Who wants to talk about Satan?!

[paarsurrey]

Jesus certainly spoke of Satan as being a real person. Or, don't you believe Jesus was real person either?

Gospels is not written by Jesus, it is narration of anonymous narrators which was doctored by many under the name of "Paul". It is not representative of what Jesus believed and his acts. Satan is an evil personage made for human understanding, it is not G-d.Satan* (another name Iblis*) cannot do good as it is a creation of God as per scheme of human life designed by G-d.

Regards

_____________
Quran [2:35]-[2:37]
[2:35]
And remember the time when We said to the angels: ‘Submit to Adam,’ and they all submitted. But Iblis* did not. He refused and was too proud; and he was of the disbelievers.
[2:36]
And We said: ‘O Adam, dwell thou and thy wife in the garden, and eat therefrom plentifully wherever you will, but approach not this tree, lest you be of the wrongdoers.’
[2:37]
But Satan* caused them both to slip by means of it and drove them out of the state in which they were. And We said: ‘Go forth; some of you are enemies of others, and for you there is an abode in the earth and a provision for a time.
https://www.alislam.org/quran/2:34https://www.alislam.org/quran/2:34

Regards

 

[Neuropteron]

in the story of Job, where the will of God and of Satan are the same,
"Jesus is even quoted as threatening to become (a) "Satan" and advising others not the be a "Satan" towards him".

What do you think?

.......................................

Not sure what you mean when you say "the will of God and Satan are the same" in the book of Job.

Perhaps you are thinking that some of the words of the false comforters are in agreement with God's way of thinking, if so that would be a mistake.
God said concerning them:" for you men have not spoken concerning me what is truthful.."(job 42:2)

Could you give a scriptural refence to your statement that Jesus threatened to become a Satan, as I am not aware of such an occurence.

It is worth considering that if a person says " i wll resist or oppose you" does not necessarily indicate his disposition to become Satan.(Since Satan means opposer).

Be well

 

[PruePhillip]

Gospels is not written by Jesus, it is narration of anonymous narrators which was doctored by many under the name of "Paul". It is not representative of what Jesus believed and his acts.

Glad we got that one worked out.
I thought the Gospels were four accounts, written by three eyewitnesses and one fellow preacher with Paul. And put into the "New Testament" despite their differences of opinion.
And I thought that if they said Jesus said something about Satan *** as a person *** then we should believe that no more and no less than believing in Jesus.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.

If you kill Death, doesn't that make the default "life"?

I'm pretty sure I've read multiple stories in Grimms about that...

 

[1213]

If you kill Death, doesn't that make the default "life"?

I have understood that this “life” is the first death. So, my answer is, no.

 

[j1i]

Since I Can't post in the DIR I'll make a thread here. It's been a few years actually, I'm certain to meet many new people and I hope to encounter many of my old friends here.

The literal translations of "Satan" mean "opposition" or "adversary". By this definition, any and all "God(s)" are essentially a Satan to the will of nature and the universe as we know it, based in entropy and self preservation. And so, I conjure that not only is every God Satan, but Satan is the universe itself, as conflict is inherit in the ways of all the cosmos. It is the trial of existence, this is Satan. So in essence we live in Satan's kingdom, a realm of opposition.

I believe in many ways certain aspects of the Bible imply this, especially if you think of mystery Babylon and the tower Babel. I will also include the book of Enoch into this and Septuagint, although some verses in KJV are the same, like Mark 7:6-7. There are plenty of examples, like in the story of Job, where the will of God and of Satan are the same, only God is holding the reigns of his will "Satan". Jesus is even quoted as threatening to become (a) "Satan" and advising others not the be a "Satan" towards him.

What do you think?

When God began creation and the Spirit merged with the elements
He make some right-wing creatures that do not have the right disobedience
like angels

We know that some creatures are praised and described as angels
As a kind of praise
But they are not angelic creatures
Because angels have their own Creation properties


Then god created some creatures has the freedom of choice (conflict) between faith in the extent and compatibility with him, and between disobedience and non-obedience and the lack of faith in fate and destiny

NOTE:-
Creatures can change fate and destiny by praying to God and ask him
But this change God chooses according to God's sympathy with the creature and its circumstances
It may not be a complete change but have kindness in it its ways to mercy


When God merge the Spirit into objects (who have free choose)
There are spirits who opposition to their social status and wanted to be higher creatures
Including the jinn, which is the beginning of demons ( lucifer. Satan)
After the creation of man began to opposition to his Lord also appeared to us demons of mankind

 

[PruePhillip]

If you kill Death, doesn't that make the default "life"?

I'm pretty sure I've read multiple stories in Grimms about that...

I am impressed when skeptics resort to ridicule, caricature and avoiding difficult elements when attacking the bible.
Had the attacks being thoughtful, intellectually honest and well reasoned then I would have started having issues with religion.
As most intelligent people can figure out - the death of death simply means there is no more death.

 

[PruePhillip]

When God began creation and the Spirit merged with the elements
He make some right-wing creatures that do not have the right disobedience
like angels

We know that some creatures are praised and described as angels
As a kind of praise
But they are not angelic creatures
Because angels have their own Creation properties


Then god created some creatures has the freedom of choice (conflict) between faith in the extent and compatibility with him, and between disobedience and non-obedience and the lack of faith in fate and destiny

NOTE:-
Creatures can change fate and destiny by praying to God and ask him
But this change God chooses according to God's sympathy with the creature and its circumstances
It may not be a complete change but have kindness in it its ways to mercy


When God merge the Spirit into objects (who have free choose)
There are spirits who opposition to their social status and wanted to be higher creatures
Including the jinn, which is the beginning of demons ( lucifer. Satan)
After the creation of man began to opposition to his Lord also appeared to us demons of mankind

Where did all this come from?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Where did all this come from?

I don't know if it is standard, but his religion is Islam. Of course just as we have Christians here that seem to make up their own beliefs, I am sure there are Muslims that do the same here.

 

[j1i]

Where did all this come from?

Islamic religion

 

[Orias]

I am impressed when skeptics resort to ridicule, caricature and avoiding difficult elements when attacking the bible.
Had the attacks being thoughtful, intellectually honest and well reasoned then I would have started having issues with religion.
As most intelligent people can figure out - the death of death simply means there is no more death.

Death can mean many things. If I were to ascribe to monotheism Death would be the only God.

But we are more than the materials formed in this universe. We are also what came from other dimensions we cannot perceive. So what is dying?

People talk about free will. I don't think it exists as true free will, we do have a choice in our death (usually). I think that's free will, free will sacrifice. All life is about sacrifice, giving time and energy for a better becoming, it's the small things that count .

 

[j1i]

Death can mean many things. If I were to ascribe to monotheism Death would be the only God.

But we are more than the materials formed in this universe. We are also what came from other dimensions we cannot perceive. So what is dying?

People talk about free will. I don't think it exists as true free will, we do have a choice in our death (usually). I think that's free will, free will sacrifice. All life is about sacrifice, giving time and energy for a better becoming, it's the small things that count .

Death does not mean the end
Death means the end of a stage and the beginning of a stage

The difference between cultures is where we will be and why we exist

There are people who do not like traditional ideas (found in believers) may find them boring or frightening because they Impotence the reality of punishment for unbelief

They try to put positive perceptions, beyond death


for example
Hindus believe that a good man if he dies is brought back to life wih more easily life
And the wicked shall return to life, and his life shall be miserable

The process of proportionality here is not so

God created creatures with justice
Those who are born miserable and poor receive the privileges of misery
Allowances

What the Hindus mean is that they will return to the account with God on the Day of Resurrection
A team will enter paradise because they are good (They believe in the oneness of God)

And the team will enter the fire because they are unfit (They failed the exam they tested during their lives) They did not worship God correctly


I mean, they will not return to the cycle of life we are living now, but on the Day of Resurrection

 

[74x12]

Yes, that is what I think.
And 4th degree! My Mother has his ring.

4th degree what? Scottish rite or York rite?

 

[j1i]

4th degree what? Scottish rite or York rite?

can you explain this dude
with respect

 

[74x12]

can you explain this dude
with respect

Talking about freemasonry. There is the Scottish rite and the York rite. They have different systems. For example in the Scottish rite there is supposedly 33 degrees and in the York right I think it's only 10 degrees or something.

 

[j1i]

Talking about freemasonry. There is the Scottish rite and the York rite. They have different systems. For example in the Scottish rite there is supposedly 33 degrees and in the York right I think it's only 10 degrees or something.

3 3
11 + 11 + 11
They are code numbers like this but not this
Capitoline Triad - Wikipedia
the eleventh figure such as the Aquarius and the planet Uranus
Zeus = 33

The Romans used to sanctify the fig tree, which is in Arabic when calculating its letters equal 11 and the eleventh house is indirectly enshrined in the accounts

Because of the existence of the theory of Triad or trigonometry in civilizations it is therefore shared

I was thinking whether the idea of the Trinity was related to the Triad

The illumination of the Buddha was realized after sitting under the fig tree

In Islam
God swore by fig and olive

 

[EtuMalku]

The literal translations of "Satan" mean "opposition" or "adversary". By this definition, any and all "God(s)" are essentially a Satan to the will of nature and the universe as we know it, based in entropy and self preservation. And so, I conjure that not only is every God Satan, but Satan is the universe itself, as conflict is inherit in the ways of all the cosmos. It is the trial of existence, this is Satan. So in essence we live in Satan's kingdom, a realm of opposition.

What do you think?

Forgive me for coming late to the party . . .

Theistic Satanism or spiritual Satanism is the umbrella term for religious beliefs that consider Satan as an objectively existing supernatural being or force worthy of supplication, with whom individuals may contact, convene and even praise, rather than him being just an archetype, symbol or idea as in LaVeyan Satanism.

The word 'Supplication' meaning the action of asking or begging for something earnestly or humbly", deserves attention from the definition in that this is a key difference between Theistic and non-Theistic Satanism/Luciferianism. Non-Theistic Satanism/Luciferianism has no supplication involved, does not believe in deities other than archetypal structures, or symbols.

Religious unorthodoxy can only exist if the orthodox version is believed in, otherwise, there is nothing to be unorthodox against. Therefore, Theistic Satanism/Luciferianism is entrenched in Abrahamic theology in order to exist. This type of Satanism is closer to the left hand path of the east (vamachara) then it is to the western left hand path. Various organizations have addressed this heterodoxy stance with various success by tracing the Prince of Darkness to other cultures, thus removing the Abrahamic stigma to Satan.

The Abrahamic idea of Satan as God's Adversary, is NOT how non-theistic Satanists approach Satan, which is an archetype of pride, carnality, liberty, enlightenment, undefiled wisdom, within a cosmos perceived to be motivated by a dark evolutionary force of entropy that permeates all of nature and providing the drive for survival and propagation inherent in all living things.

 

[PruePhillip]

Death can mean many things. If I were to ascribe to monotheism Death would be the only God.

But we are more than the materials formed in this universe. We are also what came from other dimensions we cannot perceive. So what is dying?

People talk about free will. I don't think it exists as true free will, we do have a choice in our death (usually). I think that's free will, free will sacrifice. All life is about sacrifice, giving time and energy for a better becoming, it's the small things that count .

We can't say anything about "other dimensions", at least the spacial ones - that's just conjecture. We have enough issues with the real world without conjuring up other dimensions.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

I am impressed when skeptics resort to ridicule, caricature and avoiding difficult elements when attacking the bible.
Had the attacks being thoughtful, intellectually honest and well reasoned then I would have started having issues with religion.
As most intelligent people can figure out - the death of death simply means there is no more death.

The response is silly, but not the question behind it. What happens when you get rid of death? Does everything I eat walk away after coming out the other end?

 

[PruePhillip]

The response is silly, but not the question behind it. What happens when you get rid of death? Does everything I eat walk away after coming out the other end?

The bible states that man is two creatures - that which is of the earth (that life came out of the sea Gen 1) and that man is a "living creature" in that God breathed life into him. Not life as in other creatures, but I take that as being spiritual life. When the body dies this spirit goes back to God. And the spirit cannot die.
That's the bible's take on it, for what it's worth. And that's what Christians believe.