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Featured What's Broken?

Discussion in 'Interfaith Discussion' started by SalixIncendium, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium Resident Hermit
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    It is the theme of many world religions that the human being arrives upon this earth somehow flawed, imperfect, or broken, or becomes so early in life, and that the purpose of the human's mundane existence is to work toward perfecting itself.

    In your belief, what is broken and needs fixing? What must you do to go about fixing and perfecting yourself and/or others? To what end?
     
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  2. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    It could have been the catalyst for our innovative tendencies from the get go... The notion that things need fixing... or "improvement".
     
  3. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    In the Xian religion, the human being arrives upon this earth perfect for its existence upon the earth--with an overwhelming selfishness that fuels the survival instinct. God saw His creation, and declared it to be good.

    However, being perfect for existence on earth is incompatible for existence in the presence of God, Whose nature is love--the opposite of selfishness. The purpose of our mundane existence is to experience temporary physical life. God's purpose is to prepare as many souls as possible to experience eternal spiritual life, by substituting His nature (Christ's nature) of love for our own nature of selfishness.

    I don't see anything "broken" with the system.
     
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  4. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    Personally, as someone who is lapsed in their faith, having stumbled upon a point of personal progressive gridlock, being 15 years within my career, having had 4 children with no desire to go farther in either of those areas, I have refined my goals to observation for the time being.

    I've seemingly turned to comfort, relaxation and just the 'taking in of the world' around me for the time being. Not sure how long I'll live, but my intentions are for this to be a temporary period, where later, I will return to working towards bettering myself again.

    My mood in my early 40's as "observer":
     
    #4 Landon Caeli, Nov 25, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
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  5. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    In my belief ... Nothing is broken. Nothing needs fixing. Is the fruit tree that doesn't bear fruit broken? Is a child who has yet to mature enough to be reasonable broken?
     
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  6. Vee

    Vee Active Member
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    We are imperfect and we can't fix that on our own. We can't wake up one day and say, "from now on I'm going to be perfect", but an understanding of our limitations and a genuine effort can take us a long way. Someone who strives to be honest, kind, respectful and generous is already doing something to be "less broken".
     
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  7. YmirGF

    YmirGF Bodhisattva

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    In my view it's not about attaining some magical perfection state. It's about accruing experience in areas that you personally have interest. Anyone who has any inkling about the human condition would quickly realize that no one is perfect, but that doesn't mean we cannot strive towards positive goals, for better understanding, for better appreciation, for a better life. (If one does not think life can get any better - they are not trying very hard.)

    In regards to the "broken" and "fix" aspect of this, I do not see us as broken or even in need of fixing (in many cases). Most of our troubles arise from not understanding how our very actions affect resulting outcomes. Mindfulness is extremely helpful to buffer this, but even it is not perfect, nor is it foolproof.
     
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  8. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    It's not what's "broken" it's what's MISSING. Our egos have no governor. We think we are gods, or supposed to be gods, and that the entire world and everyone in it is supposed to be serving us in whatever manner we desire. Then, when this does not happen, we set about "correcting it". And the harder we try to make everything around us serve our will and desires, the more we screw things up and make things worse. And it all becomes a self-perpetuating disaster.

    We don't live WITH our world, and each other, we live OFF of them, like parasites. And I believe the reason is that our egos have no governor.
     
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  9. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli What's your stoyle?

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    That's why we take time to observe, and appreciate all the things in the world around us. If God looked back at his creation and was pleased with it, then maybe that's an important idea.
     
  10. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Well-Known Member
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    Fallible humans are created naturally as is, and advancement and evolution of the soul in the spiritual journey in this world and the other worlds beyond this world.
     
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  11. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Riboflavin
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    In the religious context, I think this is about marketing: in order to sell you the product, they have to sell you on the need for the product.
     
  12. sun rise

    sun rise "Let there be peace and love among all"
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    I subscribe to the paradox that nothing is broken but that we're perfectible. To that end, we're invited to try to live up to our best understanding of what we're called upon to do.
     
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  13. joe1776

    joe1776 Well-Known Member

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    I think our brains are training us to make moral progress, to become better human beings. They do this by the reward and punishment method.

    We are warned if we are considering doing something immoral by an unpleasant feeling of wrongness that emerges from our unconscious mind. If we ignore the guidance and commit the act, we are nagged with guilt whenever we remember our offense for a lifetime.

    On the plus side, we are rewarded with a good feeling whenever we do something especially kind for others. So, I think making moral progress is what life is all about.

    Besides, I can't think of anything better to do.
     
  14. spirit_of_dawn

    spirit_of_dawn Active Member

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    We are not born broken, at least from a Shia Islamic point of view. Our duty on this earth is to recognize God and worship hi, however, due to our misdeeds we break ourselves.
     
  15. Valjean

    Valjean Veteran Member
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    Not broken, but undeveloped; inchoate. Our senses and awareness are limited to the point of abstraction.
     
  16. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta and Spiritualist and Pantheist
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    The end is to produce eternal spiritual peace and happiness unconditioned by events of the material plane. This is not the natural state of consciousness that we come into life with.

    It is this Liberation/Moksha/Nirvana that my religion has us strive towards.
     
  17. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I believe that we, each of us, are mentally deluted. We are attached to our identities and assuming these emotions, past experiences, likes and dislikes, etc, are ours rather than existing isolated. These things bring suffering or, I guess, a distraction because we cant die with these things. So, basically, the goal is to realize we arent what we believe, feel, and say, and find a balance of living these things without personfying them as ourselves rather than something we externally interact with.

    Some people have it stronger than others. The way out is basically meditation, reflection, giving, and gratitude among other things. What we do and say affects our future; and, if we want to have a future without suffering, we change our behavior and address our emotions and outlook.

    It doesnt mean get rid of everything altogether. Monks and nuns do but it isnt required of lay followers. What we also do, as lay followers, help monastics and follow The Dharma as best we can. There are guidelines for monastics and different ones for lay people.

    In some lineages we arent inheritedly broken. We are just covered with mess* that we dont see our own nature/our potiential to be buddhas.

    I know theravadans dont believe in buddha nature as defined by mahayana traditions. But they do believe we have dellusions and goal to end suffering via our actions and compassion for others.
     
  18. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    I agree. Sometimes termed a perfect state of evolution.
     
  19. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    It is obvious to me that the world....i.e. human beings and their selfish thinking, along with their impact on this planet, its wildlife, and each other is devastating. Politically, commercially and religiously, the world is seeing more disunity than ever before. Humans seem totally inept at recognising what is causing the problem....THEM.

    I see the Bible's explanation as the only logical one for me. The Creator originally make everything 'perfect'....we have a collective expectation to live in that perfection, but something went horribly wrong. So how did reality shift so far from the perfection we expect in ourselves, in nature and each other? Aren't we all living in a state of constant disappointment over all of it? Who is truly happy any more?

    Creating humans alone "in his image" gave them all the moral qualities that the Creator has...including free will. They were, after all, assigned to be the caretakers of this planet, so as God's representatives, they would need to make decisions....lots of them. But the exercise of free will was not absolute....it obviously needed to be exercised within boundaries that did not allow it to impede the free will of others. Humans were given dominion over the animal kingdom, but not over each other. They were to be ruled by the Creator himself. They alone had to follow his rules in the exercise of their assignment.

    Having no capacity for self rule meant that assuming power over others would obviously lead humans into conflict with others, as a battle of wills was inevitable as selfishness would dominate their thinking. Unfortunately, as the Bible tells the story, humans were led to go down that path, so the Creator allowed them ample time, with little intervention, to see where that would take them....and here we are. Everything is broken. Humans are powerless to fix what they have done....selfishness has dictated all their actions....and continue to do so to this day.

    The Creator was always going to rein it all in at the end of the allotted time, with lessons learned, and free will remaining as the gift it was meant to be. So this whole mess is exactly what God knew would happen, but the only way to get the message across to us, was to allow us to experience our own ineptitude at self determination. We now have a record to act as a precedent for all time to come. No human will ever be able to say to God...."but you didn't let us try this...." He has allowed them to try everything. All we have proven is that we can't rule ourselves without him.

    That is what makes sense to me.
     
  20. WalterTrull

    WalterTrull Godfella

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    Nuttin'
     
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