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Why are atheists so passionate about pushing their point of view?

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.

That's true. Not all atheists are quiet retiring types. Still, as a group, they seem to me to be less strident than religious folks as a group. Perhaps I'm wrong about that, however -- I've been married (twice!) so I know very well I can be wrong even about things that seem obvious to me. :D
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
That's true. Not all atheists are quiet retiring types. Still, as a group, they seem to me to be less strident than religious folks as a group. Perhaps I'm wrong about that, however -- I've been married (twice!) so I know very well I can be wrong even about things that seem obvious to me. :D
I hear you. My wife has spent decades pointing out how wrong I am about so many of my ideas. :rolleyes:
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
Like why does it matter so much to them

Psalm 125 - Believers are like mountains and God like mountains around that mountain.
Discussion guide week 5 - Psalm 125

I don't think whirlingmerc really cares about any answer we may have. He certainly hasn't stuck around to comment on any of them.

What I do think he cares about is getting people to see and click on his advertisement for "Discussion guide week 5 - Psalm 125," which I believe is against forum rules.

Mods?

.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.
Many atheists generalize about religion without proper justification, certainly.

But that is IMO a factor of how poorly religion as a whole is understood, not of atheism nor atheists. Worse generalizations are made very often by people who swear to be acting with full respect for other beliefs, after all. Take for instance what Seicho No Ie's founder says about Buddhism.

As for finding the worse parts and attacking them, I would say that it is only fair for certain doctrines that expect to be treated as above and beyond any criticisms. If they are bluffing, they ought to pay for it.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.
But our "attacks" are responses to theistic claims, on a board whose purpose is discussion of these ideas. We don't preach our views unbidden, like Christians.
It's theists who start these arguments, we atheists are only answering you.
Please don't mistake a robust counter-argument as preaching or pushing our views.
 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.

Oh, there are definitely atheists who do that. Just that it's not a trait of atheism in and of itself.
All atheists have additional philosophies and views on the world, and they can be all sorts of things, including indescriminately anti-theistic.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
They're people. Some people are passionate in whatever they find right and just.
 

Vee

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Like why does it matter so much to them

Psalm 125 - Believers are like mountains and God like mountains around that mountain.
Discussion guide week 5 - Psalm 125

Anyone who is serious about their beliefs is passionate about expressing them. I think that's human nature and not at all something to be expected only from atheists.
Most atheists I know are smart, polite and respectful people.
I have met some who bothered me because they tried to make me feel dumb for being a believer. I didn't appreciate them trying to humiliate me by questioning my intelligence and let's say those conversations didn't end well, but those are the exceptions. Most of my conversations with atheists are actually good and enjoyable.
 

syo

Well-Known Member
because they are atheists, they are actively against god. if they were indifferent, they would be apatheists.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
because they are atheists, they are actively against god. if they were indifferent, they would be apatheists.
Oh, we are not "against god", for many of the same reasons I am not against Mickey Mouse.

Now, if you meant "against belief in god", now that we could work with somehow.

Apatheism is not mutually exclusive with atheism; instead, they complement each other very elegantly.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I don't think whirlingmerc really cares about any answer we may have. He certainly hasn't stuck around to comment on any of them.

What I do think he cares about is getting people to see and click on his advertisement for "Discussion guide week 5 - Psalm 125," which I believe is against forum rules.

Mods?

.

It's ironic that he comes here pushing his religion in the guise of asking why atheists are passionate about pushing their points of view.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.

A 'few'? Woowzers!
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
because they are atheists, they are actively against god. if they were indifferent, they would be apatheists.

I'm an atheist and I am not against any god. I don't believe in gods.

I am also not against Santa for the same reason.

What I am against is a religion trying to impose its values in my life and the lives of others who don't welcome it.

Christians frequently express concern about Muslims becoming more influential in American culture and eventually imposing sharia law on them. American atheists are more concerned about the American church doing the equivalent, and won't be comfortable until it has shrunken in size and influence to the level of all other religions in America. At that point, you probably won't be hearing from us again.

But until then, Christianity represents exactly that threat to non-Christians. The Christians will rescind the right to abortion and same sex marriage if given the chance, and they just got a little closer by voting for the man that would put just that kind of person on the Supreme Court to impose the Christian equivalent of sharia law on Americans, something Muslims don't have the ability to do.

Why do you suppose that we don't preach atheism to the Druids? Obviously, because we really don't mind them being Druids and believing whatever Druids believe holding those beliefs as long as their numbers are too small to affect people outside of their religions. We don't benefit by them becoming atheists.

What does the Celtic goddess Brigid think about abortion and same sex marriage? Yeah, me neither, and that's how it should be. Someday, I hope that the same will be said about Jesus.

Second, I also object to the church teaching that atheists are immoral and enemies of a good god. It demeans us and marginalizes us. The Christian church has successfully demonized atheists.

"The findings of this most recent survey support the argument that atheists are persistent cultural outsiders in the United States because they are perceived to have rejected cultural values and practices understood as essential to private morality, civic virtue, and national identity. Moreover, any refusal to embrace a religious identity of any type is troubling for a large portion of Americans. Forty percent of Americans view the non-religious--atheist, agnostic, no-religion, and spiritual-but-not-religious--as problematic, even though 33 percent of the survey respondents identify with those categories."

You just contributed to that a tiny bit by identifying us not just as unbelievers, but enemies of a good god.

And third, I also oppose the teaching that faith is a virtue. Critical thinking is a virtue. Faith is a subversion of reason. Faith based thinking is what is responsible for American Christians voting so badly, and for climate science denial, both of which have impact on unbelievers. Christianity gets to children before they have developed critical thinking skills because it understands that it won't have much success if it approaches those that have learned to evaluate claims and arguments critically and skeptically, and teaches them that doubt, the sine qua non of skepticism, is a fault, and that blind acceptance of doctrine is virtuous - habits of thought that keep the collection plate full and help the church remain substantial enough to affect law, policy, and societal values such as who is a good person and who is not, but which lead to the other detrimental outcomes just mentioned.

Aren't these all good reasons for preferring an irreligious society and working to promote that goal?
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.

You might be referring to people like me. Yes, I take every opportunity to make my case for a society in which only Christians are affected by Christian doctrine as I just did in the previous post. If that's what is meant by attacking - what I would call promoting ideas that have been carefully considered, are sincerely believed, and are constructively offered - then mea culpa.

And naturally, those criticisms will be of the worst aspects of that religion. I just criticized imposing Christian values onto non-Christians, demonizing and marginalizing atheists, and promoting faith based thinking over critical thinking. Aren't those legitimate criticisms and objections?

I have no reason to mention the harmless aspects of Christianity. I like the church bells that I hear four times an hour, and own and display quite a bit of Christian art. I live in a predominantly Catholic country, and enjoy the religious rituals here. I have participated in a Palm Sunday march following "Jesus" into "Jerusalem," and look forward to the Christmastime reenactment of Joseph and Mary going from door to door only to be turned away, and then finally being accepted at the lucky neighbor's home, which then turns into a celebration in the street.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
On the street corner, all of you are correct. But I've noticed a few here on RF and elsewhere who will take every opportunity to attack religion in general or some in specific typically finding the worse part of religion to use to attack religion in general. So you all are not quite on the "side of the angels", as it were.

Are you saying religion has " worse" parts?
 
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