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Featured Why Darwinism is a saner attitude...

Discussion in 'Evolution Vs. Creationism' started by Estro Felino, Aug 12, 2019 at 9:38 AM.

  1. Polymath257

    Polymath257 Think & Care
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    Oh, that. carbon is the atom with 6 protons in its nucleus and, so, 6 electrons in its electron shells. It typically has 6, 7, or 8 neutrons in the nucleus also. The versions with 6 and 7 neutrons are stable and that with 8 is unstable (radioactive).

    Hydrogen has one proton in its nucleus and, so, on electron in the electron shells. It can have 0, 1, or 2 neutrons int he nucleus also. The version with 2 neutrons is unstable and those with 0 or 1 are stable.

    Helium has two protons in the nucleus and, so, two electrons in the electron shells. It can have one or two neutrons in the nucleus with both versions stable.

    The chemical properties of each are determined by the number of electrons and the energy levels they occupy. For example, helium has two electrons, which in their lowest energy state fills up the lowest energy level. That makes helium very inert chemically.

    I can go on, but I think you get the picture. The number of protons in the nucleus determine the type of atom and the number of electrons in the atom. The number of neutrons affects how stable the nucleus is. The chemical properties are mostly determined by the number and energies of the electrons.

    In bonds between atoms, the electrons are shared. This is a quantum effect the details of which can be determined by solving the Schrodinger equation.

    Now, you forgot to say why you think this is relevant to evolution. Evolution is a theory about biology, not chemistry, after all.
     
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  2. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    It is all good but you did not answer my main question, Natural Law, where it came from?
     
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  3. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Bullpoop and you know it.

    Genetics (DNA) does not lie, cannot lie.

    To you (or know people you know) get a flu jab every year?
     
  4. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    That is really true.
     
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  5. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    I am explaining why a 'chop' of history of Natural Law is not a good ,complete theory.
     
  6. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    It does not lie? but we by have very little explanation how it came about.
     
  7. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    How it came about is nothing to do with evolution, how it came about is abiogenesis. I provided a couple of links early. I do t suppose you looked at them. How it came about is becoming more and more understood.

    But evolution is understood
     
  8. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    Devil is in details.
     
  9. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Nope, devils in the definitions
     
  10. columbus

    columbus Conservative Catholic from Hell

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    That's religion, not science.
    Tom
     
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  11. ratiocinator

    ratiocinator Strange Loop

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    Frankly you don't appear to have a "main question" - every post seems to go off at a tangent. It's almost like you don't really know anything and want to just keep on changing the subject.

    Anyway - I don't know where "natural law" came from or even if it's a sensible question. What I do know is that postulating a god doesn't help - where did this god come from? See? Hasn't solved the problem, just moved it about a bit and got us nowhere. We know the universe and its laws exist but there is no evidence for any gods...
     
  12. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    Science by definition studies physical
    world, devil is of metaphysics, so, you are correct. Give Caesar...
     
  13. leov

    leov Well-Known Member
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    All action of elements he and I mentioned are covered by Natural Law.
     
  14. ratiocinator

    ratiocinator Strange Loop

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    Random statement game again?
     
  15. Polymath257

    Polymath257 Think & Care
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    Oh, that's because I didn't see you asking about that.

    I don't think that the origin of Natural laws is something that *can* be explained.

    Why not? because the only way to explain anything is to rely on some more fundamental law. So the most fundamental laws *cannot* have further explanations.
     
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  16. Polymath257

    Polymath257 Think & Care
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    I'm not even sure how to interpret what you wrote here.
     
  17. Polymath257

    Polymath257 Think & Care
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    Precisely. That's all that *anyone* can use to explain *anything*.
     
  18. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    what "heavens"?

    the earth is the result of left over matter of solar formation of the sun, orbitting the sun in an accretion disc and the lumping together through friction and gravity.

    Is god gravity?

    As in, it's entire surface was covered in water?

    Try molten lava. Followed by extreme bombardment from space rocks left over from the accretion disc, including one mega extreme collision with another, like mars-sized, planet which eventually resulted in the moon. Liquid water only came later - and never covered the entire surface

    mmkay
    i'm sure the skies cleared many a times.

    no need to rise if you're not submerged off course.
    but throughout history, land submerged, rose again, submerged,...
    some never submerged
    others never rose
    otherse never rose again

    so, yeah, pretty much true at any one time for some piece of land somewhere. But not really sensible in context of this list.

    nope, in the water

    nope, first the sea, then on land

    No, other species also evolved after homo sapiens. There's no "finally" in biology.


    All in all, thanks for playing, but... no.
     
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  19. PruePhillip

    PruePhillip Well-Known Member

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    Everything "out there"
    it comes back later and says God created the sun and such,
    but that's repeating. And remember, this was oral tradition
    way longer than it was written text.
    First the heavens, and the earth.
    It doesn't go into things alien to the people hearing this -
    such as M-theory hyperspace membranes triggering big
    bangs which create space and time.
    It doesn't go into the dust accretion in a solar disk, or the
    snowball earth or the lava earth.
    It's as if Genesis is saying, "Look, the first time you could
    have stood upon the earth, this is what it looked like."

    But... it does say things which would have been odd to the
    listeners - God "commanded" the earth to bring forth life.
    Yes, as of 2018 the consensus is that life came from the
    land - either in wet clay, warm ponds, volcanic porous
    rock... whatever. But on the land. And then the sea.
    Yes, you can say God IS gravity, and God IS evolution -
    God commands and the universe creates.

    At one stage the earth was largely oceanic - no land. And
    the earth was cloud based, like Venus and Titan today.

    It's not meant to be a text book. It's not meant to be a history
    book. But sometimes, just sometimes, you get glimpses of
    things people are not supposed to have known.
     
  20. Jim

    Jim Nets of Wonder

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