What would you expect people to do if a real God sent a real Messenger to earth?

[Trailblazer]

I have absolutely zero respect for any being who cannot manage to be convincing directly.

That is a consequence of this being supposedly being All Powerful-- and more-- All Knowing.

It would automatically know that using a silly, ancient message is pretty worthless-- unless it's deliberate intent was to NOT BE CONVINCING.

If that is the case? It worked.

That’s fine. God does not need your respect. God does not need anything from humans.

God is not trying to be convincing or to not be convincing. God is totally neutral on the subject.
If God convinced you it would not be your choice. God wants everyone to use their own free will and choose to believe or not.

“Your Lord, the God of mercy, can well dispense with all creatures. Nothing whatever can either increase or diminish the things He doth possess. If ye believe, to your own behoof will ye believe; and if ye believe not, ye yourselves will suffer.” Gleanings, p. 148

“He who shall accept and believe, shall receive his reward; and he who shall turn away, shall receive none other than his own punishment.” Gleanings, p. 339

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

God does not want to give cookies to everyone.

God only does what God wants to do. That comes with being All-Powerful. If people don't like that they are bad candidates for belief in God.

So you believe in a capricious, Special-Favorite doing, teacher's pet using, arbitrary and patently UNFAIR deity?

Well, yeah. We already got that message. And it's a very ugly one-- NOT something you want to see in a deity.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

Sure, people are dropping out of Christianity in Europe and America because rational educated people can no longer believe in the superstitious doctrines of the church. That accounts for a lot of atheists.

It is also true that younger people are likely to be non-religious, but that says nothing about belief in God. Atheism is declining, but belief in God is not declining as more and more people find ways to believe in God with no religion at all.

I will happily TAKE that as a Positive Trend: leaving behind organized religion typically means the belief in god ends at that generation.

Without the powerful and time-tested indoctrination machine that has kept organized religion going for the past thousand years or so?

It'll fade out to insignificance.

When was the last time we saw a group of Druids protesting the cutting down of oak trees? And if we did witness that, did it have much of an impact?

Now, don't get me wrong--- as an atheist, I have more respect for Druids than I have for most religions, for many of the versions I've looked into, recognize that without the Sun, there would be no Life on Earth.

And that is a very logical observation, which also happens to be true.

But nobody passes discriminating laws against specific groups of humans, based on the teachings of Druidism, do they?

And that's all I ask: Leave religious laws out of Government, please.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

That’s fine. God does not need your respect. God does not need anything from humans.

God is not trying to be convincing or to not be convincing. God is totally neutral on the subject.
If God convinced you it would not be your choice. God wants everyone to use their own free will and choose to believe or not.

“Your Lord, the God of mercy, can well dispense with all creatures. Nothing whatever can either increase or diminish the things He doth possess. If ye believe, to your own behoof will ye believe; and if ye believe not, ye yourselves will suffer.” Gleanings, p. 148

“He who shall accept and believe, shall receive his reward; and he who shall turn away, shall receive none other than his own punishment.” Gleanings, p. 339

Again, a very capricious, Favorite-Making, Special Teacher's Pet Using, IMMORAL and EVIL deity.

And you are quite wrong: if your god truly did not give a rat's patoot if people believe or no?

WHY DID IT CREATE SPECIAL FAVORITES IN THE FIRST PLACE?

That absolutely destroys your claim, above, and pretty much negates it.

 

[England my lionheart]

What would you expect people to do if a real God sent a real Messenger to earth?

This is a hypothetical question and it is mostly directed at nonbelievers.
Believers can answer this too if they want to.

I have a specific reason for asking this but I want to leave it open-ended for now.

There's many problems with this which I'm sure others have would have pointed out, my question would be why would an all powerful god need a messenger in the first place, even the Queen of England can broadcast to a nation.

There is also the question of suffering, in Africa and some of the most underprivileged places in the world are also the most religious and the devout following of those religions is having a negative impact on not just their lives but everyone's.

What I would expect,I can't see the god messenger thing happening because its a faith thing.

 

[Trailblazer]

I will happily TAKE that as a Positive Trend: leaving behind organized religion typically means the belief in god ends at that generation.

Without the powerful and time-tested indoctrination machine that has kept organized religion going for the past thousand years or so?

It'll fade out to insignificance.

Yes, the older organized religions like Judaism and Christianity will eventually fade out to insignificance, after everyone recognizes Baha’u’llah.

Isaiah 11:6-9 “The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.”

What this means to a Baha’i is that In the future diverse religions and races will become comrades, friends and companions. The contentions of races, the differences of religions, and the barriers between nations will be completely removed, and all will attain perfect union and reconciliation.

Eventually, there will be only one religion, the religion of God.“for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea” means that everyone will believe in God. There will only be one religion, the religion of God.

And that's all I ask: Leave religious laws out of Government, please.

No worries, Baha’is are not allowed to get involved in politics, except to vote. We cannot be in a member of any political party or run for office.

 

[Trailblazer]

And you are quite wrong: if your god truly did not give a rat's patoot if people believe or no?

WHY DID IT CREATE SPECIAL FAVORITES IN THE FIRST PLACE?

That absolutely destroys your claim, above, and pretty much negates it.

God does not need our belief but God would like people to believe in Him for their own sake but God will never override human free will to make people believe in Him.

That is one reason God uses Messengers, so we can choose to believe in them or not.

The other reason God uses Messengers is because they never fail to get the necessary work done for God because they have the capacity and they are willing to sacrifice everything for the Cause of God.

I hope that straightens this out.

 

[Trailblazer]

There's many problems with this which I'm sure others have would have pointed out, my question would be why would an all powerful god need a messenger in the first place, even the Queen of England can broadcast to a nation.

I never said that the God needed a Messenger. I said the God uses a Messenger.

Can you think of another way that God could convey the 15,000 Tablets that were written by Baha’u’llah to ALL of humanity, such that everyone in the world would have access to all that information?

There is also the question of suffering, in Africa and some of the most underprivileged places in the world are also the most religious and the devout following of those religions is having a negative impact on not just their lives but everyone's.

I do realize that religion can have a negative impact on society, especially when people are following religions that are no longer the religion of God, but rather the religion of man, since man has tampered with them so much and changed their original messages. But more than anything, these older religions are not pertinent to this new day in history, so it is like trying to make a car run with no gas. It just won't work.

What I would expect, I can't see the god messenger thing happening because its a faith thing.

In other words, you don’t think many people would believe in the messenger even if he was sent by God because they would need to have faith.

 

[England my lionheart]

I never said that the God needed a Messenger. I said the God uses a Messenger.

Can you think of another way that God could convey the 15,000 Tablets that were written by Baha’u’llah to ALL of humanity, such that everyone in the world would have access to all that information?

I do realize that religion can have a negative impact on society, especially when people are following religions that are no longer the religion of God, but rather the religion of man, since man has tampered with them so much and changed their original messages. But more than anything, these older religions are not pertinent to this new day in history, so it is like trying to make a car run with no gas. It just won't work.

In other words, you don’t think many people would believe in the messenger even if he was sent by God because they would need to have faith.

In a nutshell it is faith because there is no proof, anyone can claim to be a prophet or messenger nobody has ever proven they are.

 

[Trailblazer]

In a nutshell it is faith because there is no proof, anyone can claim to be a prophet or messenger nobody has ever proven they are.

Just because it cannot be proven does not mean someone is not a Messenger of God. A real Messenger of God is going to provide good evidence that He is a Messenger, not just a claim.

True, anyone can claim that, but it cannot be proven... Some faith is necessary to believe that, but it can be a reason-based faith, if there is a good reason to believe it.

 

[England my lionheart]

Just because it cannot be proven does not mean someone is not a Messenger of God. A real Messenger of God is going to provide good evidence that He is a Messenger, not just a claim.

So how can you tell which is the true one, back in the day there were very many people who claimed to be prophets.

True, anyone can claim that, but it cannot be proven... Some faith is necessary to believe that, but it can be a reason-based faith, if there is a good reason to believe it.

There you are then, there is no reason for me to believe it,if people want to take a leap of faith its there choice I guess.

 

[CG Didymus]

Yes, the older organized religions like Judaism and Christianity will eventually fade out to insignificance, after everyone recognizes Baha’u’llah.

Isaiah 11:6-9 “The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.”

What this means to a Baha’i is that In the future diverse religions and races will become comrades, friends and companions. The contentions of races, the differences of religions, and the barriers between nations will be completely removed, and all will attain perfect union and reconciliation.

Eventually, there will be only one religion, the religion of God.“for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea” means that everyone will believe in God. There will only be one religion, the religion of God.

No worries, Baha’is are not allowed to get involved in politics, except to vote. We cannot be in a member of any political party or run for office.

So everyone will believe in God and there will be only one religion. I assume that is the Baha'i Faith. So who's going to run the government, since Baha'is can't be involved in politics or to run for office?

 

[allright]

What would you expect people to do if a real God sent a real Messenger to earth?

This is a hypothetical question and it is mostly directed at nonbelievers.
Believers can answer this too if they want to.

I have a specific reason for asking this but I want to leave it open-ended for now.

We already know

Crucify him and chose a murder instead

 

[Trailblazer]

So everyone will believe in God and there will be only one religion. I assume that is the Baha'i Faith. So who's going to run the government, since Baha'is can't be involved in politics or to run for office?

I did not say it would be called the Baha'i Faith. By the time this happens, another messenger might have appeared with another religion.
Governments will continue to run themselves, but in the future they will pattern themselves on the Baha'i model.
I do not know a lot about this but it is probably explained in The World Order of Bahá’u’lláh.