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Who embarked Isra/Mir'aj-Prophet Muhammad or Moses?

Discussion in 'Qur'anist DIR' started by Union, Jun 11, 2013.

  1. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    So far the Qur'an is concerned , there is no evidence of Prophet Muhammad's ascension to heaven which is traditionally called Isra or Mirajj.The verse that is believed to be associate with this is :

    [017:001] Glory to (God) Who did take His servant for a Journey by night from the Sacred Mosque to the farthest Mosque, whose precincts We did bless,- in order that We might show him some of Our Signs: for He is the One Who heareth and seeth (all things).

    This verse doesn't mention the name rather said 'His servant' .Now the question is who is this servant . Traditionally it is interpreted as Prophet Muhammad . But if you restrict yourself within the Qur'an , to look for the answer for this question , the immediate next verse will answer you that it was prophet Moses :

    [017:002] And WE gave Moses the Book and WE made it a guidance for the Children of Israel, commanding, `Take ye no guardian beside ME,

    If you keep on reading the verse 3,4,5... you will see that all are about Prophet Moses and his tribe Bani Israel . In fact the chapter itself named ' Bani Israel' which predicts the sura to be dedicated to discuss about the story of Moses and his tribe primarily .

    Also it would be really appealing to inquire whether Prophet Moses had ever undertaken any night journey which might appear noticeable/vital for his life . Yes , we really do find this incident described by Almighty ALLAH in Qur'an in sevearl different places :

    [028:029] Now when Moses had fulfilled the term, and was traveling with his family, he perceived a fire in the direction of Mount Tur. He said to his family: "Tarry ye; I perceive a fire; I hope to bring you from there some information, or a burning firebrand, that ye may warm yourselves."
    [028:030] But when he came to the (fire), a voice was heard from the right bank of the valley, from a tree in hallowed ground: "O Moses! Verily I am God, the Lord of the Worlds....
    [028:031] "Now do thou throw thy rod!" but when he saw it moving (of its own accord) as if it had been a snake, he turned back in retreat, and retraced not his steps: O Moses!" (It was said), "Draw near, and fear not: for thou art of those who are secure.
    [028:032] "Move thy hand into thy bosom, and it will come forth white without stain (or harm), and draw thy hand close to thy side (to guard) against fear. Those are the two credentials from thy Lord to Pharaoh and his Chiefs: for truly they are a people rebellious and wicked."


    [020:009] Has the story of Moses reached thee?
    [020:010] Behold, he saw a fire: So he said to his family, "Tarry ye; I perceive a fire; perhaps I can bring you some burning brand therefrom, or find some guidance at the fire."
    [020:011] But when he came to the fire, a voice was heard: "O Moses!
    [020:012] "Verily I am thy Lord! therefore (in My presence) put off thy shoes: thou art in the sacred valley Tuwa.
    [020:013] "I have chosen thee: listen, then, to the inspiration (sent to thee).
    [020:014] "Verily, I am God: There is no god but I: So serve thou Me (only), and establish regular prayer for celebrating My praise.
    [020:015] "Verily the Hour is coming - My design is to keep it hidden - for every soul to receive its reward by the measure of its Endeavour.
    [020:016] "Therefore let not such as believe not therein but follow their own lusts, divert thee therefrom, lest thou perish!"..
    [020:017] "And what is that in the right hand, O Moses?"
    [020:018] He said, "It is my rod: on it I lean; with it I beat down fodder for my flocks; and in it I find other uses."
    [020:019] (God) said, "Throw it, O Moses!"
    [020:020] He threw it, and behold! It was a snake, active in motion.
    [020:021] (God) said, "Seize it, and fear not: We shall return it at once to its former condition"..
    [020:022] "Now draw thy hand close to thy side: It shall come forth white (and shining), without harm (or stain),- as another Sign,-
    [020:023] "In order that We may show thee (two) of our Greater Signs.


    [027:007] Behold! Moses said to his family: "I perceive a fire; soon will I bring you from there some information, or I will bring you a burning brand to light our fuel, that ye may warn yourselves.
    [027:008] But when he came to the (fire), a voice was heard: "Blessed are those in the fire and those around: and glory to God, the Lord of the worlds.
    [027:009] "O Moses! verily, I am God, the exalted in might, the wise!....
    [027:010] "Now do thou throw thy rod!" But when he saw it moving (of its own accord)as if it had been a snake, he turned back in retreat, and retraced not his steps: "O Moses!" (it was said), "Fear not: truly, in My presence, those called as apostles have no fear,-
    [027:011] "But if any have done wrong and have thereafter substituted good to take the place of evil, truly, I am Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
    [027:012] "Now put thy hand into thy bosom, and it will come forth white without stain (or harm): (these are) among the nine Signs (thou wilt take) to Pharaoh and his people: for they are a people rebellious in transgression."


    There is also another account of night journey undertaken by Prophet Moses along with tribe of Israel is here :

    [044:023] So go forth with My servants by night; surely you will be pursued:
    [044:024] And leave the sea intervening; surely they are a host that shall be drowned.


    The above mentioned night journeys of Prophet Moses has a neat link with verse 17:1 which mistakenly interpreted of Muhammad's . Moreover we have seen before , verse 17:2 mentioned Moses' name and verse 17:1 and 17:2 are separated by 'wa' (and) which suggest a continuation of the incident.
     
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  2. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    These following verses also add a suspicion whether really ever prophet Muhammad ascend to heaven !!

    [006:033] We know indeed that what they say certainly grieves you, but surely they do not call you a liar; but the unjust deny the communications of Allah.
    [006:034] And certainly apostles before you were rejected, but they were patient on being rejected and persecuted until Our help came to them; and there is none to change the words of Allah, and certainly there has come to you some information about the messengers.
    [006:035] And if their turning away is hard on you, then if you can seek an opening (to go down) into the earth or a ladder (to ascend up) to heaven so that you should bring them a sign and if Allah had pleased He would certainly have gathered them all on guidance, therefore be not of the ignorant.


    [017:090] And they say: We will by no means believe in you until you cause a fountain to gush forth from the earth for us.
    [017:091] Or you should have a garden of palms and grapes in the midst of which you should cause rivers to flow forth, gushing out.
    [017:092] Or you should cause the heaven to come down upon us in pieces as you think, or bring Allah and the angels face to face (with us).
    [017:093] Or you should have a house of gold, or you should ascend into heaven, and we will not believe in your ascending until you bring down to us a book which we may read. Say: Glory be to my Lord; am I aught but a mortal apostle?
     
  3. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    Two fatal loopholes in the story of Miraj/Isra of Prophet Muhammad (there could be many , but I didn't spend time for searching others :D)

    The 01-st One :

    Sahih Bukhari , Volume 1, Book 8, Number 345
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    Narrated Abu Dhar:

    Allah's Apostle said, "While I was at Mecca the roof of my house was opened and Gabriel descended, opened my chest, and washed it with Zam-zam water. Then he brought a golden tray full of wisdom and faith and having poured its contents into my chest, he closed it. Then he took my hand and ascended with me to the nearest heaven, when I reached the nearest heaven, Gabriel said to the gatekeeper of the heaven, 'Open (the gate).' The gatekeeper asked, 'Who is it?' Gabriel answered: 'Gabriel.' He asked, 'Is there anyone with you?' Gabriel replied, 'Yes, Muhammad I is with me.' He asked, 'Has he been called?' Gabriel said, 'Yes.' So the gate was opened and we went over the nearest heaven and there we saw a man sitting with some people on his right and some on his left. When he looked towards his right, he laughed and when he looked toward his left he wept. Then he said, 'Welcome! O pious Prophet and pious son.' I asked Gabriel, 'Who is he?' He replied, 'He is Adam and the people on his right and left are the souls of his offspring. Those on his right are the people of Paradise and those on his left are the people of Hell and when he looks towards his right he laughs and when he looks towards his left he weeps.'

    Then he ascended with me till he reached the second heaven and he (Gabriel) said to its gatekeeper, 'Open (the gate).' The gatekeeper said to him the same as the gatekeeper of the first heaven had said and he opened the gate. Anas said: "Abu Dhar added that the Prophet met Adam, Idris, Moses, Jesus and Abraham, he (Abu Dhar) did not mention on which heaven they were but he mentioned that he (the Prophet ) met Adarn on the nearest heaven and Abraham on the sixth heaven. Anas said, "When Gabriel along with the Prophet passed by Idris, the latter said, 'Welcome! O pious Prophet and pious brother.' The Prophet asked, 'Who is he?' Gabriel replied, 'He is Idris." The Prophet added, "I passed by Moses and he said, 'Welcome! O pious Prophet and pious brother.' I asked Gabriel, 'Who is he?' Gabriel replied, 'He is Moses.' Then I passed by Jesus and he said, 'Welcome! O pious brother and pious Prophet.' I asked, 'Who is he?' Gabriel replied, 'He is Jesus.
    Then I passed by Abraham and he said, 'Welcome! O pious Prophet and pious son.' I asked Gabriel, 'Who is he?' Gabriel replied, 'He is Abraham. The Prophet added, 'Then Gabriel ascended with me to a place where I heard the creaking of the pens." Ibn Hazm and Anas bin Malik said: The Prophet said, "Then Allah enjoined fifty prayers on my followers when I returned with this order of Allah, I passed by Moses who asked me, 'What has Allah enjoined on your followers?' I replied, 'He has enjoined fifty prayers on them.' Moses said, 'Go back to your Lord (and appeal for reduction) for your followers will not be able to bear it.' (So I went back to Allah and requested for reduction) and He reduced it to half. When I passed by Moses again and informed him about it, he said, 'Go back to your Lord as your followers will not be able to bear it.' So I returned to Allah and requested for further reduction and half of it was reduced. I again passed by Moses and he said to me: 'Return to your Lord, for your followers will not be able to bear it. So I returned to Allah and He said, 'These are five prayers and they are all (equal to) fifty (in reward) for My Word does not change.' I returned to Moses and he told me to go back once again. I replied, 'Now I feel shy of asking my Lord again.' Then Gabriel took me till we '' reached Sidrat-il-Muntaha (Lote tree of; the utmost boundry) which was shrouded in colors, indescribable. Then I was admitted into Paradise where I found small (tents or) walls (made) of pearls and its earth was of musk."
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The above story is famous among the Muslim community . This story has insulted All-knowing ALLAH that how changeable HIS mind is and also an insult to the Prophet Muhammad (p) that how silly and unwise his knowledge about his Ummah is ! Prophet Musa , sitting on the heaven could reckon the distress of the Muslims Ummah but ALLAH , the Exalted and HIS Prophet failed to realize so . Nice pro-Jews Hadith indeed .

    Whatsoever , the agenda is bit digital here . In the above Hadith Imam Bukhari (or whoever described this story to him) made a serious mistake which eventually exposed his too much imagination and vagueness of this story . Please Bear with me :

    At first Almighty ALLAH prescribed 50 prayers for the Muslims .

    Then , Almighty ALLAH made it half , i.e., now 50/2 = 25 prayers for Muslims.

    Then again Almighty ALLAH reduced it to another half , i.e., 25/2 = 12 ½ prayers for Muslims .

    How 12 ½ prayers be ever existed ??
     
  4. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    The 02-nd One :

    Now you can see at least five Miraj/Isra divergent stories found within Bukhari and Muslim .

    01st Version :
    ===========
    Sahih Bukhari , Volume 1, Book 8, Number 345
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    Narrated Abu Dhar:
    …….. Ibn Hazm and Anas bin Malik said: The Prophet said, "Then Allah enjoined fifty prayers on my followers when I returned with this order of Allah, I passed by Moses who asked me, 'What has Allah enjoined on your followers?' I replied, 'He has enjoined fifty prayers on them.' Moses said, 'Go back to your Lord (and appeal for reduction) for your followers will not be able to bear it.' (So I went back to Allah and requested for reduction) and He reduced it to half. When I passed by Moses again and informed him about it, he said, 'Go back to your Lord as your followers will not be able to bear it.' So I returned to Allah and requested for further reduction and half of it was reduced. I again passed by Moses and he said to me: 'Return to your Lord, for your followers will not be able to bear it. So I returned to Allah and He said, 'These are five prayers and they are all (equal to) fifty (in reward) for My Word does not change.' I returned to Moses and he told me to go back once again. I replied, 'Now I feel shy of asking my Lord again.' Then Gabriel took me till we '' reached Sidrat-il-Muntaha (Lote tree of; the utmost boundry) which was shrouded in colors, indescribable. Then I was admitted into Paradise where I found small (tents or) walls (made) of pearls and its earth was of musk."

    02nd Version :
    ============
    Sahih Bukharu Volume 4, Book 54, Number 429
    ---------------------------------------------------------
    Narrated Malik bin Sasaa:
    …….. Then fifty prayers were enjoined on me. I descended till I met Moses who asked me, 'What have you done?' I said, 'Fifty prayers have been enjoined on me.' He said, 'I know the people better than you, because I had the hardest experience to bring Bani Israel to obedience. Your followers cannot put up with such obligation. So, return to your Lord and request Him (to reduce the number of prayers.' I returned and requested Allah (for reduction) and He made it forty. I returned and (met Moses) and had a similar discussion, and then returned again to Allah for reduction and He made it thirty, then twenty, then ten, and then I came to Moses who repeated the same advice. Ultimately Allah reduced it to five. When I came to Moses again, he said, 'What have you done?' I said, 'Allah has made it five only.' He repeated the same advice but I said that I surrendered (to Allah's Final Order)'" Allah's Apostle was addressed by Allah, "I have decreed My Obligation and have reduced the burden on My slaves, and I shall reward a single good deed as if it were ten good deeds."

    03rd Version :
    ==========
    Shahih Bukhari , Volume 5, Book 58, Number 227
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Narrated Abbas bin Malik:
    ……….. Then the prayers were enjoined on me: They were fifty prayers a day. When I returned, I passed by Moses who asked (me), 'What have you been ordered to do?' I replied, 'I have been ordered to offer fifty prayers a day.' Moses said, 'Your followers cannot bear fifty prayers a day, and by Allah, I have tested people before you, and I have tried my level best with Bani Israel (in vain). Go back to your Lord and ask for reduction to lessen your followers' burden.' So I went back, and Allah reduced ten prayers for me. Then again I came to Moses, but he repeated the same as he had said before. Then again I went back to Allah and He reduced ten more prayers. When I came back to Moses he said the same, I went back to Allah and He ordered me to observe ten prayers a day. When I came back to Moses, he repeated the same advice, so I went back to Allah and was ordered to observe five prayers a day.
    When I came back to Moses, he said, 'What have you been ordered?' I replied, 'I have been ordered to observe five prayers a day.' He said, 'Your followers cannot bear five prayers a day, and no doubt, I have got an experience of the people before you, and I have tried my level best with Bani Israel, so go back to your Lord and ask for reduction to lessen your follower's burden.' I said, 'I have requested so much of my Lord that I feel ashamed, but I am satisfied now and surrender to Allah's Order.' When I left, I heard a voice saying, 'I have passed My Order and have lessened the burden of My Worshipers."

    04th Version :
    ===========
    Muslim Chapter 75: NIGHT JOURNEY OF THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) TO HEAVEN, AND THE PRAYER MADE OBLIGATORY

    Book 001, Number 0309
    ----------------------------------------------------

    It is narrated on the authority of Anas b. Malik that …….
    Then Allah revealed to me a revelation and He made obligatory for me fifty prayers every day and night. Then I went down to Moses (peace be upon him) and he said: What has your Lord enjoined upon your Ummah? I said: Fifty prayers. He said: Return to thy Lord and beg for reduction (in the number of prayers), for your community shallnot be able to bear this burden. as I have put to test the children of Isra'il and tried them (and found them too weak to bear such a heavy burden). He (the Holy Prophet) said: I went back to my Lord and said: My Lord, make things lighter for my Ummah. (The Lord) reduced five prayers for me. I went down to Moses and said. (The Lord) reduced five (prayers) for me, He said: Verily thy Ummah shall not be able to bear this burden; return to thy Lord and ask Him to make things lighter. I then kept going back and forth between my Lord Blessed and Exalted and Moses, till He said: There are five prayers every day and night. O Muhammad, each being credited as ten, so that makes fifty prayers. He who intends to do a good deed and does not do it will have a good deed recorded for him; and if he does it, it will be recorded for him as ten; whereas he who intends to do an evil deed and does not do, it will not be recorded for him; and if he does it, only one evil deed will be recorded. I then came down and when I came to Moses and informed him, he said: Go back to thy Lord and ask Him to make things lighter. Upon this the Messenger of Allah remarked: I returned to my Lord until I felt ashamed before Him.

    05th Version :
    ============
    Muslim Chapter 75: NIGHT JOURNEY OF THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH (MAY PEACE BE UPON HIM) TO HEAVEN, AND THE PRAYER MADE OBLIGATORY

    Book 001, Number 0313
    ----------------------------------
    Anas b. Malik reported: Abu Dharr used to relate that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said:
    ……..Ibn Hazm and Anas told that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Allah then made fifty prayers obligatory for my Ummah and I returned with that and passed by Moses. Moses, (peace be upon him) said: What has thy Lord enjoined on thy people? I said: Fifty prayers have been made obligatory on them. Moses (peace be upon him) said: Return to thy Lord, for thy Ummah would not be able to bear this burden. Then I came back to my Lord and He remitted a portion out of thut. I then again went to Moses (peace be upon him) and informed him about it He said: Return to thy Lord, for thy Ummah shall not be able to bear this burden. I then went back to my Lord and He said: They are five and at the same time fifty, and what has been said will not be changed. I then returned to Moses and he said: Go back to thy Lord. whereupon I said: I feel ashamed of my Lord. Gabriel then travelled with me till we came to the farthest lote-tree Many a colour had covered it which I do not know. Then I was admitted to Paradise and saw in it domes of pearls, and its soil of musk.


    Let us put them in a table :

    Incident ||1st Version | 2nd Version |3rd Version| 4th Version| 5th Version|| ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Prop. met GOD ||50 Salat |50 Salat | 50 Salat | 50 Salat | 50 Salat ||
    Prop. returned1||25 Salat |40 Salat | 40Salat | 45 Salat | Unknown ||
    Prop. returned2||12.5 Salat |30 Salat | 30 Salat |40 Salat | 05 Salat ||
    Prop. returned3||05 Salat |20 Salat | 10 Salat | 35 Salat | ....... ||
    Prop. returned4|| ........... |10 Salat | 05 Salat | 30 Salat | .......... ||
    Prop. returned5|| ............ |05 Salat | ............. | 25 Salat | .......... ||
    Prop. returned6|| ............ | ............ | ............ |20 Salat | ........... ||
    Prop. returned7|| ............. | ........... | .............. | 15 Salat | ........... ||
    Prop. returned8|| ............. | ........... | ............. | 10 Salat | ............ ||
    Prop. returned9|| ............ | ........... | ............. | 05 Salat | ............ ||
     
  5. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    The mythological animal that Prophet Muhammad voyaged with in space :

    Narrated Malik bin Sasaa: The Prophet said, "While I was at the House in a state midway between sleep and wakefulness, (an angel recognized me) as the man lying between two men. A golden tray full of wisdom and belief was brought to me and my body was cut open from the throat to the lower part of the abdomen and then my abdomen was washed with Zam-zam water and (my heart was) filled with wisdom and belief. Al-Buraq, a white animal, smaller than a mule and bigger than a donkey was brought to me and I set out with Gabriel. When I reached the nearest heaven. Gabriel said to the heaven gate-keeper, 'Open the gate.' The gatekeeper asked...[Sahih Al-Bukhari 4:429]

    [​IMG]
     
  6. safdar.dushantappeh

    safdar.dushantappeh simpleislam.weebly.com

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    God bless you Union for pointing this out. I was thinking about the original motivation for Mulsims to invent such stories. It seems that Muslims did not accept the fact that prophet Mohammad has no miracle other than Quran, even though Quran emphasizes on this fact many times. This probably had lead them to come up with such stories, to make prophet Mohammad look better beside miracle-full Moses and Jesus. I actually know that Muslims name this as one of the miracles of the prophet Mohammad, which is very funny since a miracle must be verifiable or at least observable by the followers.

    The miracles of the previous messengers had a expiration date, i.e., it would work only for the people who have witnessed it or may be up to a couple of generations after them if they want to trust the stories their parents tell. Prophet Mohammad was the last prophet and thus a miracle is required that is observable not only by the people of its time but also for the people of the next centuries, an Quran is such miracle. Quran explicitly challenges people to bring one chapter as miraculous as Quran's. Every human at any century could read Quran and independently decide whether he/she finds Quran miraculous or not, without needing to trust anybody's word for that.
     
  7. Draupadi

    Draupadi Active Member

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    In addition God Himself has declared in the Quran that no being has ideas of the afterlife like paradise. And stories of Miraj contradicts it by seeing that Muhammad himself had witnessed heaven and hell!
     
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  8. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    Thanks , I missed this crucial point . May GOD , the Almighty bless you .
     
  9. dias99

    dias99 New Member

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    So what/where is those farthest mosque mentioned in 17;1? Is it al aqsa? or mosque in madinah or in somewhere else?.
     
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  10. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Active Member

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    Salaams to all.
    The transliteration of the verse 17.1
    "Subhana allathee asrabiAAabdihi laylan mina almasjidi alharami ilaalmasjidi al-aqsa allathee barakna hawlahulinuriyahu min ayatina innahu huwa assameeAAualbaseer"
    English translation.
    almasjidi alharami =Sacred Mosque.
    ilaalmasjidi al-aqsa =Farthest Mosque.

    Your answer is very clear but Union i am going to play with your brains.
    Prove to us which is your Sacred Mosque and which is your Farthest Mosque.
    Salaams
     
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  11. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    At the time of revelation of the verse the mosque in Jerusalem was not existing . It was built 70 years after the demise of Prophet Muhammad . Hence historically the verse can't hint to mosque in Jerusalem .

    Masjid is a noun related to the verb Sujud , hence masjid is any place where prostration to Almighty GOD is executed - physically and mentally . If you agree that Prophet Moses is the candidate of verse 17:1 , then here is his points of journey :
    Masjidul Haram = ... Has the story of Moses reached thee? Behold, he saw a fire......Verily I am thy Lord! therefore (in My presence) put off thy shoes: thou art in the sacred valley Tuwa. [20:9-12]

    Masjidul Aqsa = Recall that Moses said to his people, "O my people, remember GOD's blessings upon you: He appointed prophets from among you, made you kings, and granted you what He never granted any other people. "O my people, enter the holy land that GOD has decreed for you, and do not rebel, lest you become losers."[5:20-21]
     
  12. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    At the time of revelation of the verse the mosque in Jerusalem was not existing . It was built 70 years after the demise of Prophet Muhammad . Hence historically the verse can't hint to mosque in Jerusalem .

    Masjid is a noun related to the verb Sujud , hence masjid is any place where prostration to Almighty GOD is executed - physically and mentally . If you agree that Prophet Moses is the candidate of verse 17:1 , then here is his points of journey :
    Masjidul Haram = ... Has the story of Moses reached thee? Behold, he saw a fire......Verily I am thy Lord! therefore (in My presence) put off thy shoes: thou art in the sacred valley Tuwa. [20:9-12]

    Masjidul Aqsa = Recall that Moses said to his people, "O my people, remember GOD's blessings upon you: He appointed prophets from among you, made you kings, and granted you what He never granted any other people. "O my people, enter the holy land that GOD has decreed for you, and do not rebel, lest you become losers."[5:20-21]
     
  13. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Active Member

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    Salaams brother Union
    According to the verse there are two different Musjids.One is Masjidul Haram and the other is Masjidul Aqsa.In the english translation
    Masjidul Haram is referred to as Sacred Mosque and Masjudul Aqsa is referred to as Farthest Mosque which simply means that they are not close by.
    Now if Masjidul Haram is in the sacred valley of Tuwa then where is its location?
    Further if Masjidul Aqsa is the place where Moses(PBBUH) asked his people to enter the holy land that Allah as decreed for them then where is its location?
    Remember you said its not Jerusalem.
    Salaams
     
  14. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    Qur'an is not a geography book . It hinted your answer and rest you link through book of science and geography . Valley of Toa is well known location for thousands of years to human kind . Hence it is redundant to think that Almighty ALLAH would reveal a book of Map to Prophet Muhammad to teach him geography .
    Almighty GOD told us " Eat Halal and Good " , you Sunni/Shia would always argue against GOD , " How we should eat - with mouth or through nose "

    I said " Not the mosque in Jerusalem" and have not said " Not Jerusalem" .
     
  15. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Active Member

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    Brother Union
    If I gave you location of valley of Tuwa and location of Masjidul Aqsa then you not going to accept it and it will lead to an argumental debate.
    Hence I need a direct answer as to location of Valey of Tuwa and Masjidul Aqsa.
    Hoping my question is not difficult to answer.
     
  16. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    Valey of Towa is in Egypt from where prophet Moses started his journey and Masjid Al Aqsa is in Israel where he finished his Isra .
     
  17. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Active Member

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    So brother Union according to you Masjidul Haram is in Egypt and Masjidul Aqsa is in present day Israel.
    Is this correct?
    Am I reading you correctly brother?
     
  18. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    Those were time of Moses ...
     
  19. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Active Member

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    Brother Union some questions.
    1.Which direction you make your salat and why do you read in that direction?
    2.Was Moses (pbbuh) in Islam or was he in another religion?
    3.Do you know the exact location of Masjidul Aqsa that's mentioned in Noble Quraan?
     
  20. Union

    Union Well-Known Member

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    To Al-Masjid Al-Haram . Qur'an instructs us to set up our Qiblah towards it , wherever we go .

    Laws of Moses are different than Laws of Muhammad . Briefly Laws of Jews vs Muslim are different .

    It is a land and not a brick structure ..
     
    #20 Union, Sep 8, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2016
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