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Featured What would Jesus do, a question for Republican's

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Lyndon, Sep 28, 2017.

  1. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    Its not about owing anyone anything. It's about doing the right thing. And that is to care for our sick regardless of how much money they have. We have the right to a free education here. Health care is just as important. I would much rather see my tax dollars going toward a worthy cause such as this than many of the other things it goes to.
     
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  2. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    Good point. I remember two of His disciples when asked alms from a crippled man said "silver and gold I have none but what I have I give freely." The cripple was healed and freely.
     
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  3. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    It this the thread where we ***** and moan about the hypocrisy of approximately half the American nation while professing to honor Jesus by showing no compassion towards those who are hypocrites, or is that another thread? I keep getting threads confused these days. They're beginning to all look the same.
     
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  4. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    It didn't. Jesus was an independent. :D
     
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  5. David1967

    David1967 Well-Known Member
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    I knew an old gentleman (passed away years ago) hardcore republican (his words, not mine). Was totally against social security. Yet happily received his monthly check and Medicare when eligible. I imagine a universal health care system for all in the USA would be a similar story. If that is we ever follow the example of other civilized nations.
     
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  6. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    You can show compassion and help people by helping them to help themselves. Forcing people to depend on a welfare state does not have a positive outcome in the long term future. In fact that is a bleak future with Orwellian tones.

    You see it as not compassionate because we refuse to hand over loads of cash to fix the problem short term. Which it would. We are thinking long term success here, where hopefully the majority of people are standing on their own 2 feet and does not need help.

    Morgan Freeman agrees here as he calls bulls**t on Don Lemon for saying that black folk are not able to pull themself up by their bootstraps.


    There will always be some amount of poverty and a small amount we cam handle. But not only can we not realistically afford an ever increasing welfare state, we don't want that welfare state grow in power to begin with.
     
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  7. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    Gee, you make it sound almost as if universal health care -- which is present in one form or another in every industrialized democracy on the planet -- is the road to Stalin's gulags. Have you any reason to believe that?
     
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  8. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Because it could come at the cost of freedom. If the government pays for all healthcare they also control your health. They decide who lives or dies. Case in point, and I warn you before hand this is heartbreaking. Charlie Gard case - Wikipedia.

    This is where we do not want to go.
     
  9. soulsurvivor

    soulsurvivor Active Member
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    I think, Republicans firmly believe that if Jesus ever questions them about their attitude to the poor, they will just say that they are 'pro-life', anti-abortion and that will give them a free ticket to heaven. Not helping the poor will be automatically forgiven, and so helping the poor is unimportant if not unnecessary.
     
  10. soulsurvivor

    soulsurvivor Active Member
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    Are you saying there is no freedom in Canada, UK, Germany? BTW, if you have enough money you can always get private healthcare whether there is government healthcare or not. So all you are saying is that the poor do not deserve free healthcare.
     
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  11. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Obviously that is not the case or else Charlie Gard case - Wikipedia might not have died because the U.K. denied him experimental treatment that might have saved him.

    Again poverty is the issue that needs tackling. Not giving up our freedoms for healthcare or food or whatever. We focus all of our attention on helping the majority of the poverty stricken communities break the chains of poverty, we will see a large drop in problems associated with it. To do this wihtout giving up freedoms is hard, but it can be done.
     
  12. soulsurvivor

    soulsurvivor Active Member
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    That is a problem with the UK court system. In any other country, you can fly anywhere you want and get your own treatment. There is no chance of our SCOTUS making such a ruling. Also universal care in the US will not mean private hospitals will be shut down, so you don't even have to fly anywhere. You just need money.
     
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  13. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise
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    No it didn't. From the article you posted it went into detail concerning the hurdles when facing experimental treatment in both the US and UK. Saying the US would have had to go through a similar screening process, thereby delaying the treatment because it's not covered by insurance and both expensive and experimental. Medical experts around the world condemned the efforts to raise money by others who intervened because of the false hope and the extra delays it had on the treatment. Experts in both countries agreed that the chances the very painful treatment succeeding were very small.
    This is not an issue of the NHS this happened because the treatment was very experimental with an unsure outcome. Experts did not think it was worth the pain the treatment would have caused. The US system does the same in such circumstances, weigh the benefits against possible results.
    Social media had a hissy fit because parents disagreed with expert advice. Understandable sure, but the issue was blown out of proportion by emotional layman idiots.

    Now if that information which I got from said article is wrong, please feel free to correct me.
     
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  14. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    That may be the case. I am not an expert on Canadian, Australian, or UK healthcare. But I know the Candian one is not as great as U.S. citizens think it is, because I have Canadian friends who have said as much. My one friend in Australia loves his healtcare there so maybe the Australians are on to something. But then again your not allowed to own firearms there either, so the freedom restriction is already in place, which is no bueno for me.
     
  15. soulsurvivor

    soulsurvivor Active Member
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    Nobody is asking you to take government healthcare or Obamacare for yourself. It is only for the poor and those who can not afford premiums.

    Your basic position is that the poor do not deserve free or subsidized healthcare and you don't want to pay for it - very unChristian, I would say.
     
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  16. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Does not matter. I am not willing to give up myfreedom to the government for them to decide, and neither is the majority of Americans. If we can figure out a way to do it without giving up the freedom, sure, but thats just not possible becauae currently we cant afford it.
     
  17. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    We all pay into Social Security, it wasn't like he was getting it for "free" anyways. Would probably better for us all if government programs were based through the tax system.
     
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  18. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise
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    No one's freedom was got rid of. According to the same article the US would have done the exact same thing with young Charlie. Unless I'm missing something?
     
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  19. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Actually yes they do. Because I did not sign up for Obamacare because I already had insurance I pay for. I still got charged $250 tax for not signing up for Obamacare. Obamacare is a racketeering scheme.

    I want poverty stricken people to break the chains of poverty so that they don't need my help. That is the Christian thing to do. Not establish a welfare state, so that you can keep your thumb on people as you wish to do.
     
  20. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Nope, Money talks and bulls**t walks here. If you got the cash you can have the procedure done no matter how experimental. Plus we have non-profits like St.Jude hospital for children that don't charge, who knows maybe they could have helped Charlie. Its a slim chance I admit, but I want the freedom to make that decision on my terms, not some faceless govt organization.
     
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