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Featured Why are some religious people "afraid" of science?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Conscious thoughts, May 17, 2021.

  1. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Maybe this question comes as a "shock" to someone that i ask since i am known for not trusting science :)
    (meaning i am not afraid of science, just not see it as a valid way to answer certain questions)

    But here we go...
    1: Why are some religious people "afraid" of science?
    2: Is there truly a way for science to disprove God or deities?
    3: IF there is no "verifiable" proof of God, does that means God can not exist?
    4: If science one day did discover Gods existence, does all religions fall away then? or does this part of science fall away?
     
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  2. Dan From Smithville

    Dan From Smithville Veteran Member
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    1. I am sure reasons vary. But in many cases I am familiar with in the US and from this forum, it seems to center on literal interpretations of religious documents and on specific issues of doctrine within certain sects.
    2. I do not know of any test or experiment that would do it.
    3. No.
    4. I have no way to predict the results of such an astonishing outcome.

    Interesting questions and a nice bridge for someone claiming not to trust science.
     
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  3. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Thank you for replying to the OP :)
    I am trying to expand my horizon of understanding, and even i personally struggle to "trust" science, it can not stop me from exploring. who knows, maybe i will learn a thing or two about my own faith through science?
     
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  4. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

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    It came down to being taught scientists are widely under the influence of Satan, and furthering his goals of leading people away from god.
    That is what I was taught. No joke or exaggeration. Science is good, and they acknowledge many good things have come from it, but they see Satan corrupting it.
    And when they start saying "playing god," that is when they are afraid. Angry as well, as they believe certain things should only be left to god, but they don't fully flesh this out (such as how it can be argued any medical intervention is "playing god.")
    And the drumbeat they march to is "it's just a theory." This comes from poor understandings of how science uses the terms, but it's not always rooted in believing scientists use the words as laymen do. It's widely believed "hypothesis, theory, and law" follow a progression, and a theory that has been well tested and found accurate many times inevitably becomes a law.
     
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  5. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    What do you think would happen if Science and religion worked more together to find answers both were satisfied with? (maybe this is already happening? )
     
  6. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    There is a way "science" (psychology, physiological, history, and the like) can disprove the existence of deities and gods as anomorphized for centuries before abrahamics came about. Our beliefs in God or whatever hasn't gone extinct. We just have new ways to view old concepts.

    Each person's experience of course is unique and not false just because it has an explanation. But maybe religious are "scared of science" because it undermines spiritual experiences that in all religious members on RF I spoke with say they can't explain in words.

    In the western world, people were killed for explaining the gods by science. In my opinion, as one RFian told me: what's the fun if we all solved the mystery (paraphrased).

    Can you imagine if one can explain consciousness, spiritual awakening, god experience, or mysticism in plain boring scientific words?

    It's not so much they don't like it. Many religions do correlate with science. But many separate higher and lower "worlds."

    It challenges the mystery of one's mystic experiences.
     
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  7. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Maybe it is good for religious belief to be challenged? I know you challenged my personal views in your way of asking questions:) and to be honest, i needed the challenge to grow spiritually
     
  8. Rival

    Rival Iiu em hotep.
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    Mostly because a certain few think it contradicts what their holy writings say and makes them feel insecure about their faith.
     
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  9. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Would you say they lack faith in their own belief, or lack understanding of the physical world?
     
  10. SigurdReginson

    SigurdReginson Grēne Mann
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    1. It depends.

    From what I've seen, those who hold a more rigid, fundamentalist, or literalist interpretation of god based on scriptures or preconceived notions are often times afraid of damaging the construct of god that they've built their lives around. They are afraid that if they actually test that construct that they might find that they have been mistaken; then everything else crumbles.

    I find it odd... It seems to me that I'd want to know if I were mistaken about something so I can correct it. When you hold the view that you already have all the correct answers, and you put everything into those answers, it becomes dangerous when you risk those answers with new uncertainties.

    2. Absolutely not. That's not the purpose of science. We don't use science to tell us what isn't; we use it to find out what is. It's a process of discovery... I think people can absolutely hold beliefs in god(s) without contradicting scientific findings at all. They don't have to exist in opposition to each other, but they usually do when people begin making assertions that fly in the face of what we can actually observe.

    3. Again, absolutely not. Speaking for myself, it is one reason I withhold personal belief in gods, but that's a personal choice. I came to that choice based on my own life experiences. Everyone will follow their own path.

    4. I would suspect not. Scientists would have a new avenue of discovery to explore and would seek to better understand god. It would probably open a brand new scientific field to explore.

    That's the thing about science, though... The goal isn't in finding a final, concrete answer. The goal is in better understanding. Even after the initial discovery of gravity more than 300 years ago, we are still finding out new things. I suspect that will never change, no matter how many new discoveries we make on the issue.

    If god made man kind, he made us with an innate thirst for understanding, and he made us capable enough to wield that understanding according to our whim. God certainly wouldn't be afraid of us utilizing what we learn from the bread crumbs he leaves behind... So why should we be?
     
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  11. Rival

    Rival Iiu em hotep.
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    They're sticking to rigid literalist interpretations and their view of God and the origin and therefore to some degree the purpose of humanity is challenged.
     
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  12. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Maybe understanding science even can strenghtening someone belief in God?
     
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  13. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    Because facts are a threat to their belief system.

    Yes, to a similar level of certainty that we use when, say, declaring a species extinct.

    No, it would just mean that there's no rational reason to believe in God, and that God is indistinguishable from something that doesn't exist.

    Science is constantly updating itself as new facts come to light. Science is a method of investigation, not a rigid position.
     
  14. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    IDK:)

    No:D

    No:cool:

    Not possible:D
     
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  15. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    An other thought that comes to mind is.

    What if it is God who have given humans the scientific way of thinking, to challenge our own way of thoughts?
    What if a believer is stuck and can not find spiritual answer, maybe science can help see it from a different P.O.V ? but not give a conclusive answer?
     
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  16. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    A Question to the 4th point you make :) Can religious people update their own understanding without changing the scripture they believe in?
     
  17. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I don't know about that. They say ignorance is bliss. I do think if someone is good at it they can challenge the validity of a lot of people's spiritual experiences. Not superficially but personally.

    Which means all the signs you received from god has explanations and mystic experiences become endorphins instead.

    The god of the gaps goes poof!

    But my thing is, it's not necessary to burst someone's bubble. If it's meaningful and well lived, that's what matters.

    So what if it's all fantasy.
    What adult doesn't like Disney?

    Ha.
     
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  18. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

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    In some instances I do not think this is possible. Biblical literalists, for example, reject everything that doesn't conform to their interpretation and understanding of the Bible. Muslim radicals do not even agree to the idea of mutual respect and living in peace. Scientologists are firmly opposed to psychiatry and psychology.
    For some, it's that proverbial horse that won't drink the water you lead it to.
    But for others all hope is not lost. Even just promoting a basic literacy of science on the societal level can help thwart much of the dogmatic nonsense when it's common knowledge why "it's just a theory" just does not work. In these science can, and often does, coexist with religion.
    But, ultimately, science is not equipped to seek anything beyond the physical world. Religion often seeks things science does not concern itself with as it's not something science can actually address. And that is the nature and necessity of science. It mandates physical evidence and replicable data*. Science is evidence-based. Religion is faith-based. They can overlap, but eventually must part ways.
    *This also must be emphasised that it doesn't create some odd existentialist crises and that scientists are only concerned about that, and that it's not an affront or assault or anything bad. This was a very common fear in my former church. That attempting to understand how things works is somehow breaking the world down to numbers and sets of data, removing the wonder of nature, and trying to deduce all of life to that. In essence, they believe most scientists and science itself are hyperdogmatic scientismists, and do view it roughly as a sort of proselytism that is leading people away from god.
     
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  19. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Subway Stalinist
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    This is probably a good time for one of my favourite quotes:

    What do you think science is? There's nothing magical about science. It is simply a systematic way for carefully and thoroughly observing nature and using consistent logic to evaluate results. Which part of that exactly do you disagree with? Do you disagree with being thorough? Using careful observation? Being systematic? Or using consistent logic?

    - Dr. Steven Novella
     
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  20. Dan From Smithville

    Dan From Smithville Veteran Member
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    I understand that certain areas of science conflict with what people believe, but I have found that you can accept science and maintain faith. It is not without struggle and does create unanswered questions in both camps, but it can be done. I think the first thing that I thought of was that I may know the love of God, but the mind of God is His own.
     
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