Why can't Religious people take Criticism?

[BSM1]

We can discuss and criticize everything under the sun - politics, Science, art, life - well almost everything except religion. We have to be careful not to offend religious sensitivities - i have never heard of anyone saying
"you offended my scientific sensitivities or my political sensitivities" - why should religion be exempt?

Is it because religion, at its core, is empty? It has no facts or evidence to back it up except for fervent belief? A belief that rests on fear of death and greed for the good, easy life which religions are happy to promise that awaits members?

This is not that hard - it is quite easy to figure out - If you had ever cornered a Bernie Madoff making tall claims of wonderful returns and asked him to show you what his system was and how he is able to beat the market, and since all he has is a ponzi-scheme, would he not respond with threats? Isn't that what we see from religions? Threats of hell to non-believers? Talk of not offending religious sensitivities etc?

IMO, religiosos are more interested in being right than knowing the truth. If the view others seem to make sense they will play the "offended" card.

 

[firedragon]

IMO, religiosos are more interested in being right than knowing the truth. If the view others seem to make sense they will play the "offended" card.

Its not the religions, its the people. Religiouns cant think, people can.

 

[BSM1]

Its not the religions, its the people. Religiouns cant think, people can.

I never said "religions" I said "religiosos" meaning those that espouse a certain religion. Even I knew that religions can't think.

 

[bobhikes]

We can discuss and criticize everything under the sun - politics, Science, art, life - well almost everything except religion. We have to be careful not to offend religious sensitivities - i have never heard of anyone saying
"you offended my scientific sensitivities or my political sensitivities" - why should religion be exempt?

Is it because religion, at its core, is empty? It has no facts or evidence to back it up except for fervent belief? A belief that rests on fear of death and greed for the good, easy life which religions are happy to promise that awaits members?

This is not that hard - it is quite easy to figure out - If you had ever cornered a Bernie Madoff making tall claims of wonderful returns and asked him to show you what his system was and how he is able to beat the market, and since all he has is a ponzi-scheme, would he not respond with threats? Isn't that what we see from religions? Threats of hell to non-believers? Talk of not offending religious sensitivities etc?

Are you serious?

People will get into fist fights over politics all over the world.
Go into a Biological summit and start saying creationism is the only truth(you won't last long)
Art-Lets discuss what art actually is and isn't for example most modern art isn't.

It all depends on who and where you are criticizing. Religion is no different than any of the other categories except that more people value religion higher than the other examples you gave, though politics rates pretty high as well.

 

[firedragon]

I never said "religions" I said "religiosos" meaning those that espouse a certain religion. Even I knew that religions can't think.

Lol. My bad then bro.

Peace.

 

[George-ananda]

So would you, had you seen half as many crimes and abuses attempt to justify themselves with those concepts as I did.

At least you acknowledge my point, that confirmed atheists too lose their objectivity, and that logical discussions are not going to change anything. It is natural to not like our core shaken. Watch how quickly discussions take on an undertone of viciousness when our core view of the universe is under challenge by another intelligent being. Our human version of the battering rams is seen.

 

[LuisDantas]

At least you acknowledge my point, that confirmed atheists too lose their objectivity, and that logical discussions are not going to change anything. It is natural to not like our core shaken. Watch how quickly discussions take on an undertone of viciousness when our core view of the universe is under challenge by another intelligent being. Our human version of the battering rams is seen.

People tend to "lose their objectivity" when they are pushed too far, if that is what you mean.

 

[George-ananda]

People tend to "lose their objectivity" when they are pushed too far, if that is what you mean.

That's what I meant, but we shouldn't let that happen.

 

[RamaRaksha]

Well, this isn't true of all religious people, or even all Christians (who I suspect this was mostly aimed at).
That said, there are quite a few who are this way.

In our culture, religious criticism is still almost taboo. Certainly moreso than most other subjects.
I've noticed though that many people's sense of identity is very deeply rooted in their religious beliefs and/or traditions.
To many, if you attack their religion, you are attacking the core of who they are.

Basically, they (in my view) have a misplaced sense of self-worth, and take themselves too seriously.
Like Sunstone said, it comes down to the Ego.

Well not exactly christians - in most islamic countries you can't say anything that someone might judge is against the prophet or the religion - mobs will show up and the police look the other way

 

[RamaRaksha]

The reason seems obvious to me. Unlike science, art etc. religion becomes a huge part of a person's identity. So when you criticise a person's religion, it feels like a personal attack. You may as well be criticising their culture, race, sexuality or anything else that's a big part of their identity.

To a Scientist Science is what he is - that is his or her identity. Same with an artist - whether it is a dancer or a singer - but you don't see them reacting the same way as religious people do

The answer is in the second part of my post? They get angry because at its core religion is empty? ie there is no evidence for God or Gods or Heavens or Hells? It is like asking a Bernie Madoff to reveal his system and since he has not system, he falls back on threats?

 

[RamaRaksha]

Speaking only for myself, you eventually get tired of saying "that's not what I believe," "my gods don't do that," and "I don't want to convert people" when faced with the same apparently universal criticisms of theism and religion time and time again. It becomes very tempting to tell people to go forth and have rough intercourse with themselves.

So, next time somebody lashes out when you (I'm using you in the general sense here) criticize religion and/or theism, take a moment to ask yourself how many times they may have seen that same criticism already.

Doesn't that apply to all other facets of life - we are in full election cycle here in the US - individual conversations might get testy but that doesn't stop anyone from having a civilized discourse whether in print or in forums like this - and as i posted at the beginning - no one cries - "you have insulted my political sensitivities"!

Fact is that with these other issues we have facts that we can discuss - something that we can bring up to make a point whereas with religion it rests solely on belief - zero facts - religions stress belief because well, they have nothing else to fall back on - amazingly that process actually works even the best give in to such brainwashing

 

[RamaRaksha]

Why cant they take criticism?

Because

1. The faith is weak
2. The doctrine is based on faith alone
3. They dont know why they actually believe in their theology
4. Scientifically there are weaknesses and they are in denial

Peace.

Exactly

 

[Madhuri]

To a Scientist Science is what he is - that is his or her identity. Same with an artist - whether it is a dancer or a singer - but you don't see them reacting the same way as religious people do

The answer is in the second part of my post? They get angry because at its core religion is empty? ie there is no evidence for God or Gods or Heavens or Hells? It is like asking a Bernie Madoff to reveal his system and since he has not system, he falls back on threats?

I don't know if i agree. If you tell an artist that their work isn't true art they might get offended. If you tell a scientist that science is a load of rubbish he will likely get annoyed.

 

[firedragon]

I don't know if i agree. If you tell an artist that their work isn't true art they might get offended. If you tell a scientist that science is a load of rubbish he will likely get annoyed.

Bro. You must understand that Criticism is not saying "Your science is a load of rubbish". Thats false slander.

Criticism is constructive. and if you have faith, knowledge etc you will not get offended for criticism, rather respond constructively.

 

[RamaRaksha]

I don't know if i agree. If you tell an artist that their work isn't true art they might get offended. If you tell a scientist that science is a load of rubbish he will likely get annoyed.

oh yes sure but there are facts to go by are they not? Saying one's art is not true is a first step, there is more to the conversation after that - for eg a dancer might have his or her head in the clouds thinking he or she is the best there is and some teacher might prove that they are not. Same thing with a Scientist - Einstein first thought that what Bohr was saying was rubbish but eventually everyone came around to what Bohr was saying because he proved he was right

That's the problem with religion - there is no proof that one can give - there are no facts - everything is simply based on a feeling - a belief - and this is where you are partly right - when its all about one's feelings and there is no way one can prove that one is right, anger comes quick?

 

[RamaRaksha]

Bro. You must understand that Criticism is not saying "Your science is a load of rubbish". Thats false slander.

Criticism is constructive. and if you have faith, knowledge etc you will not get offended for criticism, rather respond constructively.

Madhuri is female, lol - so please no Bro

 

[firedragon]

Madhuri is female, lol - so please no Bro

OMG. This is the biggest problem I have. One day I called a bro by "sis" and he got offended.

But then again, I should have realised by the name. So quick to respond to a person we tend to not look at the fine print of the name. Quite nonsensical of me.

Sorry sis Madhuri. I bow down and say sorry.

Cheers.

 

[Baladas]

Well not exactly christians - in most islamic countries you can't say anything that someone might judge is against the prophet or the religion - mobs will show up and the police look the other way

A fair point...I would be terrified to live somewhere like that.

 

[ak.yonathan]

I think that religious people should be able to take criticism. Those who are not able to aren't really following what their religion teaches.

 

[Erebus]

Doesn't that apply to all other facets of life - we are in full election cycle here in the US - individual conversations might get testy but that doesn't stop anyone from having a civilized discourse whether in print or in forums like this - and as i posted at the beginning - no one cries - "you have insulted my political sensitivities"!

Fact is that with these other issues we have facts that we can discuss - something that we can bring up to make a point whereas with religion it rests solely on belief - zero facts - religions stress belief because well, they have nothing else to fall back on - amazingly that process actually works even the best give in to such brainwashing

Hmm, I'm not sure i agree with you there. I've seen political discussions get pretty explosive leaving all parties offended.

I'm going to suggest that you're running into problems because of the way you phrase things. Telling people that they have zero facts, nothing to fall back on and that they've been brainwashed isn't a good way to approach a subject. It immediately puts people on the defensive. If you feel that no religion has anything to do with facts and that they're all solely about belief, why not try discussing what people believe and why? They may have no facts in your opinion, but their reasons for belief might just extend beyond brainwashing.