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Why Christians lie

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by angellous_evangellous, Dec 20, 2010.

  1. angellous_evangellous

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    I think Christians lie because they are taught to do so by their pastors and religious leaders. The only thing that matters, it seems, are the beliefs held by a particular tradition.

    These beliefs are engrained in the Christian, made infalliable by circular reasoning, and then solidified by the warning from the pastor that one's faith absolutely depends on the veracity of these claims.

    Unfortunately for the dishonest Chrisitan, nothing is infalliable, and in fact honest reasoning requires the subject to be falliable so one can change one's mind if one is wrong. So, to defend these precious doctrines to oneself and others, the Christian must lie. And we see Christians lie about Greek and Hebrew to support various doctrines; lie about science to support creationism; lie about the faith of others fir simple disagreement; lie about the nature of other religions --- it is truly limitless.

    When did it become OK for Christians to practice such open hatred for the truth, and hypocritically claim to be the bearers of it?

    It is abundantly obvious that it doesn't have to be this way. Honesty will strengthen faith. If one's only desire is for the truth of the matter, especially if it challenges one's faith, so much the better for intellect and faith.
     
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  2. Azakel

    Azakel Liebe ist für alle da

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    When I first saw the title I thought it was a troll ^_^

    I agree, I have known many 'Christians' like this, sad really.

    Like brainwashing(though not really). Seem easier to do to young kids within then Church then most adults.

    {quote]Unfortunately for the dishonest Chrisitan, nothing is infalliable, and in fact honest reasoning requires the subject to be falliable so one can change one's mind if one is wrong. So, to defend these precious doctrines to oneself and others, the Christian must lie. And we see Christians lie about Greek and Hebrew to support various doctrines; lie about science to support creationism; lie about the faith of others fir simple disagreement; lie about the nature of other religions --- it is truly limitless.[/quote]
    I think it's those dishonest Christian give the honest one a bad name. A lot of people only seem to hear them.

    When they gained power?
     
  3. Kilgore Trout

    Kilgore Trout Misanthropic Humanist

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    It's not a lie, if one doesn't know they're being dishonest.
     
  4. angellous_evangellous

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    There's a lot of truth to this, I think. But only in the West.

    It seems to me that honesty has been a perpetual virtue in the Eastern versions of Christianity, even when they were in control of states (or at least in the majority).
     
  5. bobhikes

    bobhikes infinitologist
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    I think you give people too much credit for the knowledge they have. Some religious people tend to trust belief far more than reason and actually are suspicious of reason. To be honest I'm an atheist and I have major issues with supposed reason.

    In today's world it is even worse. You can find proof of anything on the internet. If I believe that pigs fly. I can find pictures on the internet of pigs flying. If I stop once I find the picture I have proved to myself that pigs can fly.

    This is what I believe is happening with some of the religious. They want answers like all humans but they are comfortable being lead in certain aspects. They don't check the results instead just take them on faith. This is not lying. This is what faith is. You don't have to reason everything to live correctly and well. In fact in my opinion you may actually be happier with less reasoning.
     
  6. Christian Gnosis

    Christian Gnosis Active Member

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    I agree with you Angellous. This is very un-Christlike behavior.
     
  7. angellous_evangellous

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    Yes. However, I give them the benefit of the doubt - I don't start by insulting their intelligence. Besides, I do think that most of them know better.

    I mean, how much does blind ignorance it take to blindly copy a Greek grammar rule from the internet and try to argue an interpretation with it, applying it only to the English?
     
  8. Christian Gnosis

    Christian Gnosis Active Member

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    I have to agree, despite how sad someone in that condition is.
     
  9. angellous_evangellous

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    The problem is when they falsify facts to give substance for their faith.

    This is why so many fundamentalist Christians become atheists in college or seminary.
     
  10. Snowcat

    Snowcat Member

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    They lie because they are being lied to. They lie because even though their Spirit may have been renewed, their SOUL still lies in dense darkness.
     
  11. Christian Gnosis

    Christian Gnosis Active Member

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    I won't even state my opinion on this, it will make a lot of people very angry. I'll just go as far to say this is what happens to Christianity when Christians start mixing the new wine with old wine, and start sewing old patches into new garments, if you catch my drift.
     
  12. bobhikes

    bobhikes infinitologist
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    I never said they falsify facts. I said they never verify supposed facts. This is different. Have you ever noticed if you challenge some one of faith with facts they will eventually just write you off. They won't verify your facts or believe them. This does not make them a liar but possibly ignorant.

    These christians that become atheist are probably people that reason. People that reason will never make good people of faith no matter the faith. A person that reasons seeks undeniable answers and there is no such thing so they will never be satisfied with a scripted religion.
     
  13. fallingblood

    fallingblood Agnostic Theist

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    I've been having a real problem with this lately as well. My biggest problem is seeing Christians lie about other religions, to support that their beliefs are correct. And to a point, it even comes to them lying about other denominations, just so they can show that their narrow view is correct.

    I see it as simple willful ignorance. Instead of doing the needed research, or when shown that they may not be right, they simply ignore it all. I just have a huge problem with this as it, in my opinion, is extremely disrespectful, and just dishonest. More so, it is exactly that that leads to hate.

    However, I do have to say that I'm impressed by some of the, what I would call mature Christians. I'd place you in that category.
     
  14. bobhikes

    bobhikes infinitologist
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    As an atheist I have a unique view on this.

    I believe in evolution and as such it was just a matter of luck we came to be. If the dinosaurs didn't go extinct we would never be debating.

    So all you know comes from human kind. It is how we see the world and we go on using what we taught ourselves to prove ourselves right.

    You can build human kind using completely different systems and still have everything you see before you. Your reasoning would be completly different but because you built on your new system it would be correct.

    That being said everything you know is correct is only correct because others have told you it is so. Even if your self tells you it is not correct. History and science has proven your self wrong.

    As an Atheist, Humans must have created religion or religion is natural to us though evolution for some reason. Either way religion and faith is necessary to human survival.

    Reason has grown through out the years what was reasoned by the first humans is no longer reasoned by us today and millions of years from now will no longer be reasoned at all. When you use reason you a looking at a small window of time. Faith has however existed though out human development and possibly some other animals.

    For me there is no problem taking certain aspects of life on faith. It was done in the past and will be done in the future. If you had to reason out everything you would never be able to do anything. Using faith is not lying but natural to all humans.
     
  15. Man of Faith

    Man of Faith Well-Known Member

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    I would say something but it would be a lie.
     
  16. outhouse

    outhouse Atheistically

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    :clap all i can do is bow in your presense :faint:
     
  17. angellous_evangellous

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    Thanks, I'll be here all week.

    :takeabow:
     
  18. angellous_evangellous

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    *buys MoF a beer*
     
  19. outhouse

    outhouse Atheistically

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    I dont have a tenth of the education, but on the evolution side this is a daily task to deal with the blatant lies.

    This is not a atter of hate or vitriol at all, this is a matter of education and the lack of. All for the betterment of humanity as a whole. [if betterment is even a word lol :)]
     
  20. Man of Faith

    Man of Faith Well-Known Member

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    I don't drink because "insert lie here".
     
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