nativity stories are myths. You should be asking how we know that.

The differences in the details can be harmonized and the Bible writers were different people who wrote to different audiences. Do the narratives of Jesus’ birth contradict each other? | GotQuestions.org

The gospels were written by four different men to four unique audiences, so it is natural that they would include different details concerning the life of Christ. But their writing was superintended by the Holy Spirit, who guaranteed that what each wrote was the absolute truth. There are differences, but they can all be harmonized. The narratives of Jesus’ birth found in Matthew and Luke are not contradictory but complementary.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The differences in the details can be harmonized and the Bible writers were different people who wrote to different audiences. Do the narratives of Jesus’ birth contradict each other? | GotQuestions.org

Actually they can't be. The author of Luke was wrong and probably lying with his Nativity story. It fails repeatedly.

 

[We Never Know]

Actually they can't be. The author of Luke was wrong and probably lying with his Nativity story. It fails repeatedly.

Show evidence for your post or its simply mere opinion. Opinion isn't evidence.

 

[rational experiences]

The Bible theoried thesis

Studied moment of space converting dust nuclear fission. A space moment caused to fission. Conversion in mass.

Sion.

Converting Sion to prove by words that science by numbers left the garden wilderness a desert by burning bush why animals humans were life sacrificed. Why forest gone desert left instead.

Science study of science.

Thesis first.

O God mass stone product thesis O just mass.

O pi Phi just equating to remove portion of mass but leave God planet intact

Gold the commodity of their converting.

Gold is pressurized seams cold melt.

They applied hot melt by radiation increase.

Study said changed gas spirit presence in heavens. Temple steps melted.

Cooling tower radiation passing through pyramid walls transmitted by temples did not cool in water well. Pyramid water pump used in technology.

Cooling failed.

Protection of life water.

Life healthy
Life sacrificed not healthy
Phenomena spirit cause only seen by those who witnessed it

No different today than what it ever was.

Only fake storyteller are scientists if they are a sophist occultist. They know spirit phenomena is true. Witness of.

Science then had to prove to science that phenomena is real.

What you are doing.

Mars burst on fire Mayan vision.
Planets contorted in outer system vacuum tried to pull them apart.

Seen by study in out of space. Strange planet mass.

Archaeology proof ancient machine parts

Found by man choice motivated on male wisdom needed to prove to occult lying science brother. His own motivation of proof..evidence.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Show evidence for your post or its simply mere opinion. Opinion isn't evidence.

You have to follow the threads. It is easy to provide evidence for my claim. But the person I was responding to never uses reliable sources. As a result I rarely bother with evidence. I will debate seriously with serious debaters.

And you have been around long enough. I am sure that you know of the Census of Quirinius. Romans kept very good records of their censuses. And to make matters worse Judea was paying tribute, not taxes when Herod was still alive. It seems the next generation did not do so well and the Romans took over around 5 CE and ordered a census to be taken in 6 CE. That was the first Roman Census of that state.

The Date of the Nativity in Luke

 

[Skywalker]

Actually they can't be. The author of Luke was wrong and probably lying with his Nativity story. It fails repeatedly.

Just because Luke didn't mention Egypt doesn't mean he didn't agree with Mary and Joseph hiding Jesus in Egypt. Do the narratives of Jesus’ birth contradict each other? | GotQuestions.org

It’s important to acknowledge that silence does not equal denial. Luke’s omission in his narrative of the flight to Egypt cannot be construed as evidence that it never happened. Luke never says that Joseph and Mary did not go to Egypt; he simply doesn’t comment on the event. Matthew never mentions the shepherds of the nativity—are we to assume because of Matthew’s omission that no shepherds came? Also important is the fact that neither Matthew nor Luke claim that he is penning an exhaustive account of every detail surrounding the birth of Christ.

 

[Skywalker]

did you even read all of the things the Jews took after the invasion? There is ZERO doubt here that this is all mythology.
Second Temple Judaism
During the period of the Second Temple (c. 515 BC – 70 AD), the Hebrew people lived under the rule of first the Persian Achaemenid Empire, then the Greek kingdoms of the Diadochi, and finally the Roman Empire.[32] Their culture was profoundly influenced by those of the peoples who ruled them.[32] Consequently, their views on existence after death were profoundly shaped by the ideas of the Persians, Greeks, and Romans.[33][34] The idea of the immortality of the soul is derived from Greek philosophy[34] and the idea of the resurrection of the dead is derived from Persian cosmology.[34] By the early first century AD, these two seemingly incompatible ideas were often conflated by Hebrew thinkers.[34] The Hebrews also inherited from the Persians, Greeks, and Romans the idea that the human soul originates in the divine realm and seeks to return there.[32] The idea that a human soul belongs in Heaven and that Earth is merely a temporary abode in which the soul is tested to prove its worthiness became increasingly popular during the Hellenistic period (323 – 31 BC).[29] Gradually, some Hebrews began to adopt the idea of Heaven as the eternal home of the righteous dead.[29]

Daniel believed in heaven and the resurrection of the dead, and he wrote the book of Daniel before the rule of the Persians. Rel 101: Understanding the Bible: Daniel

Although it does not actually claim to have been written in the sixth century BCE, the Book of Daniel gives clear internal dates such as "the third year of the reign of king Jehoiakim," (1:1), that is, 606 BCE); "the second year of the reign of king Nebuchadnezzar, " (2:1), that is, 603 BCE); "the first year of Darius, ...

 

[Skywalker]

No one claimed that.

Try again.

Even after the time of the Persian invasion there was no Jewish doctrine about heaven. Proclaim the Good News to all creation

The term Resurrection; during the time of Jesus meant life after death. The Jews at that time did not have any definite belief in life after death. The Pharisees and the Sadducees were divided on this issue. The Pharisees believed in the spirits, angels and life after death. The Sadducees did not believe in all of them.

 

[Skywalker]

You have to follow the threads. It is easy to provide evidence for my claim. But the person I was responding to never uses reliable sources. As a result I rarely bother with evidence. I will debate seriously with serious debaters.

And you have been around long enough. I am sure that you know of the Census of Quirinius. Romans kept very good records of their censuses. And to make matters worse Judea was paying tribute, not taxes when Herod was still alive. It seems the next generation did not do so well and the Romans took over around 5 CE and ordered a census to be taken in 6 CE. That was the first Roman Census of that state.

The Date of the Nativity in Luke

There is historical evidence about what the Bible said about what went on during the rule of King Herod. Is there secular evidence Herod killed babies under the age of two? | NeverThirsty

The Jewish historian Flavius Josephus describes King Herod the Great as a very evil man.

[Herod] commanded that all the principal men of the entire Jewish nation wheresoever they lived, should be called to him. Accordingly, there were a great number that came, because the whole nation was called, and all men heard of this call, and death was the penalty of such as should despise the epistles that were sent to call them. And now the king was in a wild rage against them all, the innocent as well as those that had afforded him ground for accusations; and when they were come, he ordered them all to be shut up in the hippodrome, and sent for his sister Salome, and her husband Alexas, and spoke thus to them: — “I shall die in a little time, so great are my pains; which death ought to be cheerfully borne, and to be welcomed by all men; but what principally troubles me is this, that I shall die without being lamented, and without such mourning as men usually expect at a king’s death.” For that he was not unacquainted with the temper of the Jews, that his death would be a thing very desirable, and exceedingly acceptable to them; because during his lifetime they were ready to revolt from him, and to abuse the donations he had dedicated to God: that it therefore was their business to resolve to afford him some alleviation of his great sorrows on this occasion; for that, if they do not refuse him their consent in what he desires, he shall have a great mourning at his funeral, and such as never any king had before him; for then the whole nation would mourn from their very soul, which otherwise would be done in sport and mockery only. He desired therefore that as soon as they see he hath given up the ghost, they shall place soldiers round the hippodrome, while they do not know that he is dead; and that they shall not declare his death to the multitude till this is done, but that they shall give orders to have those that are in custody shot with their darts; and that this slaughter of them all will cause that he shall not miss to rejoice on a double account; that as he is dying, they will make him secure that his will shall be executed in what he charges them to do; and that he shall have the honor of a memorable mourning at his funeral. [2]

These quotes help us understand that King Herod the Great was wicked. So we should not be surprised that a non-Christian wrote the following about Herod’s massacre of children under the age of two that is mentioned in Matthew 2:16. The non-Christian writer is Macrobius (A.D. 395-423).

On hearing that the son of Herod, king of the Jews, had been slain when Herod ordered that all boys in Syria under the age of two to be killed, Augustus said, “It’s better to be Herod’s pig, than his son” (dicta 56 Malc.)[3]

 

[Subduction Zone]

There is historical evidence about what the Bible said about what went on during the rule of King Herod. Is there secular evidence Herod killed babies under the age of two? | NeverThirsty

That is not a reliable source. By using such sources you in effect proclaim that the story of the Murder of the Innocents by Herod was a myth.

 

[Skywalker]

That is not a reliable source. By using such sources you in effect proclaim that the story of the Murder of the Innocents by Herod was a myth.

Macrobius mentions Herod's masscare of innocents.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Macrobius mentions Herod's masscare of innocents.

So are you saying that Matthew made it up?

 

[Skywalker]

So are you saying that Matthew made it up?

I was saying that there are secular sources matching what the Bible says.

 

[Skywalker]

So are you saying that Matthew made it up?

There is no evidence the Bible was made up. The Jews in Bible times didn't have a definitive belief of life after death. They didn't copy the Persian beliefs of life after death.

 

[Subduction Zone]

There is no evidence the Bible was made up. The Jews in Bible times didn't have a definitive belief of life after death. They didn't copy the Persian beliefs of life after death.

Wrong there is plenty of evidence that it was made up. Why would you say something so obviously false?

 

[Skywalker]

Wrong there is plenty of evidence that it was made up. Why would you say something so obviously false?

The lack of certainty in belief of life after death shows that what the Jews in Bible times believed in was not taken from Zoroastrianism. Proclaim the Good News to all creation

The Pharisees believed in the spirits, angels and life after death. The Sadducees did not believe in all of them. The Sadducees party put a tricky question to Jesus on this point of resurrection-life after death- quoting woman who had married seven husbands and died without a child.
According to the Law of Moses, if a man died without leaving a child, his brother had to marry the widow and bring forth children for his brother. The man in the story had six brothers. The widow married one after the other, as each one died without a child, and finally she also died.
Their question was: on the day of resurrection (in the next life) whose wife she would be since she had married seven of them. Probably their conception of life after death was a kind of continuity of the earthly existence. What they wanted to tell was that if there was life after death it would create an embarrassing situation for the woman if she would meet all her seven husbands.
Probably the incident never happened and the story was their own fabrication, to create a difficulty for those who believed in the next life, life after death.

 

[Skywalker]

Wrong there is plenty of evidence that it was made up. Why would you say something so obviously false?

Heaven and hell were things that the Jewish leaders in the time of Jesus didn't have a clear stance on. Jesus talked about heaven and hell when he talked about the good news. Why Didn't God Leave Huge Quantities of Secular Evidence For Jesus?

This is on pg 29 of Boyce's book:

"Historical features of Zoroastrianism, such as messianism, judgment after death, heaven and hell, and free will may have influenced other religious and philosophical systems, including Second Temple Judaism, Gnosticism, Greek philosophy,[10] Christianity, Islam,[11] the Baháʼí Faith, and Buddhism.[1"

Boyce is not a more credible source than a pastor because she mention that heaven is already mentioned in the scriptures in Psalms, and it became a more direct doctrine through Jesus, not the Persians.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Heaven and hell were things that the Jewish leaders in the time of Jesus didn't have a clear stance on. Jesus talked about heaven and hell when he talked about the good news. Why Didn't God Leave Huge Quantities of Secular Evidence For Jesus?



Boyce is not a more credible source than a pastor because she mention that heaven is already mentioned in the scriptures in Psalms, and it became a more direct doctrine through Jesus, not the Persians.

So desperate. Why can't you find any proper sources for your claims?

 

[Skywalker]

So desperate. Why can't you find any proper sources for your claims?

Jesus expanded on the Old Testament talking about heaven and hell-not the Persians.