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Which day?

Discussion in 'Bibliology DIR' started by wmam, Oct 17, 2005.

  1. Aqualung

    Aqualung Tasty

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    No, I don't think it was. I'm pretty sure they weren't called Christian. Christian was primarily used as a derogatory term for a while.
     
  2. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    Derogatory? How's that? And if so, how did something that was meant derogatory at one instance be anything different in the next? I'm truly trying to understand. Please don't take my feable attempt to find the right words in my questions to sound as though I am being a smarty pants. I am only trying to ask as many questions as I can about the subject to further my own understanding and that of others that may be so inclined as to keep up with this thread. You, my friend, are only a piece of the greater picture with helping me and others achieve said goal of knowledge and wisdom. Please continue to shower me with your thoughts, feelings and beliefs. :)
     
  3. Aqualung

    Aqualung Tasty

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    I don't know why it was derogatory, but I'm pretty sure reading somewhere (sorry I can't be more specific) that the name christian was applied to them in a derrogatory fashion. The same is actually true for the name "mormon" as well. Latter Day Saints were given that name as sort of a put-down, but it just stuck.
     
  4. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    It seems that many words and names have been accepted and changed to mean different than what they were first intended of the centuries. I found such research that the name Christian and Christ as well as God and Jesus were all derived from Pagan Deity's. I'm just not at all ready to accept a name that is far from what was intended to be and wasn't used by the Disciples themselves, or even others close to them, to explain what their beliefs are. I guess you could say I am being a Purist where as I believe that those that follow the Word along with the way the Word was taught by YAHshua, the Anointed, should be pure in what they call themselves and do the pure things as that of the Disciples without having any of the outside influences having anything to do with what you do and what you believe.

    I'm still researching though.:)
     
  5. may

    may Well-Known Member

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    It was Thursday evening, March 31, 33 C.E., Jesus Christ and his apostles had just concluded the Passover celebration.

    Jesus both instituted the Memorial of his death and died on what was the most significant date in Jewish history, the fourteenth day of the first month of their religious lunar year, Nisan

    Jesus died on Friday afternoon, April 1. Because the days of the Jewish calendar ran from the evening of one day to that of the next, both the Lord’s Evening Meal and the death of Jesus Christ took place on the same day—Nisan 14, 33 C.E.

    Jesus died on the same Jewish calendar day that he instituted the Memorial.

    It is about three o’clock Friday afternoon when he died

     
  6. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    O.k......... I would love for you to explain how you came up with an exact date but for the sake of the answer of the first question I'll let it go to the next and ask if the last supper was also the passover meal then why do we not hear where any of the passover things are done. I mean we are to follow and observe the passover a certain way and I don't see that reading about the last supper. :confused:


    So if I am understanding you correctly.......... You are stating that He ate the passover meal and died all on the same day...... the 14th of Abib?

    Well ...... I guess one could say that He said He would arise in 3 days or on the third day and have no mention of exactly 72 hours. If it were to be 72 hours then by your count of death at 3 on a Friday then that would put it at about 3 on a Monday.

    Also with what you have stated, you have put the passover observance a day ahead of schedule. Scripture states that you are to kill the lamb on the 14th at evening which in some circles could have been as much as 3 hours before sunset. See some say that evening can be up to 3 hours before and 3 hours after sunset so the passover lamb would have been killed and prepared and cooked in this time period so that it could have been eaten in haste and night which would have been the 15th of Abib which is also the First Day of Unleaven Bread which is a High Holy Day or a High Holy Shabbat. So now we have Jews running through the streets asking to crucify men on one of the most Holiest days that they observe? I thought it was said that they didn't want to take Him on the Holy Day because it would or might stir up to much unrest? Wouldn't it have been better to have had the Last Supper as just that.......... A Supper.......... and it occurred the evening before? Look at it this way......... The beginning of the 14th Last Supper. At or about 3 in the afternoon (9th hour) beginning of the evening and also time to slaughter the Passover Lambs (As well as YAHshua, the Anointed). Then they had to get him buried before sunset because it was the First Day Of Unleavened Bread which was a High Holy Shabbat. Some Scriptures say that it was a Sabbath and it was a special one which I believe was referring to it being a High Holy Shabbat and not just a weekly Shabbat. Now here is where it gets tricky for me........ I also read where it was decided to put a guard on the tomb and to seal it off. Was this done on a High Holy Day? That would have been work and even though it was the Romans who did it it was Jews that requested it and I am wondering if they would have asked for others to sin even if they were Gentiles? No work to be done on such a day so then lets say they no they wouldn't have done that so when was it done? I then look at the possibility of all this starting on a evening between a Tuesday and a Wednesday were the Last Supper was completed and after which into the night walking through the garden and being taken and questioned as well as scourged after day light broke and onward into the afternoon to the death on or about 3 or as is said the 9th hour and all this being done on the 14th of Abib. Day one is from this time to 3 in the afternoon of The First Day Of Unleavened Bread. Day two would have been from that time to 3 in the afternoon on the second day of Unleavened Bread which was not a High Holy Shabbat and one could work just not eat leaven, This is the time I believe that the guards were asked for and put to seal up the tomb as well as guard against anyone removing the body. Day three would have been the weekly Shabbat were no one would have worked nor went anywhere so He arose on or about 3 in that afternoon and it wasn't until daybreak of the next day which was the first day of the week when it was found out that He was already gone. Or maybe I'm wrong. :bonk:
     
  7. may

    may Well-Known Member

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    Time of his death. The death of Jesus Christ took place in the spring, on the Passover Day, Nisan (or Abib) 14, according to the Jewish calendar. (Mt 26:2; Joh 13:1-3; Ex 12:1-6; 13:4) That year the Passover occurred on the sixth day of the week (counted by the Jews as from sundown on Thursday to sundown on Friday). This is evident from John 19:31, which shows that the following day was "a great" sabbath. The day after Passover was always a sabbath, no matter on what day of the week it came. (Le 23:5-7) But when this special Sabbath coincided with the regular Sabbath (the seventh day of the week), it became "a great one." So Jesus’ death took place on Friday, Nisan 14, by about 3:00 p.m.—Lu 23:44-46.

     
  8. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    O.k. ...... I follow you. But...... For this to have worked out this way the Last Supper couldn't have been the Passover meal.
     
  9. may

    may Well-Known Member

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    since the Jews reckoned the day as starting after sundown and ending the next day at sundown, Nisan 14 would begin after sundown. It would be in the evening after Nisan 13 concluded that the Passover would be observed.

     
  10. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    So your saying that they waited until after sunset until they started preparing the lamb? That would entail killing it and fileting it to cooking it all to also be eaten at night?
     
  11. may

    may Well-Known Member

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    Nisan 13, people are busy making final arrangements for the Passover. Early in the afternoon, Jesus sends Peter and John to prepare the Passover for them in an upper room in Jerusalem. (Mark 14:12-16; Luke 22:8) A little before sundown, Jesus and the other ten apostles meet them there for their last Passover celebration.

     
  12. joeboonda

    joeboonda Well-Known Member

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    Well, from what I gather from the scriptures, and I use KJV, Jesus died on Friday, he was nailed to the cross about 9a.m. (the 3rd hr.),and died 6 hours later at 3p.m. (the ninth hr.),and rose again on Sunday morning. There was darkness over the land form noon til 3 according to Matt 27:45. According to Matt 28:1 Jesus rose on the first day of the week, Sunday, Saturday being the last day of the week or the sabbath.
     
  13. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    Now I am really confused. :confused:

    I can't find anywhere in the KJV where anyone prepared anything on the 13th of Abib. Now I will give you as such as far as searching out leaven and getting rid of it before the 14th but as far as preparing the lamb it was told to wait until the 14th at evening. Some translations say between the evenings, hence my stating the possibility of death occuring at 3 on the 14th. But this would make the Last Supper just that, a supper.
     
  14. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    So you also don't believe in a full 72 hour period but rather just a period within a three day series?
     
  15. joeboonda

    joeboonda Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I believe in what the Holy Bible says happened in the four gospels. He died on friday and rose Sunday morning, thus the early church, that was made up of Jewish christians in Jerusalem began meeting together and bringing their offerings on the first day of the week which is Sunday. I dont try to fit the events of Jesus' death, burial, and ressurection into a formulated set of rituals that had to be done in some exact certain way or it didn't work. He kinda came to do away with all of that, he being the one sacrifice once, for all of us. The main thing is to trust in what he did on that cross as payment for our sins and turn from our way of obtaining eternal life, to God's way that he said, in Isaiah 53 that he was satisfied with the payment. Jesus paid for our sins and offers salvation as a free gift to all who will believe in or trust in him, that he is the lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world.
     
  16. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    Oh so there's no such thing as sin anymore?
     
  17. joeboonda

    joeboonda Well-Known Member

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    Er, did I say that? Did not mean to imply that there is no sin anymore, what I am saying is that there IS sin and that is why Jesus died, to take away, that is to forgive our sins, to pay for them, to remove them as far as the east from the west, and to cover us in his righteousness so that we may be able to live in God's Holy presence in the hereafter.
     
  18. wmam

    wmam Active Member

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    If He takes away the sin then how is there still sin?
     
  19. may

    may Well-Known Member

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    LUKE 22; 7-8..............Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed.
    8And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat. KJV
    Now on the first day of unfermented cakes, when they customarily sacrificed the passover [victim], his disciples said to him: "Where do you want us to go and prepare for you to eat the passover?" 13 With that he sent forth two of his disciples and said to them: "Go into the city, and a man carrying an earthenware vessel of water will encounter YOU. Follow him, 14 and wherever he goes inside say to the householder, ‘The Teacher says: "Where is the guest room for me where I may eat the passover with my disciples?"’ 15 And he will show YOU a large upper room, furnished in preparation; and there prepare for us." 16 So the disciples went out, and they entered the city and found it just as he said to them; and they prepared for the passover... Mark 14;12-16




    (Matthew 26:19) And the disciples did as Jesus ordered them, and they got things ready for the passover.





    (Luke 22:13) So they departed and found it just as he had said to them, and they got the passover ready.

     
  20. paultildsley

    paultildsley New Member

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    if jesus took away our sins, do you believe it is wrong for us, by us i mean the state or goverment we are controlled by, to force are religious man to face a jury of his peers for a crime he has committed, then to be sentenced for his crimes?
     
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