Why can't religion be more like an art?

[amorphous_constellation]

I suppose it would break all kinds of rules in the general district of religion, (defined here simply as a connection to metaphysical forces) but what if religion were treated as an art form, wherein each individual could use it as a method of expression. And I specifically say 'expression' to give it a certain shift of general focus, as otherwise, religion under the consolidation of a king's power, or the prescription of ossified prophecy leaves religion to be focused on inhibitions / morality. Such religious content is then often consolidated with little room for subjective discrimination by the end-user.

Pre-historic people, I think, generally treated religion more as an art-form in their nascent journey to form it. It was most likely more about an interpretation of their present reality, making it magical as opposed to plain, giving the sea and sky etc. an amplification in importance before first emitting so many rules. Creating their own individual spiritual poetry, art-work, and ideas about good and evil. Of course, most modern religious would surely think all of this was spiritually wrong

 

[1213]

Why can't religion be more like an art?

Please tell first how you define word religion?

 

[columbus]

Please tell first how you define word religion?

This is a very important question, in the context of the OP.

I have beliefs about the unknowable. I don't consider them religious because I don't expect anybody else to believe them. But maybe you, @ideogenous_mover , do. So explain what you mean by a religious belief, as opposed to the many other beliefs people have.
Tom

 

[amorphous_constellation]

Please tell first how you define word religion?

This is a very important question, in the context of the OP.

Very simply. Merely as a connection to a spirit world / god / gods

 

[leov]

I suppose it would break all kinds of rules in the general district of religion, (defined here simply as a connection to metaphysical forces) but what if religion were treated as an art form, wherein each individual could use it as a method of expression. And I specifically say 'expression' to give it a certain shift of general focus, as otherwise, religion under the consolidation of a king's power, or the prescription of ossified prophecy leaves religion to be focused on inhibitions / morality. Such religious content is then often consolidated with little room for subjective discrimination by the end-user.

Pre-historic people, I think, generally treated religion more as an art-form in their nascent journey to form it. It was most likely more about an interpretation of their present reality, making it magical as opposed to plain, giving the sea and sky etc. an amplification in importance before first emitting so many rules. Creating their own individual spiritual poetry, art-work, and ideas about good and evil. Of course, most modern religious would surely think all of this was spiritually wrong

Modern religions are political, not spiritual. pre-historic people and even now days primitive tribal people were to a greater degree clairvoyant and in tune with spiritual dimension than modern people, in other words they were to a greater degree shamanic. 'Faith' was much less theoretical as they were deeper involved into spiritual practice.

 

[sun rise]

what if religion were treated as an art form, wherein each individual could use it as a method of expression.

Religious expression can be through the arts. The visual arts, music and dance are all employed by various religious groups especially in the East but also by some in the West.

So I would not call religion and art form but that art forms can express religion.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Pre-historic people, I think, generally treated religion more as an art-form in their nascent journey to form it.

Why would you think such a thing?

It was most likely more about an interpretation of their present reality, making it magical as opposed to plain, ...

I suspect that they perceived it as magical and oft times threatening.

 

[Nakosis]

I suppose it would break all kinds of rules in the general district of religion, (defined here simply as a connection to metaphysical forces) but what if religion were treated as an art form, wherein each individual could use it as a method of expression. And I specifically say 'expression' to give it a certain shift of general focus, as otherwise, religion under the consolidation of a king's power, or the prescription of ossified prophecy leaves religion to be focused on inhibitions / morality. Such religious content is then often consolidated with little room for subjective discrimination by the end-user.

Pre-historic people, I think, generally treated religion more as an art-form in their nascent journey to form it. It was most likely more about an interpretation of their present reality, making it magical as opposed to plain, giving the sea and sky etc. an amplification in importance before first emitting so many rules. Creating their own individual spiritual poetry, art-work, and ideas about good and evil. Of course, most modern religious would surely think all of this was spiritually wrong

I think ancient religion was more inline with leadership authority. Claiming the authority to answer questions no one else had answers for. Folks claiming to possess special information from a God which could be relied on to make decisions.

Modern religion, sure I can see it more as an art form. In the past, religion established itself in the form of political authority IMO.

 

[Quintessence]

I confess I'm a bit perplexed by the OP. You mean to tell me religion isn't already an art? It always has been. Religions have been infused with art since their inception. It is far more an art than a science, which is why misguided attempts to discredit religion through science are precisely that... misguided. Might as well try to argue against the aesthetic value of your favorite painting or movie for all the good that does.

 

[Vinayaka]

I suppose it would break all kinds of rules in the general district of religion, (defined here simply as a connection to metaphysical forces) but what if religion were treated as an art form, wherein each individual could use it as a method of expression. And I specifically say 'expression' to give it a certain shift of general focus, as otherwise, religion under the consolidation of a king's power, or the prescription of ossified prophecy leaves religion to be focused on inhibitions / morality. Such religious content is then often consolidated with little room for subjective discrimination by the end-user.

Pre-historic people, I think, generally treated religion more as an art-form in their nascent journey to form it. It was most likely more about an interpretation of their present reality, making it magical as opposed to plain, giving the sea and sky etc. an amplification in importance before first emitting so many rules. Creating their own individual spiritual poetry, art-work, and ideas about good and evil. Of course, most modern religious would surely think all of this was spiritually wrong

Music, dance, movement, religious art, there can be a ton of creativity (art) in the worship of God.

You should see the beautiful flower garlands made in India. Real art!

 

[amorphous_constellation]

Why would you think such a thing?

You mean to tell me religion isn't already an art? It always has been. Religions have been infused with art since their inception.

Well it was more like an art before the concrete of theology quickened. The religion was in the storytelling, the song and dance, and the new and constant creation of visual symbols. To us, these things seem like they are more like cultural furniture that we merely adore from a point chronologically afar. The birth of unique metaphor and poetry and prayer that we remember, is all back there. Someone was living in the painting when he first called thunder the stomping of god steeds, or decorated a desert wind with prose dedicated to a god.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

I think ancient religion was more inline with leadership authority.

It may have quickly come to that in some cases, especially by the neolithic

 

[Quintessence]

Well it was more like an art before the concrete of theology quickened. The religion was in the storytelling, the song and dance, and the new and constant creation of visual symbols. To us, these things seem like they are more like cultural furniture that we merely adore from a point chronologically afar. The birth of unique metaphor and poetry and prayer that we remember, is all back there. Someone was living in the painting when he first called thunder the stomping of god steeds, or decorated a desert wind with prose dedicated to a god.

I suppose what I find the most strange is that you refer to these religious modalities as if they're in the past and don't exist in the present. On the contrary, these traditions and perspectives are alive and well in the present. This is the case even within traditions that are considered to be more dogmatic or organized. The center of religion is and always has been storytelling that articulates a culture's values and identity. It is these narratives that shape how we relate to and see the world... and also inform behaviors ranging from rituals to every day life.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Very simply. Merely as a connection to a spirit world / god / gods

The "spirit world / god / gods" of which religion?

 

[Thief]

Pre-historic people,

nope....

to them religion was a response to what they could not understand

lightning kills
it must be an angry god
must appease it
must kill first born child

that's not art

 

[1213]

Very simply. Merely as a connection to a spirit world / god / gods

Ok, in that case, I think connection is connection, not art.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

nope....

to them religion was a response to what they could not understand

lightning kills
it must be an angry god
must appease it
must kill first born child

that's not art

That's sort of a narrow look at it, that doesn't have to be the conclusion everyone draws. Are the remaining tribal people that western culture hasn't touched doing that in reaction to lightning? Do the extremely old religions of the world advocate it?

 

[amorphous_constellation]

I suppose what I find the most strange is that you refer to these religious modalities as if they're in the past and don't exist in the present. On the contrary, these traditions and perspectives are alive and well in the present.

Yeah, but I think that traditions and a 'past-looking' attitude didn't always exist in the same way as they do today. Like when traditions were created, how did they know what to even do, the only way must have been through inspiration and imagination. Those two things seem to operate mostly in the creative domain

And I think with paganism, there are possibly some good inspiring examples of this that are sort of in action. With haloween and the pagan elements of christmas for example, there is an element there that is descriptive of raw creation from what is forged from imagination. With haloween, the souls appear on earth and humans contribute an appearance to them, which clothes the immutable and pure aspect as represented by a soul. The craftsmanship of the elves and dwarves to make gadgets or gifts for christmas, these are things are created rather than things which merely exist in plato's sense. These examples seem to advocate for a transcendence of modality as an original intent of spiritual practice

Also as with odin, who is a shapeshifting god of poetry, where creativity is seen in the creation of poems via gifting it to men from the heart of a mountain. As snorri said, there was a method of the skaldic art that employed periphrastic metaphor, this is a salient example of seeming to even customize one's own gods

 

[amorphous_constellation]

The "spirit world / god / gods" of which religion?

The people who really connect to these powers seem to have the thing that religions strive for by default. What is religion other than some method to connect to these things, if you are connected you have it

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The people who really connect to these powers seem to have the thing that religions strive for by default.

What's that? I don't think there's any such "default."

What is religion other than some method to connect to these things, if you are connected you have it

An expression of in-group/out-group dynamics? A collection of rituals to express significance for the things a society values? A comforting delusion to stave off the discomfort of fearing death? Religion is lots of things.