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Whose your Daddy? Dan?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan, Nov 4, 2020.

  1. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    Here is a post I just made that I thought might deserve its own thread, but to make it more interesting, tell me, Whose your Daddy? What do you think Originated You or is Responsible for your Experience or Existence? You can list all your Daddies all the way to your Biggest Daddy, the Daddy of All Daddies, in your opinion (also, please be so kind as to very patiently read through my entire two part post below):

    Was that a typo up there where you said "Satan said "do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil" or are you suggesting instead something like Marcion:
    Marcionism - Wikipedia (Marcion seems to have suggested that The God of the Old Testament might be The Devil)

    "Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

    16And the LORD God commanded him, “You may eat freely from every tree of the garden, 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die.”

    Genesis 3:3-
    3but about the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You must not eat of it or touch it, or you will die.’ ”
    4“You will not surely die,” the serpent told her. 5“For God knows that in the day you eat of it, your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”6When the woman saw that the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eyes, and that it was desirable for obtaining wisdom, she took the fruit and ate it. She also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate it.

    Genesis 3:21-
    21And the LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife, and He clothed them. 22Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil. And now, lest he reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever...”23Therefore the LORD God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken.

    Are you sure God wants you to be like God?

    I also can understand the mix up with God and Satan:

    Again the anger of the Lord was aroused against Israel, and He moved David against them to say, “Go, number Israel and Judah.” (2 Samuel 24:1[​IMG])

    Now Satan stood up against Israel, and moved David to number Israel. (1 Chronicles 21:1[​IMG])

    "In the first account, God moves David to take a census. In the second account, Satan moves David to take a census."


    2 Corinthians 4:4
    3And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. 4The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers so they cannot see the light

    2 Thessalonians 2:11
    For this reason, God will send them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie,


    Hebrews 2:14
    Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death--that is, the devil--

    Deuteronomy 32:39
    "See now that I myself am he! There is no god besides me. I put to death and I bring to life, I have wounded and I will heal, and no one can deliver out of my hand.

    Isaiah 45:7
    I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

    Ephesians 2:2
    in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience.

    Job 37:15
    14Listen to this, O Job; stand still and consider the wonders of God. 15Do you know how God controls the clouds or makes the lightning flash?16Do you understand how the clouds float, those wonders of Him who is perfect in knowledge?

    Amos 4:13
    For, lo, he that formeth the mountains, and createth the wind, and declareth unto man what is his thought, that maketh the morning darkness, and treadeth upon the high places of the earth, The LORD, The God of Armies (God of WAR), is his name.


    Luke 11:17-
    17Knowing their thoughts, Jesus said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself will be laid waste, and a house divided against a house will fall. 18 If Satan is divided against himself, how can his kingdom stand? After all, you say that I drive out demons by Beelzebul. 19And if I drive out demons by Beelzebul, by whom do your sons drive them out? So then, they will be your judges.

    Judges 9:23
    And God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the leaders of Shechem, and the leaders of Shechem dealt treacherously with Abimelech,

    1 Samuel 18:10
    The next day an evil spirit sent from God came powerfully on Saul, and he began to rave inside the palace. David was playing the lyre as usual, but Saul was holding a spear,

    1 Samuel 16:14
    After the Spirit of the LORD had departed from Saul, a spirit of distress from the LORD began to torment him.


    1 Kings 22:22-
    22And he replied, ‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouths of all his prophets.’ ‘You will surely entice him and prevail,’ said the LORD. ‘Go and do it.’23So you see, the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours, and the LORD has pronounced disaster against you.”

    John 8:44
    You are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and stayed not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

    Jeremiah 31:9
    They will come with weeping; they will pray as I bring them back. I will lead them beside streams of water on a level path where they will not stumble, because I am Israel's father, and Ephraim is my firstborn son.

  2. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    Part 2:

    his is what the Lord says to me: “As a lion growls, a great lion over his prey—and though a whole band of shepherds is called together against him, he is not frightened by their shouts or disturbed by their clamor—so the Lord Almighty will come down to do battle on Mount Zion and on its heights.” (Isaiah 31:4 NIV)

    The Lord, like the lion, will come down and do battle with His people.

    It is interesting to note that the devil is also referred to as acting like a lion in Scripture. Peter wrote of this.

    Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. (1 Peter 5:8 NKJV)"


    Revelation 4:5
    From the throne came flashes of lightning, rumblings and peals of thunder. In front of the throne, seven lamps were blazing. These are the seven spirits of God.

    Zechariah 9:14
    Then the LORD will appear over them; his arrow will flash like lightning. The Sovereign LORD will sound the trumpet; he will march in the storms of the south,

    Luke 10:18
    But he said to them, “I was beholding Satan himself who descended like lightning from Heaven.”


    1 John 1:5
    This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

    Isaiah 2:5
    Come, O house of Jacob, let us walk in the light of the LORD.

    Daniel 2:22
    He reveals the deep and hidden things; He knows what lies in darkness, and light dwells with Him.

    James 1:17
    Every generous act of giving and every perfect gift is from above and comes down from the Father of the heavenly lights, in whom there is no inconsistency or shifting shadow.

    Genesis 3:7
    Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

    2 Corinthians 11:14-
    And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light.
    Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

    So would you look at that? Point for Point for Point, God, Satan, God, Satan, God Satan, GodSatan, GoSadan, Gosdan, Gadan, Dan:

    Deuteronomy 33:22
    Concerning Dan he said: “Dan is a lion’s cub, leaping out of Bashan.”

    Genesis 49:17
    Dan will be a snake by the roadside, a viper along the path, that bites the horse's heels so that its rider tumbles backward.

    Genesis 3:15
    And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel."

    1. Δάν (Dán) – Aeolic

      Dan is the Aeolic word for Zeus, who was considered the Power of the Air, the Ruler of Spirits, the appearance of which was like a Lion, who appeared as a Serpent, and so on and so forth.

      "Light: As the god of thunder and lightning, “Zeus’ name is thought to have originated from the Ancient Greek word for “bright.” Perhaps word had gotten to Athens of the angel at Christ’s tomb whose “appearance was like lightning” ( Matthew 28:3 ), causing confusion about who Jesus was."

      "But, the Olympian Zeus known as Zeus Meilichios assumes the form of a serpent to attend the spring rites of the mother-goddess Earth. Zeus, as a serpent coiled with Rhea, who had also taken the form of a snake. The snake from then on becomes the symbol of earth and water.

      Ophion, one of the Greek Titans means literally "serpent". It is claimed that Zeus took the form of a serpent to escape from the murderous aggression of his father, Chronos."

      "The Greek Daemons [daemonae] were the invisible divine beings which were assigned by Zeus to every god and every important human being as sort of a guardian angel creature to give good advice and lead them properly. The Daemons ( from which, of course we get our word demon) could appear as a handsome young youth or as a wise serpent.

      It is Greek mythology which gives us the most memorable heavenly divine serpent. By heavenly, I mean literally, since I am speaking of the constellation Draco or the Dragon. One only has to look at this constellation to realize that this "dragon" is a serpent in every aspect. Draco is the pet of Zeus."

      Revelation 12:9
      The great DRAKKON (Serpent) was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

      John 12:31
      Now judgment is upon this world; now the ARCHON (Ruler, King) of this world will be cast out.
    John 9:39
    Then Jesus declared, "For judgment I have come into this world, so that the blind may see and those who see may become blind."

    Strong's #758: archon (pronounced ar'-khone)

    present participle of 757; a first (in rank or power):--chief (ruler), magistrate, prince, ruler.

    Thayer's Greek Lexicon:


    1) a ruler, commander, chief, leader


    Revelation: Pergamum, Satan’s Throne - God in a Nutshell project.

    Altar of Zeus in Pergamon, Turkey: the Throne of Satan | VoyageTurkey.Net

    What is the throne of Satan?

    Revelation 2:13
    12To the angel of the church in Pergamum write: These are the words of the One who holds the sharp, double-edged sword. 13I know where you live, where the throne of Satan sits. Yet you have held fast to My name and have not denied your faith in Me, even in the day when My faithful witness Antipas was killed among you, where Satan dwells. 14But I have a few things against you, because some of you hold to the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to place a stumbling block before the Israelites so they would eat food sacrificed to idols and commit sexual immorality
    #2 DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan, Nov 4, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 4, 2020
  3. KAT-KAT

    KAT-KAT Well-Known Member

    May 2, 2019
    Hinduism with some New Age influence
    My spirit probably originated somehow with being created by the Trimurti and was reincarnated multiple times with many past lives. I sometimes also wonder if aliens ever had any involvement in ancient civilization.
  4. MNoBody

    MNoBody Well-Known Member

    Mar 23, 2020
    good question...with only a list of speculations which people feel sentiment about.
  5. Meandflower

    Meandflower Well-Known Member

    Oct 31, 2020
    Haha i wrote so wrong:mad::D:oops: im angry at myself now

    Satan wanted Adam and Eve to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge. What I meant was Satan said "do eat of the tree of the knowlege of good and evil".
  6. Meandflower

    Meandflower Well-Known Member

    Oct 31, 2020
    No God does NOT want us to be like God. But Satan rebelled against God. That was why satan wanted eva to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

    God said: but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die. Genesis 2:17

    Since Satan is against God he said to Eve:

    The serpent was the shrewdest of all the wild animals the LORD God had made. One day he asked the woman, “Did God really say you must not eat the fruit from any of the trees in the garden?


    But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die.

    #6 Meandflower, Nov 4, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2020
  7. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    I don't regret that you made that little typo, because of it, I wrote and collected all this interesting material and so I am very glad for the mistake, because it acted as the catalyst which resulted in this thread. An accidental pregnancy, but you are the Daddy of this thread! You put the little mistake out there, and then it impregnated me with all these ideas and connections, and I begot this thread!
    • Like Like x 2
  8. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    So, it seemed to be noticed by people in the past that there were similarities between religions, but that they differed among each other in some things, so some of the Christian people proposed the idea that Satan had been through time, creating all sorts of earlier counterfeits.

    Satan’s Copycat Imitation of God

    The Early Church Fathers and Paganism

    "Those who believe these things we pity, and those who invented them we know to be devils."

    Did the Early Church Fathers Believe in Spiritual Warfare? - The Goodness of God.

    Were the Pagan Gods Actually Demons? The Scriptural View and Why It Matters - Community in Mission
  9. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    So, Quiz time!

    Who is compared to a Lion, called Morning Star (translated as Lucifer), called Father of Israel, compared to Light or hidden by Light, Associated with Lightning, Was Behind the Census of Israel, Commands and is the Boss of the Evil Spirits, is said to Kill, is said to be the power over Death, power over the Air element and elements of the Air like wind and clouds and storms?

    God, or Satan? If you read what I wrote all above.

    Who is compared to a Lion, who is said to be the mover of time and causer of changes? The Zoroastrians said "Ahriman / Angra Mainyu" (that is their version of the Devil, the commander of the Daevas which were for them the Evil Spirits), and Angra Mainyu was connected with the cold North and storms and death and all the same as well.

    Yet, most people say "We are Christian" or whatever religion, but also hold that God is the Power Over Death, that God is the one who does all these things, and they say "No!" to the term Satan, even though the Bible itself depicts these things I have shown above, and even they say that it is God who controls time and moves time, but the Zoroastrians say:


    17. Until the coming of the Adversary, the Moon, the Sun and the stars were standing still, they did not move, and were passing their time with purity, and it was always mid-day; after the coming of the Adversary, they were in motion and would not desist from that motion, until the end.

    "6. And, again, the wicked Jeh shouted thus: 'Rise up, thou father of us! for in that conflict I will shed thus much vexation on the righteous man and the laboring ox that, through my deeds, life will not be wanted, and I will destroy their living souls (nismo); I will vex the water, I will vex the plants, I will vex the fire of Ohrmazd, I will make the whole creation of Ohrmazd vexed.' 7. And she so recounted those evil deeds a second time, that the evil spirit was delighted and started up from that confusion; and he kissed Jeh upon the head, and the pollution which they call menstruation became apparent in Jeh. 8. He shouted to Jeh thus: 'What is thy wish? so that I may give it thee.' And Jeh shouted to the evil spirit thus: 'A man is the wish, so give it to me.' 9. The form of the evil spirit was a log−like lizard's (vazak) body, and he appeared a young man of fifteen years to Jeh, and that brought the thoughts of Jeh to him. 10. Afterwards, the evil spirit, with the confederate demons, went towards the luminaries, and he saw the sky; and he led them up, fraught with malicious intentions. 11. He stood upon one−third of the inside of the sky, and he sprang, like a snake, out of the sky down to the earth. 12. In the month Frawardin and the day Ohrmazd he rushed in at noon, and thereby the sky was as shattered and frightened by him, as a sheep by a wolf. 13. He came on to the water which was arranged below the earth, and then the middle of this earth was pierced and entered by him. 14. Afterwards, he came to the vegetation, then to the ox, then to Gayomard, and then he came to fire; so, just like a fly, he rushed out upon the whole creation; and he made the world quite as injured and dark at midday as though it were in dark night. 15. And noxious creatures were diffused by him over the earth, biting and venomous, such as the snake, scorpion, frog (kalvak), and lizard (vazak), so that not so much as the point of a needle remained free from noxious creatures. 16. And blight was diffused by him over the vegetation, and it withered away immediately. 17. And avarice, want, pain, hunger, disease, lust, and lethargy were diffused by him abroad..."
    #9 DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan, Nov 4, 2020
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 4, 2020
  10. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    Many supernatural creatures populate Buddhist literature, but among these Mara is unique. He is one of the earliest non-human beings to appear in Buddhist scriptures. He is a demon, sometimes called the Lord of Death, who plays a role in many stories of the Buddha and his monks.

    Mara is best known for his part in the historical Buddha's enlightenment. This story came to be mythologized as a great battle with Mara, whose name means "destruction" and who represents the passions that snare and delude us."

    God is called El Shaddai in the Bible, Shaddai means "Destruction" as well or "Destroyer" for El Shaddai.

    The Devil is in the Detail | Yin Yoga

    Mara is called Kama, meaning Kama, (Sanskrit: “Love,” “Desire,” “Pleasure”)

    "In traditional Buddhism four senses of the word "mara" are given. Firstly, there is klesa-mara, or Mara as the embodiment of all unskillful emotions. Secondly, mrtyu-mara, or Mara as death, in the sense of the ceaseless round of birth and death. Thirdly, skandha-mara, or Mara as metaphor for the entirety of conditioned existence. Lastly, devaputra-mara, or Mara the son of a god, that is, Mara as an objectively existent being rather than as a metaphor. This last connotation of mara is strikingly similar to the Hindu concept of Maya (Illusive Power of God), which may suggest that the two words Maya and Mara are perhaps directly related.

    Mara is also known as Namuci ("not-loosing"), a demon described in the Hindu Vedic literature as causing drought. Describing Mara thus is a literary allusion used by Buddhists to indicate his power and malevolence. Mara is also called Kanha ("the dark one"), associating his power with darkness, also a metaphor for confusion. Other epithets of Mara are Maccu ("death"), Antaka ("the end), and Papima ("evil one"), all of which further attest to his notoriety in Buddhist thought and literature.

    "The killing of Vṛtra (depicted as a Great Serpent) was closely associated with the killing of other demonic enemies, paṛticularly Triśiras Viśvarūpa (the "three-headed, many-formed" son of Tvaṣṭṛ, the aṛtisan of the gods), Namuci ("don't-let-go"), and Ahi (the Serpent, perhaps just another name for Vṛtra)."

    Mara - Buddhist Demon of Death and Rebirth | Mythology.net

    "Māra, the Buddhist “Lord of the Senses,”" (Indra is called Lord of Senses as well as Prajapati):

    "In Sanskrit, the senses are known as Indriyas, or the agents of Indra, the lord of the heaven. In Hinduism they represent the pleasure principle"

    "In the Rigveda, Prajapati appears as an epithet for Savitr, Soma, Agni and Indra, who are all praised as equal, same and lord of creatures."

    "However, Indra, the god of thunder-storms, forces him to surrender the fertilising liquids and restores the life-bringing element to the earth. Mara is also called Papiyan 1the Wicked One or the Evil One, the Murderer, the Tempter. In addition he is said to be Varsavarti, 2meaning "he who fulfils desires.""

    Also apparently holding a Vajra or Thunderbolt in his hand.


    "The figure of Māra in the Pali texts is historically descended from the Vedic deity Yāma, revealed in the arrow-shooting action, around which both the Vedic and Buddhist myths use the alternate name Kamadeva, “God of Love/Desire”"

    Desire realm - Wikipedia

    Kamadhatu - Chinese Buddhist Encyclopedia

    Vasavartin - Chinese Buddhist Encyclopedia

    "The mara king of the sixth heaven of the desire realm can obstruct people's virtuous deeds."

    Back to Zoroastrianism for a moment:

    "The business of the demon Andar is this, that he constrains the thoughts of the creatures from deeds of virtue, just like a leader who has well−constrained (sardar−i khup afsardo); and he casts this into the thoughts of men, that it is not necessary to have the sacred shirt [sudre] and thread−girdle [kusti]."

    Andar is thought to be Indra who is thought to be Chief among the Daeva of Ahriman.

    Indra in Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Taoism, Zoroastrian, Europe, Bali - Religions.


    Of the Vedas I am the Sama Veda; of the demigods I am Indra, the king of heaven; of the senses I am the mind; and in living beings I am the living force [consciousness].” (Bhagavad Gita 10.22)

    As the god of war, he is also regarded as one of the Guardians of the directions, representing the east. As the favourite ‘national‘ god of the Vedic Indians, Indra has about 250 hymns dedicated to him in the Rigveda."

    "“Andhra” must be derived from “Indra” as is in the french “andrei”.
    He wields a lightning thunderbolt known as vajra and rides on a white elephant known as Airavata."

    Buddha and Mara.

    "In Buddhist iconography, Mara is most often presented as a hideous demon, although sometimes he is depicted as an enormous elephant, cobra or bull. When shown in an anthropomorphic (human) form he is usually represented riding an elephant with additional tusks. Other popular scenes of Mara show his demon army attacking the Buddha, his daughters tempting the Buddha, or the flood that washes away those under Mara's command."
  11. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    Part 2:

    "In traditional Buddhism four senses of the word "mara" are given.
    Klesa-mara, or Mara as the embodiment of all unskillful emotions.
    Mrtyu-mara, or Mara as death, in the sense of the ceaseless round of birth and death.
    Skandha-mara, or Mara as metaphor for the entirety of conditioned existence.
    Devaputra-mara, or Mara the son of a deva (god), that is, Mara as an objectively existent being rather than as a metaphor."

    Mrtyu - Wikipedia

    Mṛtyu (from Vedic Sanskrit: मृत्यु IAST:mRtyu ; Latin cognate mortis), is a Sanskrit word meaning Death. Mṛtyu or Death is often personified as the demigods Mara (मर) and Yama (यम) in Dharmic religions such as Hinduism and Buddhism.

    • Mara (Hindu goddess), the goddess of death according to Hindu mythology.
    • Mṛtyu-māra as death in Buddhism or Māra, a "demon" of the Buddhist cosmology, the personification of Temptation.
    • Yama (Sanskrit: यम) is the lord of death in Hinduism and Buddhism"

      "Then he became a horse (ashva)"
      "The mare was also believed to "ride" horses, which left them exhausted and covered in sweat by the morning."
      "Loki transforms into a horse, is called Loptr dealing with the Power of the Air"
      "Prajapati turns into a Stag and "Does what should not be done".

      So on and so forth!

      These animal stories and symbolic choices often have to do with fertility and sex acts as well.
    In the medieval era texts of Hinduism, Prajapati refers to legendary agents of creation, working as gods or sages, who appear in every cycle of creation-maintenance-destruction (manvantara). Their numbers vary between seven, ten, sixteen or twenty-one.[1]

    A list of twenty one includes[edit]
    1. Rudra,
    2. Manu,
    3. Daksha,
    4. Bhrigu,
    5. Dharma,
    6. Tapa,
    7. Yama,
    8. Marici,
    9. Angiras,
    10. Atri,
    11. Pulastya,
    12. Pulaha,
    13. Kratu,
    14. Vasishtha,
    15. Parameshti,
    16. Surya,
    17. Chandra,
    18. Kardama,
    19. Krodha and
    20. Vikrita.[1][2]
    A list of sixteen found in the Ramayana includes[edit]
    1. Angiras,
    2. Arishtanemi,
    3. Atri,
    4. Daksha,
    5. Kardama,
    6. Kashyapa,
    7. Kratu,
    8. Marichi,
    9. Prachetas,
    10. Pulaha,
    11. Pulastya,
    12. Samshraya,
    13. Shesha,
    14. Sthanu,
    15. Vikrita and
    16. Vivasvan.[1]
    A list of ten includes[edit]
    1. Marichi,
    2. Angiras,
    3. Atri,
    4. Pulastya,
    5. Pulaha,
    6. Kratu,
    7. Vasishtha,
    8. Daksha (or Prachetas),
    9. Bhrigu and
    10. Narada.[1]
    Their creative role varies. Pulaha, for example, is the mythical mind-born son of Brahma and a great rishi. As one of the Prajapatis, he helps create living wildlife such as lions, tigers, bears, wolves, as well as mythical beasts such as kimpurushas and shalabhas.[39]
  12. SeekerOnThePath

    SeekerOnThePath On a mountain between Nietzsche and Islam

    Oct 20, 2020
    Abrahamism is anti-Anthropomorphic, that is why it exists in the first place.
    It's good to bring up Mara for a lot of reasons. You might like this blog post of mine: A World Without Notice: Some thoughts about the logical conclusions of Satan/Shaytan/Iblis which alludes to a similar idea.

    Although Buddhists tend to moreso psychologize Mara as an impulse, whereas I don't reject the metaphysical aspect of the Shaytan/Satan, as a trait within the ego of collective humanity.
  13. DagonVarunaMitraApolloZan

    Jul 14, 2017
    Syncretic Universal Monotheism
    I understand it can take time to read the writing above! Especially the first two posts in this thread, but if and when you might, I'd love to know any of your thoughts on the matter, or if you think an interesting case is presented.

    In the meantime, some music while we wait for any on-topic contribution:

    Whose your Daddy?


    Thank you very much for the great link and putting it here so others can also check it out, anything else like that or commentary you think might be useful is very much welcome any time in any of my threads!

    So, I'm not sure many people are reading what is written here, but in the first two posts I try to show how there seems to be a kind of overlap between some writers and thinkers attributing things to God and others attributing the same or similar things to Satan, and that the things people think of as God's acts or attributes or epithets, are for other groups like Zoroastrians and Buddhists linked to their versions of "The Evil One" who is opposed to the figures they consider their ideal or the "Good God". This happens a lot, where even in some of the religions people now call "pagan", there seems to be sometimes when they call one favorably, then call the same or one with similar attributes or acts the villain, and in very many cases the villain seems to be imbued with the knowledge and power of God in some ways (like Fafnir for example, who is questioned about things and provides insights into all sorts of things). There was even an idea seemingly (which seems to even exist in the Bible with the "wrestling match with God or God's Angel story) where people would struggle against God and defeat God in some form in order to twist their arm or get the information or blessings or whatever from killing God or torturing God or winning against the God.

    The idea of a "spiritual" or even "ultimate" sort of Originator and Father that one aligns to was very significant during the period before and after Jesus among the Jewish people and others, and there was a lot going on (such as in the "War Scrolls" for example) that seemed to talk about the legions and "Sons" of One or the Other, the Devil vs God, the Devil vs Christ, and who you were the true devotee and "son" or otherwise "servant" of.