Who will enter the kingdom of Heaven?

[Pah]

According to the Bible (and this is all religions include and any Holy Book), who will enter Heaven?

According to St. Matthew 7:21

"Not every one that said unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.".../

The rich man doesn't stand a chance. I also take that as powerful men or women

 

[Katzpur]

The rich man doesn't stand a chance. I also take that as powerful men or women

I agree that the same logic could be extended to powerful men or women. But Jesus never said that the rich man doesn't stand a chance. He said this would be difficult, not impossible. And I believe He explained why when He said that where our treasure is, that's where our heart is. If money or power or fame is our god, that's who we are going to serve. I don't see God as punishing someone merely for being wealthy, but for loving his money more than he loves God.

 

[Pah]

I agree that the same logic could be extended to powerful men or women. But Jesus never said that the rich man doesn't stand a chance. He said this would be difficult, not impossible. And I believe He explained why when He said that where our treasure is, that's where our heart is. If money or power or fame is our god, that's who we are going to serve. I don't see God as punishing someone merely for being wealthy, but for loving his money more than he loves God.

I was thinking as I wrote that it should be taken as a slim chance. So you are right in that respect. But let me remind (meant in the nicest way) you of James 2 where the "rich" man is chastised for discrimination and told that breaking one law (or commandment) is enough to convict as if he broke all law. Certainly breaking all law would "disbar" a person from heaven.

 

[Katzpur]

But let me remind (meant in the nicest way) you of James 2 where the "rich" man is chastised for discrimination and told that breaking one law (or commandment) is enough to convict as if he broke all law. Certainly breaking all law would "disbar" a person from heaven.

Absolutely. Unless someone else paid the penalty.

 

[Pah]

Absolutely. Unless someone else paid the penalty.

Couldn't you be forgiven your sins and still not be righteous?

 

[Katzpur]

Couldn't you be forgiven your sins and still not be righteous?

I'm not quite sure I'm following you. I see righteousness as nothing more than continual repentence. I don't see it as being synonomous with perfection. I definitely believe that imperfect people can be forgiven of their sins, but I don't see a person who has been forgiven of his sins as being "righteous," unless he continues to make a conscious effort towards the ultimate goal, that goal not being attainable during mortality. Does that make sense, or did I not even come close to answering your question?

 

[Pah]

I'm not quite sure I'm following you. I see righteousness as nothing more than continual repentence. ...

I guess the key is "repentance". The rich man would have to be in continual repentance which requires an act from the rich man

 

[lunamoth]

I guess the key is "repentance". The rich man would have to be in continual repentance which requires an act from the rich man

I'm not sure that one really needs to repent being wealthy.

Repentence means turning away, not feeling 'really really guilty.' I think this is probably the idea behind tithing and almsgiving.

2 c,
luna

 

[Pah]

I'm not sure that one really needs to repent being wealthy.

Repentence means turning away, not feeling 'really really guilty.' I think this is probably the idea behind tithing and almsgiving.

2 c,
luna

It's not the wealth per se. It is not performing the stewardship required.

 

[lunamoth]

It's not the wealth per se. It is not performing the stewardship required.

I agree; that's a good way of putting it.

 

[verita]

Which words/
That proverb is found in the Jewish scriptures and could mean a heck of a lot.

Pro 30:5 Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him.
Pro 30:6 Do not add to His Words, lest He reprove you and you be found a liar.

The are many interpretations to it, how do you know that yours is right? it could be wrong.

The Book of Proverbs contains Israel's wisdom and provides Godly worldview and insights for every humans. When I read the Book of Proverbs I found wisdom on it and it is true even up to this time.

 

[verita]

Verita,

Just never mind. If all you can do is list a bunch of scriptures, don't even waste your time.

Luk 21:14 Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand what you shall answer.
Luk 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.

I am not wasting my time. The Holy Spirit reminds me of the verse in the scripture.

OK now I will stop.

God bless you.

 

[Bishka]

Luk 21:14 Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand what you shall answer.
Luk 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.

I am not wasting my time. The Holy Spirit reminds me of the verse in the scripture.

OK now I will stop.

God bless you.

Do you have your own opinion??

 

[Katzpur]

I am not wasting my time.

That's debatable. I guess it all depends upon what your purpose is. If you just like to quote one scripture after another to impress yourself, you've obviously accomplished what you've set out to do. If, on the other hand, you are at all interested in convincing me (or probably most anyone else) that your interpretation of scripture is worth considering, you most certainly are wasting your time. I realize that I'm probably sounding kind of callous, but in all sincerety, I think most people on this forum are more interested in hearing you explain your position (maybe backing it up with a scripture here and there) than reading through a dozen scriptures with little or no commentary. It's just a suggestion. Take it or leave it.

 

[gnostic]

I realize that I'm probably sounding kind of callous, but in all sincerety, I think most people on this forum are more interested in hearing you explain your position (maybe backing it up with a scripture here and there) than reading through a dozen scriptures with little or no commentary.

That's a very good point.

I didn't come here just to read people quoting from the scripture, but to find out what are people's view on whatever they believe. I quote sometimes, but I would also provide my own view on what I am quoting. I may not be right in my interpretation, but I will learn something from others.

These are debate sections of forums, so the one's view is far more important in exchanging idea than just copying-and-pasting the scriptures. Even, in the discussion groups, some commentary or explanations are required.

 

[nutshell]

Don't you guys understand??? His thoughts are the Words thoughts and his words are the Words. Why would he dilute the Word with his fleshy interpretations?

 

[verita]

Don't you guys understand??? His thoughts are the Words thoughts and his words are the Words. Why would he dilute the Word with his fleshy interpretations?

Thanks be to God. Someone understood why I am hesitatant to explain the Words of God.

Nutshell, this is what our Lord Jesus Christ said to men like you.
Mar 12:34 And seeing that he had answered intelligently, Jesus said to him, You are not far from the kingdom of God. And no one dared to question Him any more.

And because I believe you are in search for TRUTH, I will show to you and the rest of the members/visitors of RF “Where is God?”. Please watch the thread “Where is God?” in a couple of minutes and it will be there.

God bless you.
LA VERITA or THE TRUTH

 

[nutshell]

Thanks be to God. Someone understood why I am hesitatant to explain the Words of God.

Nutshell, this is what our Lord Jesus Christ said to men like you.
Mar 12:34 And seeing that he had answered intelligently, Jesus said to him, You are not far from the kingdom of God. And no one dared to question Him any more.

And because I believe you are in search for TRUTH, I will show to you and the rest of the members/visitors of RF “Where is God?”. Please watch the thread “Where is God?” in a couple of minutes and it will be there.

God bless you.
LA VERITA or THE TRUTH

Thank you for the kind words, brother. I look forward to continuing my search for TRUTH and for God in your thread "Where is God?"

God bless you.
nutshell

 

[Booko]

********* MOD POST *********

Hi folks, just a friendly reminder to keep things civil.

4.) While debating and discussion is fine, we will not tolerate rudeness, insulting posts, personal attacks or inflammatory posts. We will allow faith to be debated and discussed by a member only when there is no hostile, rude, or insulting opinion of another's faith.