• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Why Admire This Man????

Starlight

Spiritual but not religious, new age and omnist
He said "I and the father are one" - John 10:30

Also, check this out:

Did Jesus say He is God?

According to the bible he clearly said he was God

The entire concept of The Holy Trinity is based on the belief he is God
Jesus also said: that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.

So that verse John.10:30 can not be used as evidence for Jesus divinity

Jesus never said i am God

“Father,… This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent” (John 17.3). So, Jesus says of the Father that he is “the only true God” and then distinguishes himself from that one God. Both of these points clearly indicate that Jesus himself cannot also be God.

There are two other times the Johannine Jesus identified the Father as the only God. Earlier, he told his Jewish opponents that the Father is “the one and only God” (John 5.44). And again, at the Last Supper, Jesus distinguished himself from this one and only God by commanding his disciples, “believe in God, believe also in Me” (14.1).

The other two NT passages which irrefutably establish that only the Father is God and distinguish Jesus from God are in Paul’s letters. He writes to the church at Corinth, “There is no God but one…. yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him” (1 Corinthians 8.4, 6). Here, Paul clearly declares that for Christians there is one God, who is the Father, and there is no other God, so that Jesus is not God.

 

Eddi

Believer in God
Premium Member
Jesus also said: that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.

So that verse John.10:30 can not be used as evidence for Jesus divinity

Jesus never said i am God

“Father,… This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent” (John 17.3). So, Jesus says of the Father that he is “the only true God” and then distinguishes himself from that one God. Both of these points clearly indicate that Jesus himself cannot also be God.

There are two other times the Johannine Jesus identified the Father as the only God. Earlier, he told his Jewish opponents that the Father is “the one and only God” (John 5.44). And again, at the Last Supper, Jesus distinguished himself from this one and only God by commanding his disciples, “believe in God, believe also in Me” (14.1).

The other two NT passages which irrefutably establish that only the Father is God and distinguish Jesus from God are in Paul’s letters. He writes to the church at Corinth, “There is no God but one…. yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him” (1 Corinthians 8.4, 6). Here, Paul clearly declares that for Christians there is one God, who is the Father, and there is no other God, so that Jesus is not God.

Chapter 1 of John clearly identifies Jesus as "The Word" - The Logos

If he is The Logos then he is divine, he is not an ordinary human

John 1:1 says:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God

And later Jesus is identified as being The Word

If he is The Word then he is divine
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
I have news: I no longer believe in him :(

Why build your faith around him if you think he's only a myth????

And he is so totally unrealistic that I see no reason to admire him.......

I see no reason to so am now a humanist :cool:

View attachment 84998
As I've described elsewhere, when I was 12 I had a born-again experience. I've spent the rest of my life questioning and trying to learn more. About two years ago, at my mother-in-law's funeral, the minister called for the recitation of the Nicene Creed...and I realized that there is almost nothing in the creed that I believe or can agree with, even provisionally.

After further consideration, including reading JD Crossan's work on early Christian thought and what might be gleaned from careful analysis of ancient texts, that I am a follower of Jesus. Not the one portrayed in the OP, nor indeed the one professed in almost all denominations of Christianity.

And I still don't have any idea what it means for Jesus to be my 'savior' because my experience and view of the world is not that reflected in Christianity. And in my mind's eye, when I ask questions like this, he just smiles, shrugs his shoulders, and says, "Follow me."
 

mangalavara

हर हर महादेव
Premium Member
Nobody can meet the standards that Jesus sets

As a teacher, he has his expectations, not standards.

If you're going to have someone as a role model then it needs to be possible to live up to their standards

We don’t try to live up to the standards of role models. We try to follow their examples.

In my opinion, many forms of mainstream Christianity make it seem impossible with their doctrines on human nature. Maybe we are not as fallen as they believe?

It's now called Monadic Pantheistic Humanism

If this is what you believe in now, I hope you can stick to it. In my experience, a constant change of philosophy and religion can lead one to despair.
 

Eddi

Believer in God
Premium Member
If this is what you believe in now, I hope you can stick to it. In my experience, a constant change of philosophy and religion can lead one to despair.
I think it's stable now!

Am going to figure out all the details come the weekend.........

It's simply a matter of asking yourself what you think is true
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
Why build your faith around him if you think he's only a myth????
I don't build my faith around him. I cannot say whether or not he's a myth, but whether or not he was is irrelevant to me.

Whether he was an actual person or a myth has no bearing on the fact that based on what information we have on him, he was a great teacher.
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
If he was an ordinary guy who chose to die for all our sins then the would be very different, but that's not what Christianity teaches
What Christianity teaches about his being the savior is something he never claimed to be. It's men that made him this, not him.
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
If he was just a teacher and a thinker then he would be more credible but for me the miracles spoil it
I don't think Jesus ever claimed these were miracles. It is people that interpreted them as such.
 

JerDriver

New Member
What Christianity teaches about his being the savior is something he never claimed to be. It's men that made him this, not him.
I think one has to establish the source of Christian doctrine and beliefs first in order to make such a claim. There are many books, papers, podcast, etc. that have done a good job of explaining the inerrancy of the Bible.

Once we can agree on the source - the Bible - then we can discuss who Jesus truly is.

Why was Jesus crucified? Who did He claim to be when asked during His trials?
 

Dimi95

Χριστός ἀνέστη
What Christianity teaches about his being the savior is something he never claimed to be. It's men that made him this, not him.
Mark 14:61-62
"Are you the anointed Messiah, the Son of the Blessed God?” Jesus answered him, "I am. And more than that, you are about to see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of the Almighty and coming in the heavenly clouds!"
 
The thing is, didn't the Jews believe the Messiah was going to be someone more so that would liberate Israel from the Roman empire and bondage, and not so much a divine spiritual leader like Jesus is portrayed as?

Even though I don't personally believe in the Bible, I believe Jesus' teachings had a lot of good moral qualities. I have no doubt Jesus was more than likely a real person, but I cannot say he was divine in my personal opinion though. That's something that has been inflated by the teachings of the Bible IMO. I am particularly fond of Jesus teachings about loving others.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Most reputable historians believes Jesus existed. That’s rarely, if ever, disputed fact anymore.
The disputes typically reside in who Jesus IS.
Depends on what you mean by existed.

Jesus actually existed as a mythological demigod in the Greek and Roman pantheon.

Most reputable academics including historians pretty much have confirmed that.
 
Top