Why are women created twice?

[URAVIP2ME]

There is a strong possibility that there were 2 creation myths, composed in different times, sojourner pointed out.
Genesis 1 only stated they were created, and created in the image of God.
Nothing about it say (in Genesis 1) that they (actually only Adam) were created from dust, earth or clay, which is only seen in Genesis 2 (and 3, where God alluded that they would turn to dust after their death).
And as Odion pointed out, there is Jewish folklore that have Lilith being Adam's first mate or wife. Lilith refusing to be subservient to Adam, since she was also created from the earth, like Adam, so she left and was transformed into a demon.

At what point were Scriptures put into book form with chapters and verses?

Gen 1vs26-28 mentions man being created. Gen 2v5 picks up where 1v31 leaves off. So we have a history between Gen 2v5 and 5v2

 

[Shermana]

At what point were Scriptures put into book form with chapters and verses?

Gen 1vs26-28 mentions man being created. Gen 2v5 picks up where 1v31 leaves off. So we have a history between Gen 2v5 and 5v2

Who did Cain build cities for?

 

[gnostic]

But according to Revelation 12vs9,12 that original snake in the grass [serpent] in Eden was Satan using that snake more or less like a ventriloquist uses a dummy.

who say that it was Satan playing as a ventriloquist, and not god.

in any case, it is a fable (using talking animals to explain the moral of the story) mixed with creation myth.

It troublesome compromise for monotheism to have a being like Satan to become personification of evil, this devil that Christians (and Muslims) teach. Because that would indicate there are more than one god, thereby alternating monotheism into something else. It would have been better if Christianity and Islam to become dualistic religions instead, like Zoroastrianism.

It doesn't make sense to have Satan as adversary of God. And it doesn't make sense that the serpent of Eden to be Satan. If Satan was truly the serpent as Christians say, then it make more sense if the serpent/Satan was working for or with God.

 

[sojourner]

Why are women created twice?

Because they're sexilicious!

 

[mmksparbud]

Satan was never a God---that's what he wanted to be. He was the highest archangel, he was beautiful, stood in the very presence of God, shielding His light. He was originally called Lucifer, renamed Satan after he fell--he was tossed out of heaven along with 1/3 of the angels who followed him. No matter how hard he tries--he can never be God--he is a creation of God. He was given free will along with the other angels and us--he choose to dwell and dwell on his jealousy of not being a God. I am not understanding how this forum works too well! I can't figure out how to do the quote thing so you know what i AM REPLYING TO.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Archangel is singular. There is only one archangel in Scripture: Michael.

I guess one could say Satan is a counterfeit archangel.

According to Ezekiel [28vs13,16] Satan originally was a cherub, not archangel.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

who say that it was Satan playing as a ventriloquist, and not god.
in any case, it is a fable (using talking animals to explain the moral of the story) mixed with creation myth.
It troublesome compromise for monotheism to have a being like Satan to become personification of evil, this devil that Christians (and Muslims) teach. Because that would indicate there are more than one god, thereby alternating monotheism into something else. It would have been better if Christianity and Islam to become dualistic religions instead, like Zoroastrianism.
It doesn't make sense to have Satan as adversary of God. And it doesn't make sense that the serpent of Eden to be Satan. If Satan was truly the serpent as Christians say, then it make more sense if the serpent/Satan was working for or with God.

Revelation [12vs9,12] shows it was Satan playing as ventriloquist in Eden.

Yes, there are 'many gods and many Lords' according to 1st Cor 8vs5,6
'God/god' is a title even used in addressing human judges. -Psalm 82vs1-6

Satan as the 'god of this world' of badness [2nd Cor 4v4] it not the true God [Creator] but wanted the worship of humans that rightfully belongs to the true God and Creator. -Rev 4v11.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Who did Cain build cities for?

Interesting question to me because I would first think Cain built for Cain but apparently according to Genesis 4v17 Cain built a city named after his son Enoch. That would have come to an end at the time of the Flood of Noah's day.

 

[Thief]

Interesting question to me because I would first think Cain built for Cain but apparently according to Genesis 4v17 Cain built a city named after his son Enoch. That would have come to an end at the time of the Flood of Noah's day.

You completely overlooked the question.

There were 'other' people living outside the garden event.

When Cain was cast out, he was fearful that he would be killed.
By whom?
And God marked Cain that no one would do him harm.

The city of Enoch was built for whom?
Build a city for only the persons evicted from the Garden?

Some portions of Genesis should be taken literally....some not.

 

[gnostic]

Moses apparently had the writings of Adam according to Gen 5v1.
Moses used the 'book of the generations' by Adam.[historical origins]

I don't see how that would be possible.

For one, how could Moses receive any writing from Adam.

Historically, the earliest Semitic writings come from the Akkadians in the Mesopotamia, around the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium BCE (about 2350 BCE), followed by the Old Babylonian writing adopted by the Amorite dynasty of Old Babylonian empire (from early 1900 to 1700 BCE). Hebrew language and writing didn't exist at the time.

Second, Genesis 5:1 say that it was an ACCOUNT of Adam and his descendants (up to Noah's generation), hence his genealogy, NOT A BOOK WRITTEN BY ADAM!!!!

This is the written account of Adam’s family line.

This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;

It doesn't say Adam was an author, just that he was the head of the family line.

Third, it is not possible for Adam to write this Book of Generations. Adam died at the age of 930. When Noah was born, Adam was already dead for 126 years. Even longer if you follow the Septuagint; Adam would have been dead for 712 years!!!

And at the very last entry in Genesis 5 is that Noah was 500 when he became the father of Shem, Ham and Japheth.

After Noah was 500 years old, he became the father of Shem, Ham and Japheth.

This would mean that Adam would have written this so-called Book of Generations 626 YEARS AFTER HIS DEATH.

So it is really nonsense to say that Adam pass any book he had written to Moses.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I don't see how that would be possible.
For one, how could Moses receive any writing from Adam.
Historically, the earliest Semitic writings come from the Akkadians in the Mesopotamia, around the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium BCE (about 2350 BCE), followed by the Old Babylonian writing adopted by the Amorite dynasty of Old Babylonian empire (from early 1900 to 1700 BCE). Hebrew language and writing didn't exist at the time.
Second, Genesis 5:1 say that it was an ACCOUNT of Adam and his descendants (up to Noah's generation), hence his genealogy, NOT A BOOK WRITTEN BY ADAM!!!!
It doesn't say Adam was an author, just that he was the head of the family line.
Third, it is not possible for Adam to write this Book of Generations. Adam died at the age of 930. When Noah was born, Adam was already dead for 126 years. Even longer if you follow the Septuagint; Adam would have been dead for 712 years!!!
And at the very last entry in Genesis 5 is that Noah was 500 when he became the father of Shem, Ham and Japheth.
This would mean that Adam would have written this so-called Book of Generations 626 YEARS AFTER HIS DEATH.
So it is really nonsense to say that Adam pass any book he had written to Moses.

Not a direct book pass of course. You're right that would be nonsense.
...but from where or whom did Noah get that account ?

Did anything in writing 'Not on the Ark' survive the Flood? No.
Pre-flood artifacts would have to be on non-perishable materials.

Account received from Adam.... preserved by others to Noah time [via Ark] ....preserved by others to Moses time.

Adam would have spoken and written in Hebrew.

Gen [5v1] Moses was writing that this is the book of Adam's history [historical origins] 'Generations' [see Gen 2v4] [perhaps scroll-type book]

Matt [1v1] makes mention the book of history [origin] Hebrew: toh.ledhoth'
and Luke concludes that history [3v38] with Adam son of God.

 

[gnostic]

Adam would have spoken and written in Hebrew.

That's an assumption that you have no way to verify.

If Adam did exist, he would live through much of the 4th millennium BCE (3999-3000 BCE).

(As a side-note, according to the Wikipedia page about the Flood, it has been dated to 2340 BCE. In the Genesis, from Adam to Noah's Flood is 1656 years (or 1656 AM). If that had been the case then Adam was created in 3996 BCE and his death would have occurred about 3066 BCE. So 726 years between Adam's death and Noah embarking on the Flood.)

My point with the dating, is that there are no historical or literary evidences that Hebrew language was ever used (spoken or written) in the 4th millennium BCE...Or even the 3rd millennium BCE for that matter.

Moses supposed living in the 3rd quarter of the 2nd millennium BCE.

(Abraham's covenant occurred in 2033 AM, so dated to 1963 BCE. According to Exodus 12:40-41, 430 years between the Covenant and Moses's exodus out of Egypt began.

Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years.
And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the LORD went out from the land of Egypt.

So Moses leading the Israelites would have occurred in 2463 AM or 1533 BCE. At Moses' death, Joshua led the Israelites to invade Canaan, 40 years later, in 2503 AM or 1493 BCE.)

1493 BCE is a bad time for the Canaan invasion because it would put in the reign of Thutmosis II (1503-1491 BCE), who was father of Thutmosis III (1471-1458 BCE). Hatshepsut (1491-1471 BCE) was consort to Thutmosis II, but only a stepmother to Thutmosis III. Between 1530 and 1458 BCE, Canaan (as well as Syria) was in the hands the rulers of Egypt.

There archaeological evidences are there, as well as well-documented historical evidences in Egypt, so there is absolutely no way for Israelites to occur at this time.

My own datings of Genesis and Exodus is different and the events would have historically occurred much later, which would have been at the time of Egypt was weaker in imperial and foreign spheres, particularly in Canaan.

See my 3 tables on my webpage on the Timeline of the Patriarchs (from Dark Mirrors of Heaven website). The last timeline give date from Abraham's covenant to Moses' death, according to my own calculation.

Did anything in writing 'Not on the Ark' survive the Flood? No.
Pre-flood artifacts would have to be on non-perishable materials.

Historically, archaeologically and even geologically, there were no evidences of Flood occurring at any time of the 2nd half of 3rd millennium BCE.

There are no breaks in Egyptian and Mesopotamian civilisations at this time.

According to the genealogy in Genesis 10, Egypt only existed after the Flood, because Egypt was a son of Ham. This is totally absurd, considering Egypt existed before the supposed Flood, for example the Pyramids of Giza were built by 4th dynasty. There were also many pyramids built by Egyptians, even earlier than those of Giza, in the 3rd dynasty too. Egyptian hieroglyphs began in the 1st dynasty, perhaps even earlier than that.

 

[outhouse]

If Adam did exist, he would live through much of the 4th millennium BCE (3999-3000 BCE).

what kind of guess is that????

See my 3 tables on my webpage on the Timeline of the Patriarchs (from Dark Mirrors of Heaven website). The last timeline give date from Abraham's covenant to Moses' death, according to my own calculation.

you do understand hebrews as a culture started roughly 1250BC ish

there is ZERO historicity before this, including dates or guesses of any kind for hebrews.

Women were created twice because of the two creation storys that were merged together at a later date.

 

[gnostic]

you do understand hebrews as a culture started roughly 1250BC ish

there is ZERO historicity before this, including dates or guesses of any kind for hebrews.

Yes, I know in both cases.

The only evidences supporting of Israel's existence is in the victory stele of Merneptah. Merneptah was a ruler of the 19th dynasty, son of Rameses II. It is the first and only reference of Israel outside of Israel/Canaan in the 2nd millennium BCE.

I've provided the calculation/estimates of dating of biblical events, and trying to align it with historical information, and it illustrate how the bible's version of history (in Genesis and Exodus), don't in any way match with actual history because it is not history.

The Canaan invasion is the perfect example to show that there was no such invasion or mass migration from Egypt happened.

 

[outhouse]

I've provided the calculation/estimates of dating of biblical events,

ya that thousand year gap in your adam guess threw me.

imnot sure they existed outside of myth

 

[Jesus4m3]

Very simple to awnser God created male and female spirit and then created physically. Not hard to understand. Wasnt double creation in that sense and yes i know it doesnt specificaly say "spirit" but it was.

 

[Shermana]

Thought I'd add, the Seputagint date puts Adam more around 5500 B.C., not 4000, and thus the flood around 3500-3000 ish, with groups like the Sumerians (Shem-arians) around 2900-2800.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Thought I'd add, the Seputagint date puts Adam more around 5500 B.C., not 4000, and thus the flood around 3500-3000 ish, with groups like the Sumerians (Shem-arians) around 2900-2800.

From Adam's creation to the birth of his son Seth to Noah's birth 182 yrs.
From Noah's birth to Flood is 600 yrs.
Total from Adam to Flood = 1,656 yrs.

Bible chronology puts:
Creation of Adam 4026 BCE
Flood 2370 BCE
Abrahamic covenant 1943 BCE
Exodus from Egypt 1513 BCE
Temple construction 1034 BCE
Division of the kingdom 997 BCE
Desolation of Judah 607 BCE
Returning Jews from exile 537 BCE
Rebuilding Jerusalem's walls 455 BCE
Jesus baptism 29 CE/AD

Egypt was a world full of divine myths and miracles and scribes did not have to be above juggling chronology of their events. Isn't it hard to discern what it authentic works of Manetho and what was corrupted? The length of some reigns are found to be impossible and even some names can't be defended in light of evidence. [Manetho pp vii,xvii,xx,xxi,xxv]

The stele on which Merneptah, son of Ramses II, gloats over the conquest of Israel is the only known mention of Israel to be found in ancient Egyptian texts.

 

[outhouse]

and the whole point above is

There is no "real" ancient hebrew history beyond 1250BC with any historicity

 

[Songbird]

I love any chance to say "historicity."

And "feckless." Could you work feckless into the discussion, please, Outhouse?