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Who's a UU?

mystic man

Esoteric
To all of the UUs out there!

If I agree with the principles and purposes of UUism can I rightly call myself a UU?

Because I live nowhere near a UU congregation but I know it's the way to go for me.
 

Scuba Pete

Le plongeur avec attitude...
Excellent question. I was UU as a kid, and though I moved away from that mind set in my college years, I am finding that I am returning to my oh-so-liberal roots. Although I am attending a United Church of Christ close to me, I still feel UU to my core: especially with my hate of war. :D
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate

mystic man

Esoteric
But I don't want to pay just to call myself this or that.

EDIT: But I haven't even checked out the second website, thanks. Woah it's pretty cool too. Kinda nerdy though lol.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
But I don't want to pay just to call myself this or that.

EDIT: But I haven't even checked out the second website, thanks. Woah it's pretty cool too. Kinda nerdy though lol.
Pay? Many of us choose to donate because we believe in the mission and want to help, but there's no required payment for membership in any of our congregations.
 

mystic man

Esoteric
Pay? Many of us choose to donate because we believe in the mission and want to help, but there's no required payment for membership in any of our congregations.

orly? Swell, I thought the first one "required donation" for membership. I.E forced payment. But I am probably wrong.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
orly? Swell, I thought the first one "required donation" for membership. I.e forced payment. But I am probably wrong.
There is a donation button. But it is not mandatory to give. They are just trying to make it easier for people who want to.

Ya know, the website of my church recently added a big fat obnoxious "donate" button to the front page. They are trying to make it easier for people who want to give too. But I told them that people would see that and think we were all about collecting money. It's rather tacky.
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
To be honest, I'm kind of fuzzy on how membership works. I know members have a financial commitment we're supposed to make, but if we don't, I don't think anyone tells us "You're no longer a member, so sorry!", especially since so many people give time and energy to the community even when they can't give money. However, I think I once lost my free UUWorld magazine because I couldn't pay my Pledge, so.... maybe there are some unofficial ways of differentiating between paying and non-paying members?
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
To be honest, I'm kind of fuzzy on how membership works. I know members have a financial commitment we're supposed to make, but if we don't, I don't think anyone tells us "You're no longer a member, so sorry!", especially since so many people give time and energy to the community even when they can't give money. However, I think I once lost my free UUWorld magazine because I couldn't pay my Pledge, so.... maybe there are some unofficial ways of differentiating between paying and non-paying members?
You do not need to pledge any money whatsoever to be a member of a UU congregation. But, if you actually want certain privileges, you do need to officially pledge some amount of money to be put on the books at the UUA. Getting UU World is one of the privileges. Voting is another. When you lost the subscription, it didn't mean you weren't considered a UU anymore.

I actually have never received my copy of UU World, despite pledging.
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
You do not need to pledge any money whatsoever to be a member of a UU congregation. But, if you actually want certain privileges, you do need to officially pledge some amount of money to be put on the books at the UUA. Getting UU World is one of the privileges. Voting is another. When you lost the subscription, it didn't mean you weren't considered a UU anymore.
Oh good. I have to admit, when I lost the subscription---and then started being plagued by phone calls of people reminding me that all members have a financial obligation to the church---I was getting a little annoyed and feeling as though they wanted my money more than they wanted me. I didn't need the magazine so much, but the phone calls.... in my congregation, at least, there doesn't seem to be very much sympathy for people in bad financial situations. If you can't pay your Pledge, they treat you like you're being stingy or making excuses, or they make statements like "Oh, I remember what it was like to live off of Ramen, but...." When I explained I was a college student and had just unexpectedly incurred $160 a month in parking fees which I couldn't afford, the response I received was, "Surely you can afford $5 a week...?" I felt like screaming "No, I can't even afford to EAT!" into the phone, but obviously I didn't do that, heh. I guess I felt like the Stewardship folks weren't listening to me at all, and that my other contributions to the congregation---as a Worship Associate, member of choir, covenant group leader, Ambassador, etc---were not "enough" for the time being. I think when I go into ministry, this very thing is something I'll want to address. Stewardship IS important, but people need to be more compassionate toward and understanding of one another... and congregants need to be valued for more than their financial contributions.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
Oh good. I have to admit, when I lost the subscription---and then started being plagued by phone calls of people reminding me that all members have a financial obligation to the church---I was getting a little annoyed and feeling as though they wanted my money more than they wanted me. I didn't need the magazine so much, but the phone calls.... in my congregation, at least, there doesn't seem to be very much sympathy for people in bad financial situations. If you can't pay your Pledge, they treat you like you're being stingy or making excuses, or they make statements like "Oh, I remember what it was like to live off of Ramen, but...." When I explained I was a college student and had just unexpectedly incurred $160 a month in parking fees which I couldn't afford, the response I received was, "Surely you can afford $5 a week...?" I felt like screaming "No, I can't even afford to EAT!" into the phone, but obviously I didn't do that, heh. I guess I felt like the Stewardship folks weren't listening to me at all, and that my other contributions to the congregation---as a Worship Associate, member of choir, covenant group leader, Ambassador, etc---were not "enough" for the time being. I think when I go into ministry, this very thing is something I'll want to address. Stewardship IS important, but people need to be more compassionate toward and understanding of one another... and congregants need to be valued for more than their financial contributions.
:eek::cover::eek: THAT is awful. That is NOT supposed to happen. Did you complain to your minister? I would have made a stink. Not just for your sake but for others as well. We keep saying that we welcome all people; that should include people who can't afford to pledge. Money should NEVER be a barrier to being in our community.

I've gotten behind on my pledges more than once and no one at my church has ever bothered me. (Maybe we're bad in the other extreme.) I always make it up eventually (tho sometimes in the following year). And YES, your other contributions should count. When I was a starving student I didn't even pledge. I volunteered in the office, served on committees... NO ONE told me that I had to pay. My senior minister one day very gently explained how as a pledging member I get certain privileges if I pledge, and that the church gets certain privileges for every pledging member that they have, and that even a dollar a week would count, but he never pressured me.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
Mkay, so UUism isn't the way for me. Just seems too sketchy now.
Sketchy?! John Adams, Ralph Waldo Emerson, Susan B. Anthony, and e.e. cummings were Unitarians. Frank Lloyd Wright, Kurt Vonnegut, Linus Pauling, and Christopher Reeves were Unitarian Universalists. Our congregations are filled with doctors, lawyers, scientists, teachers, and social activists. If anything, we're a bit too elitist (and can't understand how some of us have less money). But we are not sketchy.
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
Mkay, so UUism isn't the way for me. Just seems too sketchy now.
Wow, way to disrespect the very people you're coming to for questions.

UUs are all different, as are our congregations. I don't know if my congregation itself has a bit of a misguided approach to Stewardship, or if the Stewardship committee alone is responsible for such unwelcoming behavior, or even if ONE member of the Stewardship committee is showing a severe lack of understanding of others' needs, while the congregation itself does not support such behavior.

Also, as Lilithu explained, the behavior of my congregation regarding Stewardship is deviant and not at all right. It's certainly not the norm. Just because one congregation fails to completely live up to its intention to be a welcoming community, doesn't in any way mean that all---or even most---other congregations behave that way.

Calling an entire religion---and the people who compose it---"sketchy" based on ONE person's experience in ONE congregation regarding ONE issue is unfair and downright rude.
 

mystic man

Esoteric
I wasn't calling the religion sketchy I was talking about the way in functions as you described it by your account.

Oh, and just because somone is a Unitarian doesn't mean he/she is a member of the UUA.

Oh, and giving special privileges to people that donate is sketchy jeeze...
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
Oh, and just because somone is a Unitarian doesn't mean he/she is a member of the UUA.
Of course not, he or she could be a British Unitarian, for example. Or a Romanian Unitarian. Or an Indian Unitarian... They have their own denominational structures.


Oh, and giving special privileges to people that donate is sketchy jeeze...
Really... you think it's "sketchy" to only send magazines to people who give some financial support? How exactly do you envision the UUA pays for the printing and mailing of the magazine? The tooth fairy? You think it's sketchy to only allow those who give financial support to vote? So what, you think any person who just walks off the street and says "I'm a UU" should be able to vote on things that have long term effects the congregation? A pledge is part of what one does in making a commitment to the congregation. Again, how do you think churches pay the utility bills and the salaries for their staff? The tooth fairy?

I already said that it doesn't cost anything to be a member. Now you're saying that you want to not pay anything but also get the magazine for free, and be able to vote and do everything that pledging members get to do, all without any commitment on your part. You want to get everything without giving anything back.

Sorry, but I'm not feeling a big loss here if you decide not to join.
 

mystic man

Esoteric
lol @ Magazine, and no I don't think somone should have to pay to vote as long as they've been around for awile.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
lol @ Magazine, and no I don't think somone should have to pay to vote as long as they've been around for awile.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
For what it's worth, I agree; I think a person who has been around for a while, or who contributes in other ways (by volunteering time and effort to church activities) should be able to vote. However, the problem with that is: how do you determine who is and is not "deserving" of a vote? Do you give it to everyone...even the people who walk in off the street having never attended a single church service? Do you give it to people who have agreed to become members? Do you give it to folks who've been members for at least 6 months? 1 year? 3 years? What if they've been members for a long time, but have never been seen in church or have never participated in anything, or have only attended or participated rarely? Should someone who is unaware of what is going on in a congregation be given voting rights and the power to make decisions which affect that congregation? How do you decide whether they've attended or participated "enough", and who gets to make that decision? How do you make such a decision consistently, so that it is fair to everyone?

Allocating voting rights based on who has contributed financially is a very easy way to determine who is entitled to a vote and who is not. It's not a perfect system. but I think it's less arbitrary and more fair than other ways of going about it. If we were to base it on how long you've been a member, or how much you've participated, I think there will be more cases of someone who really should be allowed to vote being excluded, or too many people who really shouldn't be allowed to vote being permitted to do so.
 

lilithu

The Devil's Advocate
For what it's worth, I agree; I think a person who has been around for a while, or who contributes in other ways (by volunteering time and effort to church activities) should be able to vote.
I agree too. But as you go on to say, it becomes incredibly complicated if you try to use different criteria. In my congregation, you literally do not need to pledge more than a dollar to have the right to vote. It's not the amount of money; it's the demonstration that you're making a commitment to the congregation. And while I totally agree with you that there are other ways in which people demonstrate their commitment, this is the simplest way. As I said before, I did not pledge when I was a starving student, and I never felt slighted about not being able to vote despite spending several hours each week on church activities. Tho maybe it's because I really don't care who gets elected to the board, etc. :eek: As long as it's not me. :p
 
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