Why did the Jews refused to be hellenized by Greeks

[Estro Felino]

Judea was conquered by the Greeks in the IV century BC. But they didnt take advantage of that great opportunity to become more Hellenized.
so they rebelled against Antioch IV and they restored their "Jewish" Kingdom. (Maccabeus' revolt and creation of the Ashmoneous dynasty).
Egyptians were more cunning because they welcomed the Greeks and created the greatest Hellenistic kingdom ever

 

[Estro Felino]

I think that rejecting Hellenism is like spitting on a golden plate.
The cultural superiority of Hellenism is based upon these important concepts:

1) absolute equality between man and woman
2) Gynocentrism and acknowledgment of the female capabilities (Cleopatra)
3) rejection of circumcision
4) Believing that man is as divine as God
5) Cosmopolitanism and Universalism (no nation is better than the other)
6) luxuria asiatica , that is, ostentation of luxury and sensuousness
7) feminization of God. God as mother, and not only as father

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

But their ungratefulness induced them not to take advantage of that great opportunity to become more civilized and Hellenized.

Dumb Jews.

 

[Estro Felino]

Dumb Jews.

No offense. But do you doubt that every Jew,in secret, think that man is superior to woman?
I don't

 

[Drolefille]

Wait, you think that Hellenic Greeks treated men and women as complete equals?

Citation needed.

While in particular upper class Greek women saw an expansion of their rights during this time, this wasn't universal - an Egyptian woman and Greek woman in Egypt had different rights - and it was an expansion, not absolute equality. While Sparta had much broader rights for women citizens (not helots and not slaves) in part due to the fact that male Spartan citizens were frequently gone to (or able to be called to) war, in Athens women were just plain women.

So, again, citation needed.

 

[Drolefille]

No offense. But do you doubt that every Jew, deep in their heart, think that man is superior to woman?
I don't

No more and no less than every Christian thinks man is superior to woman.

 

[Estro Felino]

Wait, you think that Hellenic Greeks treated men and women as complete equals?

Citation needed.

While in particular upper class Greek women saw an expansion of their rights during this time, this wasn't universal - an Egyptian woman and Greek woman in Egypt had different rights - and it was an expansion, not absolute equality. While Sparta had much broader rights for women citizens (not helots and not slaves) in part due to the fact that male Spartan citizens were frequently gone to (or able to be called to) war, in Athens women were just plain women.

So, again, citation needed.

Honey, do you have any idea what Hellenism is? It has nothing to do with Sparta and Athens.

In the IV century BC, Alexander the Great (Greek king) conquered all the Middle East, including Egypt. Lots of Hellenistic kingdoms were created where the oriental peoples' culture melted with the Greek one.
The result was a cosmopolitan, enlightened, and modern culture: Hellenism

In Egypt the Greek dynasty of Ptolomaei spread these values in all the Mediterranean countries, so even in Greece and Sicily, the most important Greek-speaking regions at that time.

Cleopatra was Greek, not Egyptian. She had not even a drop of Egyptian blood in her vein.
And she was considered a goddess, and she's the proof that Hellenistic nations tend to consider woman superior to man.

 

[Flankerl]

lol what?

So we kicked your *** and you are still mad after all those years?


Haha

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Honey, do you have any idea what Hellenism is? It has nothing to do with Sparta and Athens.
That's the result of the education system in the English speaking countries, where Ancient Greek history is not taught.
okay, let's teach some history
In the IV century BC, Alexander the Great (Greek king) conquered all the Middle East, including Egypt. Lots of Hellenistic kingdoms were created where the oriental peoples' culture melted with the Greek one.
The result was a cosmopolitan, enlightened, and modern culture: Hellenism

In Egypt the Greek dynasty of Ptolomaei spread these values in all the Mediterranean countries, so even in Greece and Sicily, the most important Greek-speaking regions at that time.

Cleopatra was Greek, not Egyptian. She had not even a gut of Egyptian blood in her vein.
And she was considered a goddess, and she's the proof that Hellenistic nations tend to consider woman superior to man.

Greece can not be looked upon as a singular unified nation-state as we think of them today. Rather it was a collection of city-states, with rights and privileges prone to varying from place to place. Spartan women did enjoy rights and recognition that few women in history have had, but Athenian women were, largely, viewed as nothing special. Neither one, as far as I know, considered women superior to men, especially the Athenians.

 

[Estro Felino]

Greece can not be looked upon as a singular unified nation-state as we think of them today. Rather it was a collection of city-states, with rights and privileges prone to varying from place to place. Spartan women did enjoy rights and recognition that few women in history have had, but Athenian women were, largely, viewed as nothing special. Neither one, as far as I know, considered women superior to men, especially the Athenians.

Again? Tell me: What does Athenian culture have to do with Hellenism?
http://graecomuse.wordpress.com/201...istic-a-brief-discussion-of-changing-factors/

 

[Estro Felino]

lol what?

So we kicked your *** and you are still mad after all those years?


Haha

I'm not mad. I was trying to figure out why Hellenism disgusted Jews

 

[Flankerl]

Because its Hellenism.

 

[GoodbyeDave]

I'm not mad. I was trying to figure out why Hellenism disgusted Jews

Because they'd convinced themselves that they were the unique people chosen by God, and therefore superior to everyone else. That trumps the achievements of the Hellenes: "You have great art, great literature, and great philosophers, but God prefers US!" The result of that way of thinking we can see today in the death toll in Palestine.

 

[Estro Felino]

Because its Hellenism.

I understand that. A masculine religion like Judaism could not stand Greeks' centrality of woman.

 

[Sunstone]

No offense. But do you doubt that every Jew, deep in their heart, think that man is superior to woman?
I don't

Careful there! You might strain your back shoveling out such heavy loads of BS.

 

[Drolefille]

Honey, do you have any idea what Hellenism is? It has nothing to do with Sparta and Athens.

In the IV century BC, Alexander the Great (Greek king) conquered all the Middle East, including Egypt. Lots of Hellenistic kingdoms were created where the oriental peoples' culture melted with the Greek one.
The result was a cosmopolitan, enlightened, and modern culture: Hellenism

In Egypt the Greek dynasty of Ptolomaei spread these values in all the Mediterranean countries, so even in Greece and Sicily, the most important Greek-speaking regions at that time.

Cleopatra was Greek, not Egyptian. She had not even a drop of Egyptian blood in her vein.
And she was considered a goddess, and she's the proof that Hellenistic nations tend to consider woman superior to man.

First off, don't call me "Honey."

Second regarding the "Hellenistic Period."
Hellenistic period - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

the idea of a Hellenistic period did not exist in Ancient Greece.

The major issue with the term Hellenistic lies in its convenience, as the spread of Greek culture was not the generalized phenomenon that the term implies. Some areas of the conquered world were more affected by Greek influences than others. The term Hellenistic also implies that the Greek populations were of majority in the areas in which they settled, while in many cases, the Greek settlers were actually the minority amongst the native populations. The Greek population and the native population did not always mix; the Greeks moved and brought their own culture, but interaction did not always occur.

But the time period you're talking about 4th Century BCE is SPECIFICALLY a male dominated time in Athens. We are explicitly covering that time period. It is called Classical Greece.

Everyday Life in Ancient Greece, 4th Century BC
Women in Classical Greece | Thematic Essay | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History | The Metropolitan Museum of Art

A young woman in Classical Athens lacked any rights of citizenship, and could only be described as the wife of an Athenian citizen.

Cleopatra's rule in Egypt no more proves that Hellenistic nations considered women superior to men than Queen Elizabeth proves that England was matriarchal. Egypt had a long history of seeing Pharoah as God-King, even when Pharoah was female, but these were the rarest of women - the average woman didn't have equal rights to men. That said, Julius Caesar was worshipped as a god too. Royal women don't prove anything about treating women equally.

Queen Cleopatra VII - Last Pharaoh of Egypt

"Despite the many rights of women, Egypt was not an egalitarian society. There were many class-based distinctions. Women did not inherit equally with men and fewer were literate. Rather than legal restrictions, custom dictated that middle and upper class women usually engage in child-rearing and home-based activities."
(http://www.library.nwu.edu/class/history/B94/B94women.html) Excursus III: The Status of Women in Ancient Egyptian Society)

So provide your citations if you have them, or admit you're wrong.

 

[Phil25]

And she was considered a goddess, and she's the proof that Hellenistic nations tend to consider woman superior to man.

Well here you go, Matriarchy.
Matriarchy is as bad as Patriarchy.

 

[Drolefille]

Well here you go, Matriarchy.
Matriarchy is as bad as Patriarchy.

That isn't matriarchy.

 

[jewscout]

um, actually some jews became Hellenized and Greek culture and architecture did effect jewish life and society. The times when Jews fought back against Hellenization was when non-Jewish rulers would completely outlaw jewish practices entirely, such as the events which would lead to the Maccabean revolt.


Hellenistic Judaism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

jews often synthesize aspects of the cultures they are surrounded by, whether they be philosophy, music, food, or clothing.

 

[xkatz]

I understand that. A masculine religion like Judaism could not stand Greeks' centrality of woman.

:biglaugh: