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Featured Who are the legs and feet?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Teritos, Apr 8, 2021 at 11:07 AM.

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  1. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    I believe it is the Islamic Caliphate. Others believe it is the Roman Empire. Which kingdom do you think it is?
    The stone is Jesus, all Christians agree on that.
    [​IMG]
     
  2. The Hammer

    The Hammer White Wolf - kvite ulfh
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    What does this even mean ?
     
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  3. Conscious thoughts

    Conscious thoughts Veteran Member

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    Islam is the legs and feet of what?
     
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  4. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    I am Christian, and I - along with millions of Christians, do not believe the stone is Jesus.
    The Bible does not say that.

    Read the prophecy again. The stone is the Kingdom of God.
    (Daniel 2:44, 45) 44 “In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever, 45 just as you saw that out of the mountain a stone was cut not by hands, and that it crushed the iron, the copper, the clay, the silver, and the gold. The Grand God has made known to the king what will happen in the future. The dream is true, and its interpretation is trustworthy.”

    Jesus is the king but he does not rule alone.
    (Genesis 49:10) The scepter will not depart from Judah, neither the commander’s staff from between his feet, until Shiloh comes, and to him the obedience of the peoples will belong.

    (Daniel 7:27) “‘And the kingdom and the rulership and the grandeur of the kingdoms under all the heavens were given to the people who are the holy ones of the Supreme One. Their kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all rulerships will serve and obey them.’

    (Psalm 2:6) Saying: “I myself have installed my king On Zion, my holy mountain.”

    (Matthew 6:10) Let your Kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, also on earth.

    (Luke 12:32) “Have no fear, little flock, for your Father has approved of giving you the Kingdom.

    (Luke 22:28-30) “However, you are the ones who have stuck with me in my trials; and I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom, so that you may eat and drink at my table in my Kingdom, and sit on thrones to judge the 12 tribes of Israel.

    (2 Timothy 2:12) if we go on enduring, we will also rule together as kings; if we deny, he will also deny us;

    (Hebrews 12:28) Therefore, seeing that we are to receive a Kingdom that cannot be shaken, let us continue to receive undeserved kindness, through which we may acceptably offer God sacred service with godly fear and awe.

    (James 2:5) Listen, my beloved brothers. Did not God choose those who are poor from the world’s standpoint to be rich in faith and heirs of the Kingdom, which he promised to those who love him?

    (John 18:36) Jesus answered: “My Kingdom is no part of this world. If my Kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be handed over to the Jews. But as it is, my Kingdom is not from this source.”

    (Revelation 11:15) The seventh angel blew his trumpet. And there were loud voices in heaven, saying: “The kingdom of the world has become the Kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ, and he will rule as king forever and ever.”

    (Revelation 20:6) Happy and holy is anyone having part in the first resurrection; over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ, and they will rule as kings with him for the 1,000 years.

    (Revelation 1:6) and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might forever. Amen.

    (Revelation 5:9, 10) And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

    Where did you read that the stone is Jesus? Which scripture says that?
    What is the basis for you believing that the legs refer to the Islamic Caliphate? What scriptures lead you to assume that?
     
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  5. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    I might be able to help. What does the post mean, or what does the prophecy mean?
    The prophecy is found at Daniel 2, where the King of Babylon is given a dream, and Daniel is given its interpretation, which he there wrote down. He says it is a prophecy where God reveals what is to take place from the Dynasty of Babylon - more specifically its fall - onward into the future.
     
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  6. The Hammer

    The Hammer White Wolf - kvite ulfh
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    Didn't know it was a reference to a prophecy. That seems to be the part I was missing. I couldn't make heads or tails of what the post was getting st because of that. :p
     
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  7. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    It figured. that's why I offered to help out. ;)
    I think sometimes we assume everyone knows what we are talking about, even when we do not say. :(
     
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  8. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    Could mean a combination of the two?
     
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  9. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    Oh man. Okay okay, and now please leave me alone.
     
    #9 Teritos, Apr 8, 2021 at 12:28 PM
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 2:01 PM
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  10. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    The Bible shows that Rome is the legs of iron. How so?
    (Daniel 2:40) “As for the fourth kingdom, it will be strong like iron. For just as iron crushes and pulverizes everything else, yes, like iron that shatters, it will crush and shatter all of these.

    (Revelation 17:9-11) 9 “This calls for a mind that has wisdom: The seven heads mean seven mountains, where the woman sits on top. 10 And there are seven kings: Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet arrived; but when he does arrive, he must remain a short while. 11 And the wild beast that was but is not, it is also an eighth king, but it springs from the seven, and it goes off into destruction.

    During John's time, Rome was in power.
    Five Kings had fallen - Egypt ; Assyria ; Babylon ; Media Persia ; Greece.
    Five world powers that had direct connection or opposition to God's people Israel.

    Rome was also against God's people - both the Jews, and Christians.

    Showing no respect for God’s Kingdom proclaimed by Jesus Christ, it put him to death on a torture stake in 33 C.E. In an effort to shatter true Christianity, Rome persecuted Jesus’ disciples.

    Romans crushed and destroyed Jerusalem and its temple in 70 C.E.

    True to the prophecy, Rome conquered Greece.
    Battle of Corinth (146 BC) - Wikipedia
    Greece in the Roman era - Wikipedia

    More Details.

    Evidence from both the Bible, and history, is confirmation that Rome is the legs of iron.
    Rome was one of the most powerful world powers - conquering and crushing like iron.

    [​IMG]

    31-305 A.D.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    #10 nPeace, Apr 8, 2021 at 12:52 PM
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 1:59 PM
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  11. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    No
    Besides you created a thread on a public forum. i am responding to it. It bothers you. Too bad. You'd have to not create any thread, or respond to any, if you don't want certain people versed in the Bible to respond @Teritos.
     
    #11 nPeace, Apr 8, 2021 at 12:52 PM
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 12:59 PM
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  12. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    My reasons why it is the Islamic Caliphate and not Rome:

    Reason 1: On the holy place where the temple of God stood, there is now a mosque. (2 Thessalonians 2:4)
    Reason 2: God said that all kingdoms will include the kingdom of Nebuchadnezzar, this dream is about him and his kingdom. Rome never actually conquered and occupied Babylon(Iraq). But the Islamic Caliphate did.
    Reason 3: Daniel said that all kingdoms will be demolished by the fourth kingdom. Rome never did that, they were even partly kind and for example let the Jews live out their culture. But the Islamic Caliphate came and destroyed everything and made people accept their religion.
    Reason 4: The fourth kingdom will be a monotheistic kingdom according to Daniel 11. It will not accept any god except the "god of the Fortresses", which is a very big proof that it can only be the Islamic Caliphate. The Romans didn't really have anything to do with religion.
    Reason 5: All the kingdoms that will fight against Israel, mentioned in Ezekiel and in the Psalms, are in North Africa, East Africa and the Middle East, all these areas are Islamic.
     
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  13. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Yup. Looking at the picture I had zero idea what it referred to and the text accompanying the picture made no sense at all to me.
     
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  14. Teritos

    Teritos Active Member

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    Also the greatest proof that it cannot be the Roman empire, Daniel said that the fourth kingdom will demolish all the kingdoms before it. Rome never conquered nor occupied Medo-Persia(Iran)!!!! Only the Islamic Caliphate did conquered all three Kingdoms!
     
  15. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    What does that have to do with Daniel 2?

    (Daniel 2:39-43) 39 “But after you another kingdom will rise, inferior to you; then another kingdom, a third one, of copper, that will rule over the whole earth. 40 “As for the fourth kingdom, it will be strong like iron. For just as iron crushes and pulverizes everything else, yes, like iron that shatters, it will crush and shatter all of these. 41 “And just as you saw the feet and the toes to be partly of clay of a potter and partly of iron, the kingdom will be divided, but some of the hardness of iron will be in it, just as you saw the iron mixed with soft clay. 42 And as the toes of the feet were partly of iron and partly of clay, so the kingdom will be partly strong and partly fragile. 43 Just as you saw iron mixed with soft clay, they will be mixed with the people; but they will not stick together, one to the other, just as iron does not mix with clay.

    Now compare it to this other prophecy...
    (Daniel 5:22-28) 22 “But you, his son Belshazzar, have not humbled your heart, although you knew all of this. 23 Instead, you exalted yourself against the Lord of the heavens, and you had them bring you the vessels of his house. Then you and your nobles, your concubines and your secondary wives drank wine from them and praised gods of silver and gold, of copper, iron, wood, and stone, gods that see nothing and hear nothing and know nothing. But you have not glorified the God in whose hand is your breath and all your ways. 24 So the hand was sent from him, and this writing was inscribed. 25And this is the writing that was inscribed: MEʹNE, MEʹNE, TEʹKEL, and PARʹSIN. 26“This is the interpretation of the words: MEʹNE, God has numbered the days of your kingdom and brought it to an end. 27“TEʹKEL, you have been weighed in the balances and found lacking. 28“PEʹRES, your kingdom has been divided and given to the Medes and the Persians.”

    Now this one...
    (Daniel 8:20-22) 20 “The two-horned ram that you saw stands for the kings of Media and Persia. 21 The hairy male goat stands for the king of Greece; and the great horn that was between its eyes stands for the first king. 22 As for the horn that was broken, so that four stood up instead of it, there are four kingdoms from his nation that will stand up, but not with his power.

    God is the one prophesying. He give the interpretation.
    Babylon would be conquered by the Medes and Persians, he says.
    Media and Persia would be conquered by Greece.
    Then Greece would be conquered by an iron like ruling power.
    All fingers point to Rome.
    (Daniel 7:19) “Then I wanted to know more about the fourth beast, which was different from all the others; it was extraordinarily fearsome, with iron teeth and copper claws, and it was devouring and crushing, and trampling down what was left with its feet;

    Did the Islamic Caliphate destroy everything, including Media Persia, and Babylon?
    No it did not.
    Where did you read that?
    Please provide a source for that claim.

    (Daniel 2:39) . . .“But after you another kingdom will rise, inferior to you; then another kingdom, a third one, of copper, that will rule over the whole earth.
    Does this mean that Media Persia ruled the whole earth? No. How are we reading... Is it with understanding?

    Which verses in Daniel 11 are you referring to?
    There it describes the Grecian world power, and Persia.
    I don't know what part you are looking at.

    Please be specific with your mention of the Bible books. They are big books, with a lot of writing.
    Just saying Ezekiel says this, and Psalms says that, is not useful to anyone, and is not offering support to your claims.
     
    #15 nPeace, Apr 8, 2021 at 1:31 PM
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 2:03 PM
  16. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg One Planet One People Please
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    The Caliphate was indeed the beast as recorded in the Bible that John saw "rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy."

    This was the 7 kingdoms and ten rulers of the Caliphate that subdued and ruled Islam as the spiritual head until the year 1260.

    It may be fun to explore this prophecy, with you, in the light of what was offered by the Bab and Baha'u'llah, as they have shown how Islam was indeed mentioned in detail, in the Bible.

    Only If you want to.

    Regards Tony
     
  17. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    This is the way it looks from scriptures in the Bible.
    [​IMG]

    If you want to, we can look at them again - personal, opinion aside.
     
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  18. nPeace

    nPeace Well-Known Member

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    Of course I want to. :)
    I know you were not speaking to me, but I would like to be a part of this.
    Can i inquire as to why you believe the Bab and Baha'u'llah would be correct as opposed to a Christian - follower of Christ?
     
  19. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg One Planet One People Please
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    It is the Caliphate that also rejected the return of Christ, put the Bab to death, who was Elijah in this age and Banished Baha'u'llah as per Prophecy so the Glory of God came to Israel and set up the Kingdom, the New Jerusalem on top of Mount Carmel, where the law now goes out from Zion.

    I am amazed why people do not wonder why, or are not excited by the fact that the Holy land now has another peaceful faith that teaches the Oneness of Humanity, the Oneness of God's Messengers and that there is only One God.

    All Prophecy of the Bible has given us this day, the Day of God where the Father is with us.

    That's what I have come to accept anyway, others are free to try to fulfil prophecy in other ways.

    Regards Tony
     
    #19 Tony Bristow-Stagg, Apr 8, 2021 at 1:57 PM
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021 at 2:02 PM
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  20. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    I good with up to 6,,, 7 & 8 are still being argued... (as we can see :) )
     
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